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Cayin iDAP-6 - versatile new desktop transport

Discussion in 'Dedicated Source Components' started by project86, Oct 1, 2017.
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  1. burdie
    For the pop sound from changing dsd to pcm, will it be design problem or software based? If i remembered correctly, AK4497 required additional circuit / relay to mute the pop sound, and jriver do it on software side, when it senses the changing of format, it will apply 'software mute'..
  2. Andykong
    Great, so we identified the root of the problem, I'll see if there is anything we can do, this is software related, so there is a good chance that we can resolve this.
    Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor page on Head-Fi.
  3. Andykong
    There are more then one approach to resolve this. Cayin tends to use mute problem in our player product, other brands might have a DSP before feeding the bitstream to DAC chip and that can work as a filter for the pop sound.
    Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor page on Head-Fi.
  4. Mr.Jones
    I send my unit back to seller, why ?
    It is network player and must work properly with computer network !!!

    But now it is not possible ( I don't have DHCP server running ) I don't allow in my network that work any device w/o my control (specially if that came from China) - you have no choice to setup IP-address, mask, gate IP etc. in settings menu, and your MAC address is randomly. You don't want pay fee for manufacturer MAC ID - ok no problem but give end user possibility to edit MAC in settings, what can do users which as I don't have DHCP server runing on my router ??
  5. piorasz
    It still does not work and gapless will not work on the DLNA protocol (even with the settings from the photo above). No tricks can help here and there is nothing to cheat. Gapless in iDAP-6 works only via SMB (Samba) or external drives. This does not give you remote control. Please fix this problem.
  6. piorasz
    I am also wondering whether to return iDAP-6. It follows from what @Andykong writes that the MAC adress and gapless problem by DLNA will not be solved.
  7. burdie
    Today perform further test on IDAP-6 especially on DLNA and SACD iso compatibility
    On DLNA, finally get minidlna and upnp app from asustor to run on my NAS, licensed bubbleupnp pick up both media server but (i) need to disable DLNA on Cayin (which previous power on enabled and apps able to find Cayin IDAP-6) and ON it again for Bubbleupnp to discover it (i) no support of cue file and sacd iso (ii) pushing pcm up to 24/176 is fast, but on DSF is very slow, need to wait at least few seconds for IDAP-6 to receive data (i am using wired network on gigabit)
    Enable foobar2000 media streaming and rendering plug in on my windows based PC, bubbleunpn able to see the tracks from cue file and sacd iso. But pushing the audio file to IDAP-6 like taking forever, the screen on 'now playing' changed but receiving nothing, after few press on bubbleunpn play button, suddenly IDAP-6 REBOOT itself. After this, changing back to other streaming media also unable to play
    Then i proceed to normal listening which getting the audio file from LAN, at which I have 2 copies of shared music library (same contents) on NAS and my windows PC.
    accessing both shared library still required entering of username and password. I followed what @PitBul34 advises on NAS
    First press Enter on virtual keypad and next press OK and IDAP-6 will save your login for this session.
    simply don't work on me, next reboot it will forgot login info and required new key in
    This time i segregate my SACD iso collection into DST and DSD, most of my collection are DST but DSD collection still took a while to test on potential "hiss". But this time the outcome surprise me. Previously I reported that the hybrid iso (2ch and 5ch) will produced hiss, but this time no hiss at all (Pink Floyd - Dark Side Of The Moon 2003 EMI Records Ltd.3.87gb). IDAP-6 will show say 10 tracks but on other labtop i used foobar2000 to access same iso will show 10 2ch tracks and 20 5ch tracks. Almost all SACD iso no hiss and some of them are large in size (more than 2gb and closed to 3gb), except one SACD iso, Babyface - The day, which is about 2.45gb, i think this is the 4th or 5th album i tested in running. After finished the DSD iso file on my NAS, i then go to the shared library on my windows PC to access the same album thinking that i may have a bad copy on NAS. But surprisingly the same album on my windows PC played without hiss. I then go back to NAS drive to play the same Babyface album, i was shocked that this time it doesn't produced hiss. I think it may be related to the extracting/decoding part of IDAP-6, it may be not that stable yet.
    During the test I accidentally included a folder of 3 DST iso album, IDAP-6 of course failed to play it but I have to wait for it to failed read at least 2 1/2 album, about 30 over tracks for it to completely stop reading, it continue on few album as i enable the folder option. But now you must be noticed something not right, it stop at 2 1/2 album, which mean it doesn't finished all 3 album before it stop reading.
    Failing to read DST format or produce hiss on certain sacd iso is annoying but not end of the road, we can always covert it to dsf track and keep the iso somewhere, and reading individual dsf file may be will not cause hiss problem (i still think it has something to do with extracting larger iso file causing low memory, overflow etc)
  8. piorasz
    @burdie good job.
    Finally, a reliable test result of the device. I agree 100% about what you wrote.. Personally, I am very disappointed with the purchase of iDAP-6. As long as the errors are not repaired, the device is a toy for children under 6 years.
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  9. burdie
    My purpose to have several tests is to help to improve IDAP-6, should there is any problem I noticed. I would not say it is a toy for children under 6 years old, but I will say the improvement on firmware is still at early stage, right now is only version 1.1. Give them some time to improve it, each firmware revision will bring it towards the so called 'perfect' device.
    I have seen some other DAC that costing 10x of IDAP-6 and this famous company just update firmware once, but the pop sound each time CD transport is playing a track is not eliminated at all, probably 3 years now, since the last firmware update, there is no further firmware to settle the pop issue, pop sound normally happen in PCM/DSSD switching, but this is CD transport playing redbook PCM at 16/44 using spdif to that expensive DAC, and yet still pop.
    Just enjoy the SQ improvement that IDAP-6 bring to you, not many people have NAS device. Most people will just hook external usb hdd to the streamer and start to enjoy the music. For an audiophile, you looking for SQ improvement, or device perfection?
  10. Andykong
    A very solid update on the networking features of iDAP-6, I'll try to recap the major issues in simple point form so that I can follow up them promptly:
    1. iDAP-6 can only remember NAS login for the current session, every reboot will require a new login.
    2. No Cue and SACD-ISO suport under minidlna, Bubbleupnp can retrieve the cue and SACD ISO but cannot play them correctly (need to investigate the Bubbleupnp support on these features
    3. DSF over DLNA takes too long to react
    4. System unstable, auto reboot under certain operation sequence with foobar2000 media streaming and rendering plugin
    5. require interrupt feature to unsupported format such as DST encoded files.
    6. Random hissing with certain SACD-ISO file, require further investigation on SACD-ISO compatibility
    We have noted item 1 and has started to looking into it, we put I2S DSD compatibility as priority item so our v1.1 firmware update was focused on that primarily. I hope we can provide a solution for that in the future.

    If my problem list looks OK with you, I shall ask our engineer to test the items in our setup. We need to replicate the problem in our lab before we move onto debugging or system enhancement. We'll do our best to handle them promptly.
    Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor page on Head-Fi.
  11. Andykong
    We are sorry that iDAP-6 does not meet your needs, we didn't notice the MAC address problem until recently. The new v1.1 firmware enabled us to review the MAC and IP and when piorasz raised the issue on Sunday (or Sat in US), I have alert our engineer to look into this problem immediately.

    I apology for all the inconvenience caused because of our product, and I hope you can find a new network player to continue your journey to High Fidelity.
    Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor page on Head-Fi.
  12. Andykong
    Thanks you very much for your positive comment. Cayin will try our best to enhance our product continuously. We can't promise perfection but we can promise diligent and devotion to customer satisfaction. With respect, we are looking forward to solve as many problems as possible within our reach.
    Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor page on Head-Fi.
  13. burdie
    2. No Cue and SACD-ISO suport under minidlna, Bubbleupnp can retrieve the cue and SACD ISO but cannot play them correctly (need to investigate the Bubbleupnp support on these features
    SACD-iso and cue file I think generally not supported by many media streaming server, except foobar2000 and Jriver, as these 2 windows based program will using sacd-iso plugin to read the content then extract individual dff/dsf then push them to DLNA renderer, which control by app like bubbleupnp.
    In general, bubbleupnp still need those DLNA media server to read and extract the SACD-iso / CD image file, so far only foobar2000 and Jriver equipped with these feature/plugin to read and extract sacd-iso and CD image. minimserver once plan to support SACD-iso but so far no update on it.
  14. burdie
    To be honest, i can live without those extra DLNA feature, I enjoy the improvement of SQ more than any other thing, and SQ improvement would be the basic thing an audiophile sought after
  15. Mr.Jones
    If you can transfer to your R&D department :
    In service menu end user will need 'network setup' option where we can choose :

    1. WiFi network card ON/OFF
    1.1 DHCP service ON/OFF
    1.1.1 Interface manualy setup : IP address, subnet mask, gateway IP, DNS address
    2. RJ45 network card ON/OFF
    2.1 DHCP service ON/OFF
    2.1.1 Interface manualy setup : IP address, subnet mask, gateway IP, DNS address
    3. If you don't have manufacturer MAC addresses for your units, put in menu edit for network card MAC address.
    4. Network status info : display all network cards status (ON/OFF), IP addresses ...
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2017
    piorasz likes this.
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