[riceboy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 909 /img/forum/go_quote.gif the source is an extremely important component that many overlook... i am a source first person, but needing an amp i'd rather go with a home amp because it will sound better than a portable. i've yet to hear a portable to make me think otherwise and i've heard most of them, though not all.

I totally agree. I overlooked it as well. Now that I'm happy with my source, I've been trying different amp to find out what would go best with my cans.

 

[majkel]

Driving large in size low impedance headphones is actually also a problem for portable amps, as 909's mentioned. This is just because of small capacitances in power supply section of the amplifier. Low impedance means high current demand, and there is no source to produce a sufficient current pulse when the capacitors are to small. The battery itself has still got too high internal impedance to keep up smooth bass pulses flowing. So, portable amps are suitable for non-demanding medium impedance headphones, or any other efficient ones, like i.e. IEMs.

 

[EFN]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhd812 /img/forum/go_quote.gif i would be more worried about the Source feeding the amps first...

101% TRUE. Amping lossy files is a no no for me nowadays. The rule garbage in garbage out is for real.

 

[DJShadow]

The Hornet retails for $370 and the Gilmore Lite for $300. Gilmore Lite is superior to the Hornet in terms of being less restrictive in portraying the signal from the source. I know there are some people that think the Hornet is about 80-90% of the GL but I think its a lot less than that, substantial enough to make me prefer it over the Hornet every time - provided you have a good source. Therefore, based on my limited experience, I will say no to the OP's notion.

 

[justin w.]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Driving large in size low impedance headphones is actually also a problem for portable amps, as 909's mentioned. This is just because of small capacitances in power supply section of the amplifier. Low impedance means high current demand, and there is no source to produce a sufficient current pulse when the capacitors are to small. The battery itself has still got too high internal impedance to keep up smooth bass pulses flowing. So, portable amps are suitable for non-demanding medium impedance headphones, or any other efficient ones, like i.e. IEMs.

Majkel,

It's the opamp or buffer that determines the maximum current into the headphones, not capacitors. Its good to have some capacitance close to the op-amp but typically a small value. The impedance of the battery is much too low for that to be the limiting factor, a fraction of an ohm with AA or Li-Ion batteries (9V are a bit higher). A capacitor won't make it lower by any meaningful amount, when the amp is limited to 25 to 250mA depending on opamp. Big capacitors in battery powered amps are either there for eye candy or to filter noise from a DC adapter that might also be a power option.

 

[slwiser]

Depends on the home amp..my Xin Reference is very good though and I would pit it against many a home amp. But as some have already say a top home amp will have the potential for a better sound. You just have to hear them for yourself. And a top home amp that best the Xin Reference would cost far more.

 

[majkel]

@justin_W,
When I was experimenting with my DIY portable amp, I had AD8397 on channels and 1A efficient ground channel. Listening to HD595 I was adding more and more 1000uF cpacitors in parallel to find the border behind which I don't hear the difference on bass. It was around 8000uF total. The battery was 8.4V 260mAh PROFITEXX which is capable of more than 1A continuously. So, here you are right, there are some portable amps good at this point.

Regarding lossy formats, most mp3 players' hardware doesn't actually gain the level of SQ provided by mp3 320kb/s. I tested many players at this point and this is unfortunately true. Good source means good CD player or another digital source + good DAC. If it's a sound card then yes, it's better to avoid lossy formats but on the other hand, who would easily distinguish ogg Vorbis Q8 from lossless? For portable purposes there is no need to go lossy if you can occupy 1/3 of the memory space in your player needed for FLAC/ALAC.

 

[slwiser]

^It is all in the implementation and design. Dr. Xin's Reference betas has given those who have had them many difference cap sizes. He finalized on the 22,000 uf unit. I have one and it is magic to my ears.

I heard Justins new amp at the Washington DC meet. I was also shocked at its sound. It did not have the space for large caps but it is one that would have loved to be able to sit down and compare with my Reference. So either large cap or small they both can produce a large sound.

 

[kontai69]

I recently did an A/B comparison between my Total AirHead portable and my GS-1 (with DACT stepped attenuator) home amp. I would listen to a portion of a song many times over to get it into my memory. I would then rapidly switch amps and relisten and mentally note any differences I hear.

To my surprise, the sound was quite close to my ears. It took hours of A/B comparison to hear the subtle differences. The GS-1 had slightly more powerful bass, slightly greater treble extension and sense of space. The GS-1 also seems to have a slightly more forward midrange. The differences certainly was not "night and day." I probably would not be able to tell the difference in a blind test.

I had both amps fed with the same source (Music Hall CD25.2 (digital out)-> Ack! dAck! v2.0 DAC). That's a $600 "transport" and a $800 DAC, so I think it is more than adequate to do a valid comparison. I hooked the TAH to the loop out of the GS-1 via a Wal-Mart mini-to-RCA cable. Most importantly, I level matched the outputs of the amps to the nearest decibel with a Rat Shack SPL meter before doing the comparisons, something I bet most people don't bother doing.

I often wonder how many opinions you read on Head-Fi describing differences between amps was at least partially attributed to listening at differing volume settings (even slightly) and not using the same source/music on both amps when doing the comparison? I bet quite a few.

 

[judas391]

what cans did you use?

 

[bhd812]

Quote:

Originally Posted by slwiser /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^It is all in the implementation and design. Dr. Xin's Reference betas has given those who have had them many difference cap sizes. He finalized on the 22,000 uf unit. I have one and it is magic to my ears.

ever hear the saying..
"if your engine puts out 1200 horse power but your trans will only allow 200 to the wheels, then whats the point of the extra 1000 horse power?"

Xin is known for going over the top with designs where some can look at the and say "useless!" and some "nice..". i think its cool cause it makes his product different..and thats great for us being more choices we all have.

"And a top home amp that best the Xin Reference would cost far more."
whats far more to you? what headphones and what sources being used?
i might be up for a challenge....i love finding new "toys" on the cheap that sound that good...

 

[pearljam5000]

This is very bad news.......for you.
but it is great for poor people like me, that cannot afford a GS-1 at the moment

Quote:

Originally Posted by kontai69 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I recently did an A/B comparison between my Total AirHead portable and my GS-1 (with DACT stepped attenuator) home amp. I would listen to a portion of a song many times over to get it into my memory. I would then rapidly switch amps and relisten and mentally note any differences I hear. To my surprise, the sound was quite close to my ears. It took hours of A/B comparison to hear the subtle differences. The GS-1 had slightly more powerful bass, slightly greater treble extension and sense of space. The GS-1 also seems to have a slightly more forward midrange. The differences certainly was not "night and day." I probably would not be able to tell the difference in a blind test. I had both amps fed with the same source (Music Hall CD25.2 (digital out)-> Ack! dAck! v2.0 DAC). That's a $600 "transport" and a $800 DAC, so I think it is more than adequate to do a valid comparison. I hooked the TAH to the loop out of the GS-1 via a Wal-Mart mini-to-RCA cable. Most importantly, I level matched the outputs of the amps to the nearest decibel with a Rat Shack SPL meter before doing the comparisons, something I bet most people don't bother doing. I often wonder how many opinions you read on Head-Fi describing differences between amps was at least partially attributed to listening at differing volume settings (even slightly) and not using the same source/music on both amps when doing the comparison? I bet quite a few.

 

[Memphis]

I think a desktop amp would at the same price level out preform a portable jsut because the power supply will be more robust.

 

[slwiser]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhd812 /img/forum/go_quote.gif ever hear the saying.. "if your engine puts out 1200 horse power but your trans will only allow 200 to the wheels, then whats the point of the extra 1000 horse power?"

Makes a lot of sense for a car trans.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhd812 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Xin is known for going over the top with designs where some can look at the and say "useless!" and some "nice..". i think its cool cause it makes his product different..and thats great for us being more choices we all have.

I also enjoy the choices we have now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhd812 /img/forum/go_quote.gif "And a top home amp that best the Xin Reference would cost far more." whats far more to you? what headphones and what sources being used?

Top for me is near 1000$ US for you it may be 10,000$.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhd812 /img/forum/go_quote.gif i might be up for a challenge....i love finding new "toys" on the cheap that sound that good...

I think you will be surprised how Justin's new amp will sound as well as the Reference. Maybe not as good as the hype but very good.

 

[Dept_of_Alchemy]

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=250148