[White Lotus]

Bigshot, not a fan of dual/stereo subs?

 

[bigshot]

I'm happy with my 12 inch Sunfire... and it cost WAY too much to buy two. I have to dial it down to get it to stop rattling the walls, and where I've put it, it fills the room evenly. If I had a bigger room, I might need two, but my listening room is about 18 wide by 28 long. Also, my mains have really good 12 inch woofers in them and I've done a soft roll off with them, so they carry everything down to the next to the last octave or so.
 
To be honest, I'm not real big on BOOM BOOM bass. I judge bass by the accuracy of the way a plucked acoustic bass sounds. I want accuracy. Dual subs are really for sci fi movies where you want to bother the neighbors. (I bother them with my nice flat mids!)

 

[k3oxkjo]

   
You didn't get your channels balanced if that's the case. 5:1 isn't about stuff coming at you from all sides, it's about creating a coherent sound field with enveloping phase all around you. It's very hard to balance and EQ all the channels and it takes good speakers and a decent sized room, but the improvement is great, even on two channel stereo recordings.
 
I have heard Sony's no-holds-barred system using 5 identical pieces of their flagship speaker a few times over the years. It sounded good, but when they turned off the rears, it was more concert-like to me. But maybe Sony doesn't know what they are doing 

  . And, of course, it IS about "stuff coming at you from all sides" when the recording was gimmicked to take advantage of the ability to do this. Which, in my view, is where surround is most defensible. I guess there is something to be said for "Dark Side of the Moon" in surround if you are into that sort of thing...
 
The problem is, most 5:1 and 7:1 systems are designed for movies, not music. Which is a shame, because a system that is tweaked to work well with music sounds better for movies too. But any good system starts with really good speakers up front... mains, center and sub. The rears are less important because they are basically filling in phase, not presenting instruments directly. The soundstage is up front, but there definitely is sound coming at you from the rear at a concert hall. That's what gives you the feeling for the hall itself.
 
But that "hall sound" is captured there in 2 channel recordings and is propagated from where the sound is perceived in the concert hall. A concert hall where the ambient sound was perceived as coming from behind you would be considered fatally flawed and defective. The rears, in my experience, tend to pull the sound out into the room, a most unrealistic perspective compaired to live music, especially considering how close people sit (almost always under 20 ft.) in a typical listening room.
 
People who think multichannel sound doesn't sound good have never heard good multichannel sound.
 
See response to paragraph 1. And I have heard many, many other "high end" surround systems and even the surround listening studios at the TV network I work for. Just not necessary (or in my view, desirable) for standard non-gimmicked music.

 
I heard Sony's no-holds-barred system using 5 identical pieces of their flagship speaker a few times over the years. It sounds good, but better when they turn off the

 

[bigshot]

I wouldn't judge based on an installation at a trade show playing a recording goosed to have direct sound all around. My receiver allows me to toggle between 2 channel and 5:1. The improvement is like night and day, especially with stereo recordings. By the way, Yamaha is the leader in great sounding 5:1 DSPs.
 
Well... when you get a chance to hear it someday then you'll know!

 

[k3oxkjo]

  Can you explain how you "experimented" please ? What equipment & format ( sacd ? dvd-a ? ) were you using ?

 
5 channel SACD's from a Lexicon player, front speakers were Magnepan MG 3.7 driven by a Bryston 4BST amplifier, center channel was stacked ProAc Response 1 driven by a Bryston 3BST, rears were Acoustic Energy AE-1 driven by a Yamaha B-1 amplifier.
 
Kevin

 

[k3oxkjo]

  I wouldn't judge based on an installation at a trade show playing a recording goosed to have direct sound all around. My receiver allows me to toggle between 2 channel and 5:1. The improvement is like night and day, especially with stereo recordings. By the way, Yamaha is the leader in great sounding 5:1 DSPs.
 
Well... when you get a chance to hear it someday then you'll know!

 
Sorry, squire, but I have heard more stereo and surround stuff than you've had hot meals. But thanks for playing our game...

 

[bigshot]

   
5 channel SACD's from a Lexicon player, front speakers were Magnepan MG 3.7 driven by a Bryston 4BST amplifier, center channel was stacked ProAc Response 1 driven by a Bryston 3BST, rears were Acoustic Energy AE-1 driven by a Yamaha B-1 amplifier.

 
Ha ha! You gotta be joking! Now I KNOW you don't work in television!

 

[k3oxkjo]

   
Ha ha! You gotta be joking! Now I KNOW you don't work in television!

 
Only been in Broadcasting for 40 years, so I am a newbie, I will admit.

 

[bigshot]

You list overpriced equipment just like the teenagers around here! Good to keep young!

 

[proton007]

  I'm happy with my 12 inch Sunfire... and it cost WAY too much to buy two. I have to dial it down to get it to stop rattling the walls, and where I've put it, it fills the room evenly. If I had a bigger room, I might need two, but my listening room is about 18 wide by 28 long. Also, my mains have really good 12 inch woofers in them and I've done a soft roll off with them, so they carry everything down to the next to the last octave or so.
 
To be honest, I'm not real big on BOOM BOOM bass. I judge bass by the accuracy of the way a plucked acoustic bass sounds. I want accuracy. Dual subs are really for sci fi movies where you want to bother the neighbors. (I bother them with my nice flat mids!)

 
You know, where I stay, they have a 2 bedroom apartment in that size.

 

[bigshot]

This is the room. There's a ten foot wide screen that drops down behind the beam up front for the projection system.
 

 

[k3oxkjo]

  You list overpriced equipment just like the teenagers around here! Good to keep young!

 
No, I keep young in other ways

 . I am just someone who is knowledgeable about audio and has good enough taste to recognize good equipment when I hear it. Not everyone is that knowledgeable, interested or perceptive when it comes to music and sound, I understand that. But I don't call myself a bigshot, either. I am just a poor, country Broadcast Engineer at heart.

 

[bigshot]

   
I am just someone who is knowledgeable about audio and has good enough taste to recognize good equipment when I hear it.

 
Oh heck! You don't need to hear it. Why be different than everyone else who makes lists like that? All you need to do is look at the price tag and judge by that!

 

[White Lotus]

  This is the room. There's a ten foot wide screen that drops down behind the beam up front for the projection system.
 

 
Wonderful!

 

[proton007]

  This is the room. There's a ten foot wide screen that drops down behind the beam up front for the projection system.
 

 
Thats a good looking room for sure. The wood helps a lot with sound dampening. Its almost impossible to setup a good system in a room made with brick walls, the sound reflects all over the room.