[Sennheiser]

Hello Head-Fi!

We’ve always been impressed with the lengths this community goes to educate each other about hi-fi gear. Your impressions, reviews, and insights are necessary to complete the stories we begin with our web pages, spec sheets and product videos. Today, hi-fi moves faster than ever, so we’re opening up a more direct connection to some of the minds that make the audio magic at Sennheiser happen, and it is called Beyond The Curve.

​

What is Beyond The Curve?

Beyond The Curve (BTC) will be a recurring video series in which our experts (engineers, acousticians, etc) will answer questions from the hi-fi community clusters (such as Head-Fi, YouTube, Reddit, etc). Think of it as techies talking tech, but focused on hi-fi.

BTC will be a great resource for getting truly technical insight directly from the source. And because these sessions occur via video, we can offer visual demonstrations and explanations that would be otherwise difficult to replicate. Lastly, we’ll create an archive of BTC sessions for review, so if you miss one, you can still watch them on demand.

Why “Beyond The Curve”? Well, the mojo of the Sennheiser sound comes from a place that cannot always be measured on a frequency response plot or technical document. Like your own enthusiasm for audio, our pursuit of sound cannot be quantified. That said, we're filming our first BTC this month, and want to integrate some of your questions into the process. Each episode will have a central theme, exploring topics like transducer tuning, research & development, testing, simulation, and more. To submit a question, simply respond to the thread.

We look forward to going Beyond the Curve with you -- ask away!

 

[Philimon]

Today, hi-fi moves faster than ever,

Why is it so difficult for you to produce a headphone that is demonstrably better than HD600 and HD650? So then has audio tech not actually evolved that much?

 

[Robinjwa]

Is it possible to measure the ‘technical’ attributes of a headphone such as dynamics, width, depth, or are these things (currently) unquantifiable during the design process?

 

[Ohno Schiitizen]

First, get rid of Axel Grell's weird tuning .... go back to basics ....

 

[ericpalonen]

Why is it so difficult for you to produce a headphone that is demonstrably better than HD600 and HD650? So then has audio tech not actually evolved that much?

"Better" for you is subjective, but "better" in terms of a measurement is quantifiable if there's an objective. Need you to be more specific.

Is it possible to measure the ‘technical’ attributes of a headphone such as dynamics, width, depth, or are these things (currently) unquantifiable during the design process?

Awesome question! This is a topic we will cover.

 

[Sharppain]

Does Senn will show real evolvement by entering planar tech? In iems the new IEs are welcomed but the 660S2 looks like pure marketing skimming launch.

 

[ericpalonen]

Does Senn will show real evolvement by entering planar tech? In iems the new IEs are welcomed but the 660S2 looks like pure marketing skimming launch.

We typically don't comment on speculation regarding products/tech but we'll likely discuss dynamic vs other technologies. The HD 660S2 was tuned and developed based on feedback from the hi-fi community regarding the 600 series, so yeah, that is technically what marketing is-- the understanding of a market.

 

[chezzer]

It seems that Sennheiser don't try to conform to what is considered by some the holy grail of headphone listening the Harman curve, which by the way I'm grateful for as I pay no attention to it myself as I feel music and sound has too many variables, do you think this current crop of top reviewers on youtube are hurting business with their constant referencing to this target without giving some headphones a fair crack of the whip, the HD820 being a perfect example which in my opinion is a sublime headphone for any genre of music but it's panned by these guys with the exception of @reeltime (only reviewer I watch now, entertaining and knowledgeable) who never mentions frequency graphs or measurements and loves the HD820, these guys also seem to love the Audeze LCD-XC which happens to be one of the worst headphones I've ever heard or maybe I'm just sensitive to shrill treble. Anyway there is a question in there somewhere.
Thanks

​

 

[Philimon]

"Better" for you is subjective, but "better" in terms of a measurement is quantifiable if there's an objective. Need you to be more specific.

Youre right.

Could you demonstrate one example of a headphone quantifiably better (in any matter) than 600 or 650?

 

[Mike F]

We typically don't comment on speculation regarding products/tech but we'll likely discuss dynamic vs other technologies. The HD 660S2 was tuned and developed based on feedback from the hi-fi community regarding the 600 series, so yeah, that is technically what marketing is-- the understanding of a market.

Would it be fair to suggest that the 600 and 650 will remain as long as sales are strong, but that the six series will continue to evolve with an S3 and, in time, S4 as sound preferences evolve and market feedback suggests the desire for a move or an opening in a certain direction, as has been the case with the introduction of the S2? I'm hoping the 'typically' was the operative word in your first sentence and that you might make an exception!

 

[Sharppain]

We typically don't comment on speculation regarding products/tech but we'll likely discuss dynamic vs other technologies. The HD 660S2 was tuned and developed based on feedback from the hi-fi community regarding the 600 series, so yeah, that is technically what marketing is-- the understanding of a market.

Waw, really!? Technically, Marketing is understanding the Market! Well, you either think I am a 'scientist' or you have big gaps in Marketing like edu&pract.
Understanding the market is important but just the start. Getting insights from in-depth interviews, researches, opinion leaders,... is important, but developing a product that meets expectations, pricing it fair, promoting it.. and surprising (in positive way) the customers are fully different matters.
According to me, you would have had far more success in launching a HD700s than chewing the 6-line. 'Humble' and straight, sorry!

 

[CaptainFantastic]

Is Sennheiser working (at any stage of development) on a new closed-back audiophile headphone?

 

[Sharppain]

It seems that Sennheiser don't try to conform to what is considered by some the holy grail of headphone listening the Harman curve, which by the way I'm grateful for as I pay no attention to it myself as I feel music and sound has too many variables, do you think this current crop of top reviewers on youtube are hurting business with their constant referencing to this target without giving some headphones a fair crack of the whip, the HD820 being a perfect example which in my opinion is a sublime headphone for any genre of music but it's panned by these guys with the exception of @reeltime (only reviewer I watch now, entertaining and knowledgeable) who never mentions frequency graphs or measurements and loves the HD820, these guys also seem to love the Audeze LCD-XC which happens to be one of the worst headphones I've ever heard or maybe I'm just sensitive to shrill treble. Anyway there is a question in there somewhere.
Thanks

​

I agree and disagree.
Sets like HD250 Linear, HD540 Reference, HD800(s), HD820 are milestones and breaking the boundaries of time, deviating from Harman curve. But cycling around 6line and adding a touch of flavour here and there is milking the cow.

 

[Koren]

can they show measurable, demonstrable measurement results that show that the 660s2 is technically better than the hd650?

 

[chezzer]

Waw, really!? Technically, Marketing is understanding the Market! Well, you either think I am a 'scientist' or you have big gaps in Marketing like edu&pract.
Understanding the market is important but just the start, getting insights from in-depth interviews, researches, opinion leaders,... is important, but developing a product that meets expectations, pricing it fair, promoting it.. and surprising (in positive way) the customers are fully different matters.
According to me, you would have had far more success in launching a HD700s than chewing the 6-line. 'Humble' and straight, sorry!

Yeah, this company sells millions of pairs of headphones and has gaps in marketing. Compared to the 6 series the HD700 was a failure so I think they should be grateful that you're not their marketing manager

Waw, really!? Technically, Marketing is understanding the Market! Well, you either think I am a 'scientist' or you have big gaps in Marketing like edu&pract.
Understanding the market is important but just the start, getting insights from in-depth interviews, researches, opinion leaders,... is important, but developing a product that meets expectations, pricing it fair, promoting it.. and surprising (in positive way) the customers are fully different matters.
According to me, you would have had far more success in launching a HD700s than chewing the 6-line. 'Humble' and straight, sorry!

I agree and disagree.
Sets like HD250 Linear, HD540 Reference, HD800(s), HD820 are milestones and breaking the boundaries of time, deviating from Harman curve. But cycling around 6line and adding a touch of flavour here and there is milking the cow.

Do you own them all then or are you just talking from frequency response graphs