[NymPHONOmaniac]

I'm not sure. I'm in communication with them to try and get to the bottom of it. It certainly sounds ludicrous to think they have 4 different drivers.

I mean, there's nothing wrong with using the same 'shell' and installing different drivers to be able to offer slightly different sound tunings. KZ does it all the time (ATE/ATR/ATE-S, ZS3E/ZS4, EDR1/EDR2, ZS6/ZS7, etc). But if KB Ear is gonna do that, at least give it a different model designation so people can identify what they're buying. Have a F1a, F1b, F1x, etc.

I am working on my F1 review, and I will be sharing the information/photos you found (if that's OK with you), as well as any new information I find out.

I contact them too....and they will send me another pair....will try do a little faster review of them....but i do not got any explaination, they just look surprise and say they will ask manufactory to ''find out the problem''.

Mine perhaps is a bellsing cause it have 32 257 write on it, not the B logo tough (do we really need more confusion lol).

 

[NymPHONOmaniac]

but if its this BA....well, its vented....how could the venting work in this type of full resin plastic housing that do not have any place for air to flow?

 

[1clearhead]

I'm not sure. I'm in communication with them to try and get to the bottom of it. It certainly sounds ludicrous to think they have 4 different drivers.

I mean, there's nothing wrong with using the same 'shell' and installing different drivers to be able to offer slightly different sound tunings. KZ does it all the time (ATE/ATR/ATE-S, ZS3E/ZS4, EDR1/EDR2, ZS6/ZS7, etc). But if KB Ear is gonna do that, at least give it a different model designation so people can identify what they're buying. Have a F1a, F1b, F1x, etc.

I am working on my F1 review, and I will be sharing the information/photos you found (if that's OK with you), as well as any new information I find out.

I'm working on my F1 review as well and hopefully I won't get anyone confused on the sound signature I'm referring to with the blind choices of BA's being tossed in the housing...

 

[jibberish]

I've got a few days now with the Semkarch SKC-CNT1, and have been burning it in overnight while not in use. I'm a big fan, I'm honestly surprised at how much I like them. I really haven't listened to any other of my IEMs or buds this week since they arrived. I'm liking the black filters more than the gold ones (which is surprising to me, given my normal choice of filters on other IEMs), the mids seem to be a bit more lush in addition to the epic bass.

I will note that the stock cable was terrible though. It has a coating with a rubbery feeling that was unpleasant, the ear hook guides were uncomfortable, and as I was trying to adjust the guide on the right channel that side just stopped functioning altogether. So it went into the trash, and I'm using a NiceHCK cable that has turned out to be a nice pairing.

Still, very happy with them overall, given the bargain price, and that they're great for long listening sessions.

 

[archdawg]

I've got a few days now with the Semkarch SKC-CNT1, and have been burning it in overnight while not in use. I'm a big fan, I'm honestly surprised at how much I like them. I really haven't listened to any other of my IEMs or buds this week since they arrived. I'm liking the black filters more than the gold ones (which is surprising to me, given my normal choice of filters on other IEMs), the mids seem to be a bit more lush in addition to the epic bass.

I will note that the stock cable was terrible though. It has a coating with a rubbery feeling that was unpleasant, the ear hook guides were uncomfortable, and as I was trying to adjust the guide on the right channel that side just stopped functioning altogether. So it went into the trash, and I'm using a NiceHCK cable that has turned out to be a nice pairing.

Still, very happy with them overall, given the bargain price, and that they're great for long listening sessions.

Since you have the KPE listed in your signature ... how do the Semkarch compare to the KPE (sub-)bass texture/speed/decay, details, clarity, soundstage, instrument separation and layering, ...)? TIA!

 

[BadReligionPunk]

Since you have the KPE listed in your signature ... how do the Semkarch compare to the KPE (sub-)bass texture/speed/decay, details, clarity, soundstage, instrument separation and layering, ...)? TIA!

+1

 

[jibberish]

Since you have the KPE listed in your signature ... how do the Semkarch compare to the KPE (sub-)bass texture/speed/decay, details, clarity, soundstage, instrument separation and layering, ...)? TIA!

I'll spend some time comparing them tomorrow morning and reply

 

[Slater]

I contact them too....and they will send me another pair....will try do a little faster review of them....but i do not got any explaination, they just look surprise and say they will ask manufactory to ''find out the problem''.

Mine perhaps is a bellsing cause it have 32 257 write on it, not the B logo tough (do we really need more confusion lol).

Well, technically 32257 is a Knowles number (ie RAB-32257), which everyone copies and clones. So Bellsing will have their version of a 32257 BA, Sonion has their version of a 32257 BA, Tehnz has their version of a 32257 BA, Acme and Widget Inc has their version of a 32257 BA, etc. There could be 20 different BA drivers from 20 different BA companies that all say 32257, because they were all originally reverse engineered and copied from the Knowles RAB-32257.

In theory, if every one were perfectly reverse engineered and manufactured in the exact same way using perfectly identical materials, then they should all sound similar to the Knowles RAB-32257. But that is usually not the case at all.

Personally, I think here's what happened (hypothetically). And unfortunately it is all too common in outsourced manufacturing:

1. A company contracts with a Chinese factory to make 1000 earphones. All they tell the factory is that the earphone must 1. come in 2 colors (black and amber), 2. be made of acrylic resin, 3. have a mmcx socket, 4. it must use a 32257 BA driver, and 5. they must be completed in 30 days.
2. The factory then sources the parts. But they cannot find a supplier that has 1 brand of 32257 driver in qty 1000 in the time requires. They are, however, able to quickly locate (250) Bellsing 32257, (400) generic 32257, (250) Tehnz 32257, and (100) Sonion 32257.
3. The factory makes and delivers the earphones within the 30 days, and gets paid.

Well, here's the problem - the original factory contract bid. Instead of saying "it must use a 32257 BA driver", they should have said "it must use a BELLSING 32257 BA driver".

This happens much more than you know. For example, when HP contracts to make a laptop, they just say the motherboard "must have a 4.7 uf 250v capacitor". They don't care if they're generic brand, Panasonic, Rubycon, or whatever. In theory, ALL "4.7 uf 250v" capacitors should be exactly the same. But the reality is that each company's capacitor is just a tiny bit different. These minor differences are usually chalked up to margin of error (ie +/- 2% ratings), which is fine for capacitors.

But us audiophiles are arguably insane, and for us that is not acceptable. Most agree that a Knowles BA sounds slightly different (better) than a Bellsing BA or generic BA. It could be the treble is just a bit smoother on the Knowles, or the bass just a bit faster. And it's not in our heads either (at least not always) - Knowles DOES use the highest grade of polymer for their diaphragms, the highest purity of wire for the voice coil, a better grade of steel for the shell, the closest manufacturing tolerances, etc. That comes at a high price though, but it does have an impact on the end result.

The point is that, with regards to the multiple different types of KB Ear F1, that there WILL be minor differences between the drivers. What those differences are, and which driver is the 'best' of the bunch, is unknown at this point.

Personally, I would argue that the genuine Bellsing (with B logo) is the "best". Because Bellsing is actually the closest in technology and quality level to Knowles. So close, in fact, that it has been long rumored that Bellsing actually manufacturers some BAs for Knowles (yet stamps them Knowles). If this is indeed true, then the way I see it, if Bellsing is good enough for Knowles then they're certainly good enough for me.

Again (speculating only), the ones I would personally be suspect of the most would be the generic ones with NO known manufacturer (ie no logo or name or way to trace them at all). Those could have come from literally anyone or anywhere, using who knows what manufacturing processes. It may not even be made in an actual BA factory, but some shady setup. But that's true of most totally generic items.

Personally, I think the Tehnz will sound noticeably different than the others. After all, it is twice the physical size of the Knowles RAB-32257. The Bellsing is exactly the same size as the Knowles RAB-32257. You can't clone something and double the size and expect it to sound the same. If I reverse engineered and cloned a KZ 6mm micro driver, but I made my clone a 12mm driver, you can bet your last dollar that my 12mm driver will sound very different than the original KZ 6mm driver.

Anyways, I guess we'll find out more information as we hear back from KB Ear and more information starts rolling in from other reliable sources.

 

[NymPHONOmaniac]

Well, technically 32257 is a Knowles number (ie RAB-32257), which everyone copies and clones. So Bellsing will have their version of a 32257 BA, Sonion has their version of a 32257 BA, Tehnz has their version of a 32257 BA, Acme and Widget Inc has their version of a 32257 BA, etc. There could be 20 different BA drivers from 20 different BA companies that all say 32257, because they were all originally reverse engineered and copied from the Knowles RAB-32257.

In theory, if every one were perfectly reverse engineered and manufactured in the exact same way using perfectly identical materials, then they should all sound similar to the Knowles RAB-32257. But that is usually not the case at all.

Personally, I think here's what happened (hypothetically). And unfortunately it is all too common in outsourced manufacturing:

1. A company contracts with a Chinese factory to make 1000 earphones. All they tell the factory is that the earphone must 1. come in 2 colors (black and amber), 2. be made of acrylic resin, 3. have a mmcx socket, 4. it must use a 32257 BA driver, and 5. they must be completed in 30 days.
2. The factory then sources the parts. But they cannot find a supplier that has 1 brand of 32257 driver in qty 1000 in the time requires. They are, however, able to quickly locate 250 of Bellsing 32257, 400 generic 32257, 250 Tehnz 32257, and 100 Sonion.
3. The factory makes and delivers the earphones within the 30 days, and gets paid.

See the problem?

The issue was in the original factory contract bid. Instead of saying "it must use a 32257 BA driver", they needed to say "it must use a BELLSING 32257 BA driver".

This happens much more than you know. For example, when HP contracts to make a laptop, they just say the motherboard much have "4.7 uf 250v" capacitor. They don't care if they're generic, Panasonic, Rubycon, or whatever. In theory, ALL "4.7 uf 250v" capacitors should be exactly the same. But the reality is that each company's capacitor is just a tiny bit different. These minor differences are usually chalked up to margin of error (ie +/- 2% ratings), which is fine for capacitors.

But us audiophiles are arguably insane, and for us that is not acceptable. Most agree that a Knowles BA sounds slightly different (better) than a Bellsing BA or generic BA. It could be the treble is just a bit smoother on the Knowles, or the bass just a bit faster. And it's not in our heads either (at least not always) - Knowles DOES use the highest grade of polymer for their diaphragms, the highest purity of wire for the voice coil, a better grade of steel for the shell, the closest manufacturing tolerances, etc. That comes at a high price though, but it does have an impact on the end result.

The point is that, with regards to the multiple different types of KB Ear F1, that there WILL be minor differences between the drivers. What those differences are, and which driver is the 'best' of the bunch, is unknown at this point.

Personally, I would argue that the genuine Bellsing (with B logo) is the "best". Because Bellsing is actually the closest in technology and quality level to Knowles. So close, in fact, that it has been long rumored that Bellsing actually manufacturers some BAs for Knowles (yet stamps them Knowles). If this is indeed true, then they way I see it, if Bellsing is good enough for Knowles, then they're certainly good enough for me.

Again (speculating only), the ones I would personally be suspect of the most would be the generic ones with NO known manufacturer (ie no logo or name or way to trace them at all). Those could have come from literally anyone or anywhere, using who knows what manufacturing processes. It may not even be made in an actual BA factory, but some shady setup. But that's true of most totally generic items.

Personally, I think the Tehnz will sound noticeably different than the others. After all, it is twice the physical size of the Knowles RAB-32257. The Bellsing is exactly the same size as the Knowles RAB-32257. You can't clone something and double the size and expect it to sound the same. If I reverse engineered and cloned a KZ 6mm micro driver, but I made my clone a 12mm driver, you can bet your last dollar that my 12mm driver will sound very different than the original KZ 6mm driver.

Anyways, I guess we'll find out more information as we hear back from KB Ear and more information starts rolling in from other reliable sources.

Wow, your such a wise man bro...empirism tough are to next level with ya. And im pretty sure you are right.

So i got a cheap knock off bellsing BA, not surprising i did not like the sound if in first place I dont like Bellsing BA.

Did you have a vent under the ba??

 

[NymPHONOmaniac]

I've got a few days now with the Semkarch SKC-CNT1, and have been burning it in overnight while not in use. I'm a big fan, I'm honestly surprised at how much I like them. I really haven't listened to any other of my IEMs or buds this week since they arrived. I'm liking the black filters more than the gold ones (which is surprising to me, given my normal choice of filters on other IEMs), the mids seem to be a bit more lush in addition to the epic bass.

I will note that the stock cable was terrible though. It has a coating with a rubbery feeling that was unpleasant, the ear hook guides were uncomfortable, and as I was trying to adjust the guide on the right channel that side just stopped functioning altogether. So it went into the trash, and I'm using a NiceHCK cable that has turned out to be a nice pairing.

Still, very happy with them overall, given the bargain price, and that they're great for long listening sessions.

Man, these begin to be talk about on NBBA as well, i was like yeah but they are 100$...and then...What: 35$!!!!!!!!!!

This make them sure interesting but perhaps ephemeral too. gulp!

 

[Slater]

Wow, your such a wise man bro...empirism tough are to next level with ya. And im pretty sure you are right.

So i got a cheap knock off bellsing BA, not surprising i did not like the sound if in first place I dont like Bellsing BA.

Did you have a vent under the ba??

I thought when you posted a photo of yours, that you didn't even have the B logo? All Bellsing BAs have the B logo. If not, then it's some other brand.

As far as a vent, my F1 is not vented. And this is rather irritating because the RAB-32257 is a vented driver, and is specifically designed to be vented. If it was properly vented, it would have more low end.

There is a driver available from Knowles that it an unvented version of the RAB-32257; it is the RAB-32033. It is 100% the identical same BA driver as the 32257. The only difference is that the RAB-32033 has no vent and it is intended for fully sealed (ie resin) applications. If KB Ear never intended to add a vent to the F1, then THIS is the driver they should have used.

It would be like buying a car with a turbocharger engine, but you disconnect all of the pipes to the turbocharger and seal it off so it is unused. The car will still drive OK, but the engine will make less power because the engine was designed to be used with the turbocharger.

The RAB-32257 is the turbocharger version, and the RAB-32033 is the regular engine version.

It makes no sense why KB Ear would choose RAB-32257 and then not add a vent.

Anyways, if you want to see what the sound tuning is for vented vs unvented, here is the graphs.



Basically, because the RAB-32257 is sealed in the F1, then treat it exactly like the RAB-32033. The sound when unvented has more low end roll off, and there's also a sharp peak at 3k and a lower rise up to that point as well. You can see the whole area around 3k is shaped different when vented vs unvented.

That's not to say the F1 is a bad earphone or that KB Ear is a bad company (so far they listen to feedback and have been making improvements). I use mine primarily with the ES100 and it sounds great. I also found a secret mod, which I did to my F1. It sounds even better than stock now. I will be the 1st to reveal the mod in my review. For now it is secret

 

[SuperLuigi]

I've got a few days now with the Semkarch SKC-CNT1, and have been burning it in overnight while not in use. I'm a big fan, I'm honestly surprised at how much I like them. I really haven't listened to any other of my IEMs or buds this week since they arrived. I'm liking the black filters more than the gold ones (which is surprising to me, given my normal choice of filters on other IEMs), the mids seem to be a bit more lush in addition to the epic bass.

I will note that the stock cable was terrible though. It has a coating with a rubbery feeling that was unpleasant, the ear hook guides were uncomfortable, and as I was trying to adjust the guide on the right channel that side just stopped functioning altogether. So it went into the trash, and I'm using a NiceHCK cable that has turned out to be a nice pairing.

Still, very happy with them overall, given the bargain price, and that they're great for long listening sessions.

I'm only a few hours in but I agree with you so far. I'm quite impressed with everything I've thrown at them so far. They are just fun to listen to. Not audiophile/nutreal, but just damn fun so far.

The most I've ever paid for chi fi is 45 usd, so I haven't played with too much stuff in this headphones original price point, but this is easily better than any other chi fi IEM I've ever used. It's not even close.

I have to make specific comment about the fit and comfort. It's really impressive so far. It sits well, tips are good, and I had no problem wearing these for a few hours today as I worked. Totally forgot they were in my ears. That cable is something else though. Never used anything like it. Just feels very stiff. I'm gonna give it a few days of wear and see if it loosens up a bit. Maybe cable wire burn in does exist?

 

[LaughMoreDaily]

ZS10PRO is sure among best sub-50$ buy you can make right now IMO Only thing i find underwhelming is soundstage and highs (non) sparkle-decay. Timbre is okay, but still a little too grainy for my overly capricious taste.

Finally! Some constructive criticism.

 

[BadReligionPunk]

I'm only a few hours in but I agree with you so far. I'm quite impressed with everything I've thrown at them so far. They are just fun to listen to. Not audiophile/nutreal, but just damn fun so far.

The most I've ever paid for chi fi is 45 usd, so I haven't played with too much stuff in this headphones original price point, but this is easily better than any other chi fi IEM I've ever used. It's not even close.

I have to make specific comment about the fit and comfort. It's really impressive so far. It sits well, tips are good, and I had no problem wearing these for a few hours today as I worked. Totally forgot they were in my ears. That cable is something else though. Never used anything like it. Just feels very stiff. I'm gonna give it a few days of wear and see if it loosens up a bit. Maybe cable wire burn in does exist?

I actually liked the stock cable. It does ease up a bit after a while, but ultimately a balanced cable is where its at for this iem. The extra stage and added power really make this iem shine IMO. I ended up going copper for more bass.

Glad you guys liked it. I have been preaching the CNT gospel for a few months. Its the primary reason I have stayed away Kanas, No3 and the like.

 

[GuywhoLikesHIFI]

Hi, I'm looking at the CNT as a general upgrade from the **** and perhaps a good iem to use at the gym. How much sound do they naturally block out?

I'm also considering the TRN BT20S or TRN BT3S, or Fiio RC-BT cables to add onto the CNT, particularly the first because it has ANC. I'm always trying to block out the sound of the radio or other people's music at the gym and looking after my hearing is a major concern. my **** just don't block much out at all forcing me to turn the volume up.
Eventually I also plan to get the Toneking Nine tails, and perhaps keep the Semkarch CNT as a bluetooth gym IEM. Would something like the CNT with the BT20S be substantially better in sound quality than the Xiaomi Redmi Airdots, for example?
Any suggestions welcome, thanks.