Benchmark DAC-1 headphone amp?

[zdogg]

I recently bought a Gilmore Lite and I've had a DAC1 for a while. The Gilmore Lite IMO is a superior amp to the built in DAC1 amp (with hd650's); it is a little more forward and has more bass slam. The DAC1 amp sounds a little thin, distant, and one-dimensional to me. It's not a massive difference however, and one must always account for the effects of interconnects when comparing amps to the DAC's built-in.

On the other hand, running the 650's from the DAC's XLR out with a balanced cable to me sounds head and shoulders better than any other amp I've heard using DAC1 as a source. Particular strengths are soundstage (very expansive) and bass.

 

[lan]

The headphone out is just okay. Since you can't separate the built in amp, the question is are you listening to the source or amp or both? To me the headphone out doesn't sound totally like the source output so the amp seems to have an influence on the sound. I believe in the amp making a difference in the final sound so synergy is always at play.

A Pimeta has the potential of being a better amp since you can use better parts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphie An amp is an amp, no matter what the source is, if its fed a clean signal and amplifies it correctly, then you'll get high quality sound. Personally I like my headroom home because of course the crossfeed switch, but also because its not overly bright with my RS-1s unlike the DAC's headphone out.

All amps aren't the same. I prefer to have better source always.

It's not surprising to me you like your Headroom Home for those reasons because those are exactly some of the reasons why I don't like the DAC1 as a source. The stereo separation is just unnatural as there's a hole in the middle. Many other sources I've heard just don't have this hole. It's weird. The treble is another thing which annoys me about the the DAC1. It's just not clear enough for me and it comes off as bright.

I've been using K501 with DAC1 for a week or so now. It's an ok combination. It doesn't utilize K501s strengths in the midrange and it's clarity so I could never live with it. DAC1 is dynamic / lively sounding which is good to wake some headphones up but I don't think it's resolving enough in the bass and treble so it sounds out of balance to me. All I've said is relative though. If you're coming from less, it would be an upgrade.

I don't like Sennheiser headphones so I'd never try one myself via the XLR outputs. I'm hoping to hear this maybe at some meet.

 

[sonic32]

I am interested to hear there was such a huge differnce in the sound from the XLR's to the headphone out. Can anyone else confirm this or elaborate as to why? Is this simply because your bypassing the headphone amplifier?

 

[morphie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lan All amps aren't the same. I prefer to have better source always. It's not surprising to me you like your Headroom Home for those reasons because those are exactly some of the reasons why I don't like the DAC1 as a source. The stereo separation is just unnatural as there's a hole in the middle. Many other sources I've heard just don't have this hole. It's weird. The treble is another thing which annoys me about the the DAC1. It's just not clear enough for me and it comes off as bright. I've been using K501 with DAC1 for a week or so now. It's an ok combination. It doesn't utilize K501s strengths in the midrange and it's clarity so I could never live with it. DAC1 is dynamic / lively sounding which is good to wake some headphones up but I don't think it's resolving enough in the bass and treble so it sounds out of balance to me. All I've said is relative though. If you're coming from less, it would be an upgrade. I don't like Sennheiser headphones so I'd never try one myself via the XLR outputs. I'm hoping to hear this maybe at some meet.

I haven't heard anything better than the DAC-1 as source as of today. I've heard a few rotel cd players (cheap ones) and a belcanto dac2 (which did not impress me at all compared to the dac-1 btw) and so far I believe that for the money I've made the best choice I could find

 

[clarke68]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonic32 I am interested to hear there was such a huge differnce in the sound from the XLR's to the headphone out. Can anyone else confirm this or elaborate as to why?

Here's some more elaboration for 'ya.

 

[Jonoh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonic32 I am interested to hear there was such a huge differnce in the sound from the XLR's to the headphone out. Can anyone else confirm this or elaborate as to why? Is this simply because your bypassing the headphone amplifier?

I was at zdogg's place and while I cannot tell you why, I certainly back up his opinion. The DAC1 amp is thin sounding in comparison. The XLRs were lush and warm. In my limited experience, the 650s never sounded so good...but that is in limited experience.

 

[zdogg]

Glad you liked the sound, jonoh; can't wait to hear your supermacro when it gets in

There are indeed many threads discussing the ins and outs of XLR-driven 650's from the DAC1 (I believe Iron Dreamer and Neil Peart were amongst the earliest pioneers/adopters). The majority seem to agree with our positive assessments, although some feel it doesn't sound quite neutral (emphasized bass and treble with recessed midrange). May depend on the cable or on whether one employs the variable output (i.e, routing the signal through the DAC1's volume pot) or calibrated output (using Foobar or equivalent to digitally attenuate the signal). Either way, to me it still sounds much better than the built in amp (haven't compared it to high-end balanced amps like Gilmore Reference, Blockhead, etc).

 

[DMOS]

My question relating to this: would the beyer 880s with XLR plugs be too bright for this setup? From everything I've read it does a good job of "waking up" the Senns, but the DT880s don't need that so much. On those same lines, I noticed that you can get replacement cables (from Headphone.com) with the Beyers already containing XLR connections... is it necessary to pay more for the cable and connecs from them (costing as much as the phones) than it is to just do like others have and add in XLR->RCA-> 1/8th?

 

[morphie]

buying adapters cost me 20usd total

 

[iluvcans]

I bought my DAC1 about 3 months ago. I had a chance to hear this unit via xlr output (with modified stock cable) and from the front (built in amp) (with a cheap dvd player as source) and knew right away that it was one hell of a setup for the money! I was not totally impressed until I heard the xlr output though. The front amp lacks power that the xlr's substantially fill in. I am happy to say I haven't visited head-fi since nearly as much as I was a few months ago-- the DAC1 is exactly what I was looking for!!! I had Drew Baird customize my Silver Dragon cable to xlr's and I must say with 650's and a Silver Dragon cable I am satisfied! I listen primarily to classical music... The clarity, transparency that this combo offers cannot be beat for the money.. And for those curious, no, the dragon is not to bright. The stock cable is a bit warmer, more subdued-- with less pronounced articulation. I seek a setup that offers a simple, clear and accurate presentation. Do a thread search on the DAC1 and xlr's and you will see that many experienced listeners really dig this setup. It might just save you some serious $$$!!!!!!!!!

 

[morphie]

I feel the exact same way. I wont upgrade my source anymore. Only cans, amps, and cables

 

[TonyTripleA]

iluvcans: A man in love with the same source as myself. Its interesting that so many HD650 owners are lovers of the balanced output, must be a synergy thing? Wonder if a good balanced amp would add further to this positive experience?

Anyhow, I just wanted to say that I was also blown away with the sound quality out of my cheap Panasonic DVD using toslink. Then I plugged in the coaxial cable from the NAD542i... a noticable improvement.

For a few bucks more investment, coaxial can give you even more sound quality improvements. Your almost done but not quite yet

Ah, something to look forward to....

TonyAAA

 

[morphie]

U cant compare the optical out of a Panasonic DVD player and a NAD CD player's coaxial out...

 

[TonyTripleA]

Morphie: quite right. I should have added that a detectable sound improvement was noticed when listening to the coaxial out of the NAD over the toslink out of the same machine. This difference was not "major" but was noticable... the coaxial sounding "fuller".

I should also add that the toslink was not "top dollar" and I made the coaxial using the best components I could buy. So there are certainly variables but my impression is "give me coaxial anyday" based on this one off comparison.

TonyAAA