Ave Maria. By whom?

Aug 4, 2004 at 1:31 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 19

GirgleMirt

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I'm a bit confused, who wrote Ave Maria? Googling gives me all kind of results, Bach, Beethoven, Schubert
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Is Ave Maria some kind of composition/theme/technique? Like Fugue, rhapsody, rondo, etc...?

mp3's downloaded seem to have the same melody but different instruments or arrangements..

So who has written it first? Bach? If not Bach, then Beethoven?
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 2:03 PM Post #4 of 19
Are you sure its Schubert? Schubert was born after Bach died and google turned up ave maria by bach too... I have to check if Bach's ave maria is similar to Schubert.. Are you sure its Schubert?
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 2:23 PM Post #5 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
Are you sure its Schubert? Schubert was born after Bach died and google turned up ave maria by bach too... I have to check if Bach's ave maria is similar to Schubert.. Are you sure its Schubert?


I'm quite sure what you're looking for is the song by Schubert.
There's also an "Ave Maria" by Gounod, which uses the first prelude of Bach's "Das Wohltemperierte Klavier" (written more than a century earlier) as accompaniment.
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 2:27 PM Post #6 of 19
There are probably dozens of different settings of "Ave Maria" or "Sancta Maria" prayers to music. The one by Schubert and the one by Bach & Gounod are probably the best known.

Andrea Bocelli sings 3 or 4 of them on his 'Sacred Arias' CD.
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 2:51 PM Post #7 of 19
Just heard the one by Bach, clearly Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's & Gounod's but you're right the version I was thinking about was more the one by Schubert.

But even so, the version of Ave Maria by Schubert was written for violin no? And the opera Ave Maria by Beethoven?

So is the sang version by Beethoven or was that also written by Schubert?
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 2:58 PM Post #8 of 19
The Ave Maria IIRC was pronounced the first time by Gabriel (the archangel)..........Oh no!!! you were talking of the song....
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Aug 4, 2004 at 3:03 PM Post #9 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
Just heard the one by Bach, clearly Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's & Gounod's


Schubert's song is about 30 years older than Gounod's.
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 3:13 PM Post #10 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
Just heard the one by Bach, clearly Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's & Gounod's but you're right the version I was thinking about was more the one by Schubert.


Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterR
Schubert's song is about 30 years older than Gounod's.


ah ok then I meant by Bach. Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's, easy to tell since the melody is similar. I thought you said that Bach's Ave Maria was by Bach & Guonod, that they had composed it together, I had never heard of Guonod before..

So, the sang Ave Maria which everybody knows, is that Schubert or Beethoven?
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 3:56 PM Post #11 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
ah ok then I meant by Bach. Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's, easy to tell since the melody is similar. I thought you said that Bach's Ave Maria was by Bach & Guonod, that they had composed it together, I had never heard of Guonod before..

So, the sang Ave Maria which everybody knows, is that Schubert or Beethoven?



Probably Schubert's.

"Ave Maria" sung by tenor John McCormack was my Grandmother's favorite recording. She had recordings of both the Bach/Gounod and Schubert songs, but I've forgotten which of the two she preferred. Whichever it was, I think it was the less common of the two, since several times she was given recordings of the "wrong" one. (That was back in the '60s or '70s.) Now, both seem very familiar to me.

About Bach and Gounod (not contemporaries) http://www.staly.plus.com/amflute.html
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 4:11 PM Post #12 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
ah ok then I meant by Bach. Schubert's Ave Maria was inspired by Bach's, easy to tell since the melody is similar. I thought you said that Bach's Ave Maria was by Bach & Guonod, that they had composed it together, I had never heard of Guonod before..


Ok, I may have confused you a little, let me try again. There is no "Bach's Ave Maria". In the early 18th century Bach wrote "Das Wohltemperierte Klavier" (a cycle of keyboard pieces in all 24 keys, showcasing the at that time revolutionary well tempered tuning system, in the then common way instruments were tuned such a thing wouldn't have been possible).
Then in the mid 19th century french composer Gounod wrote a melody that fit over the first piece of Bach's cycle (you could perhaps think of a techno piece of today using a sample of some other song as an analogy).
Schubert's song is early 19th century.
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 4:11 PM Post #13 of 19
uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh!

Quote:

Important
Please note that although the image below shows the actual layout of a page of the Aeolia arrangement, it does not reflect the quality of the printed version. This is because the image on your computer screen reproduces the original at only 72 pixels (dots) per inch, with the result that slurs are jagged, stave lines are not equally spaced, and the appearance is generally crude. The actual printed version is produced using laser printers at over 34 million dots per page, resulting in complete smoothness and evenness in the quality of the print.


Whoever wrote that shouldn't blame the pitiful quality of his/her image on the user's computer screen.... Just make him/her look like a retard pretending to know something that he/she knows absolutely nothing about! What a dumbass!
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(I hope you didn't write that Earwax
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)
 
Aug 4, 2004 at 4:43 PM Post #14 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterR
Ok, I may have confused you a little, let me try again. There is no "Bach's Ave Maria". In the early 18th century Bach wrote "Das Wohltemperierte Klavier" (a cycle of keyboard pieces in all 24 keys, showcasing the at that time revolutionary well tempered tuning system, in the then common way instruments were tuned such a thing wouldn't have been possible).
Then in the mid 19th century french composer Gounod wrote a melody that fit over the first piece of Bach's cycle (you could perhaps think of a techno piece of today using a sample of some other song as an analogy).
Schubert's song is early 19th century.



Ahh! Much clearer now thanks
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So Schubert did the Ave Maria 'from scratch'? Hmmm.. I'm surprised! Schubert just jumped up many ranks in my composers list!

Which reminds me, I seriously need to learn more about classical music, so much amazing material.. Soo many great composers, pieces of music... I should at least know all the essentials..
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But daaam, so much stuff! Just Bach, Beethove and Mozart would probably keep me occupied for years!
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What kills me also is actually finding versions I like!! A lot of time I get a few mp3's, find a song i love, buy a cd (or many cd's), only to find that I don't really like the version I bought, the arrangement, instruments, tempo sometimes, Ex: Bach's Aire, I have an amazing version on mp3, and about 3 Bach cd's with that song on, with versions that I don't enjoy as much :P So its not only getting the right author + piece, you have to get the right "chef d'orchestre" (guy who leads orchestra.. name?!), orchestra, instruments, etc..

Its almost like anytime you buy a song+author, you get a different song! You could have Bach's Aire 20 times, and everyone of them would be different! Its awesome for relistenability of a piece, but hard on the n00b who wants something and ends up getting something else...
 
Aug 5, 2004 at 5:56 AM Post #15 of 19
Quote:

Originally Posted by GirgleMirt
Just Bach, Beethove and Mozart would probably keep me occupied for years!
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Just Bach would keep you occupied for years.
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Quote:

What kills me also is actually finding versions I like!! A lot of time I get a few mp3's, find a song i love, buy a cd (or many cd's), only to find that I don't really like the version I bought, the arrangement, instruments, tempo sometimes


rec.music.classical.recordings

An entire newsgroup (very active, too) devoted to discussion about classical recordings.

BTW, in English it is the conductor who leads the orchestra.

Diana
 

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