[ray-dude]

Take advantage of the time to get it burned in! I noticed a significant change over the first 100 hours or so

 

[youurayy]

Got the PMx2 in yesterday and set about putting it through its paces... but I didn't get very far. It seems to be a rather poor match with the Torpedo III, at least given the tubes I have on hand.

The PMx2 is absolutely ruthless when it comes to showing the actual sound signature of your systems. E.g. can't listen to my pricey Telefunken tubes (on Lyr2) because the stage separation is killing me. The '75 Voskhods make it a differnt amp altogether. Solid state amps just kill me with their dryness, but I haven't tried many.

People here have had good experiences with some portable amps, e.g. Pono, but I tried it and I think the dynamics cannot compare with a proper desktop amp.

Next thing that surprised me how much difference a cable can make. (I'm not going to say "good" or "bad" cable, just a different cable. Although planar + silver seems to be the combo.)

I also found it very important to boost the bass of the headphone, then it really came to life (as perceived). But this needs a lot of dynamic amp power.

As for the demise of Oppo -
1. that's what happens when you don't hire people like Alex and instead focus to compete with Sony et al.
2. it's not really about the headphone but about people who can take it the last mile

Can't wait what he picks to tune next, maybe some mid-range Audeze's or Hifimans', some hidden gem waiting to be tweaked up.

 

[m-i-c-k-e-y]

Yes! Now my PMx2s will be worth 10K!!

Hoping Alex will have another one on it sleeves for tuning...

 

[SilverEars]

I heard this awhile back at a meet. Never heard anything like this. It's an untypical sound. Treble sounded silky or a bit too smooth. Usually, headphones have a bolder or texturier treble, but the treble on this headphone was so different in this regard. I can't say it sounds accurate(due to the extremity of the treble characteristic), but just different. A bit weird sounding I'd say due to the untypical nature.

Is this a characteristic of the original PM-2 and the mod change some characteristics over that? Was the original PM-2 have treble that has really thin type treble?

 

[Mike C]

SilverEars wrote: " Never heard anything like this. It's an untypical sound. Treble sounded silky or a bit too smooth. Usually, headphones have a bolder or texturier treble"


Re 'untypical'; this does not necessarily mean 'wrong'. I have an untypical sounding CD player (Lector, with multibit chip and valve output) but I'd say this is more natural sounding (i.e. correct) than any of the dozens of other players I've heard.

The best thing to compare these phones to is live accoustic music; jazz, folk, classical, rather than comparing to typical hifi systems or headphones, here's why. I'd say that generally, live music does not sound that much like hifi; usually it doesn't have things like wide soundstage, pinpoint imaging, hyper detail etc that typical hifi has and many hifi buffs lust after! I suggest that these hifi things are a distortion; perhaps impressive, but not natural. All this is my personal opinion, many will disagree.

I suggest you listen to live music (non electric) and then try similar music on headphones; you may find that most headphones are not silky/smooth enough, and perhaps have an over bold treble (I do).
Myself, I agree that the PMx2 sound is untypical compared to headphones, but is very natural in terms of being a bit silky and smooth. Furthermore, this is not done by using a lot of treble rolloff (often done to simulate smoothness); detail, speed and dynamics are all there, but not thrust at you.

As for texture .. I think it's all there, and superb, perhaps very much due to the excellent natural tonality and low level subtle details. Listening now to Patricia Barber, Nightclub, and the texture of all the instruments really comes across superbly and (sorry to keep repeating this word) naturally. And the presentation of her voice is very special indeed,with texture and tonality, detail, subtleties, expression.

Yes, they are untypical; few headphones sound this good (IMHO).

 

[Dorokun]

Would give it a try if I could, the question is where could I audition for it. I wonder if Audio Zenith will do a mod for the Oppo PM-3 too.

 

[Valens7]

I wonder if Audio Zenith will do a mod for the Oppo PM-3 too.

Considering that Oppo Digital is shutting down, I very much doubt it. Too much of an R&D investment with little possibility of a good return. If it was gonna happen, it would have already.

 

[ScareDe2]

On the innerfidelity graph the Pmx2 looks good but not great:

<

But the Harman target is not perfect. I think the 6khz region should read flat for the pmx2. Even Tyll said in a video that it is ok to have a notch there and many feel the same. But, overall, the Pmx2 is not more accurate, graphically speaking, than the Oppo Pm2.

Here you can see the Pm2 follows the Harman target more tightly, where it counts. Of course we know the Harman asks for more bass, I disregard that completely, and again, the Harman preference is more 6khz power, I dislike that as well. But looking at that, the Pm2 has a more neutral sound response.

 

[FFRESPONSE]

@ScareDe2
I am seriously puzzled by the post above. What was your point? First you say, how you don't trust "Harman" FR curve ( "Harman target is not perfect"; "Harman asks for more bass, I disregard that completely, and again, the Harman preference is more 6khz power, I dislike that as well"...). Then you declare original PM-2 following Harman curve more tightly, graphically speaking has more neutral sound response....???

I have spoken at length to Sean Olive (head of research for Harman), regarding their view on headphone FR target curve and discovered they already are coming out with an updated research, which led to some necessary changes to an old target. I believe this research is still far from over, making references to their current target curve quite misleading. All in all, headphone industry in general hasn't established a consensus on preferred target for headphone frequency response, therefore your "graphically speaking" claims simply make no sense.

As for the PMx2 Tyll had for measurements, it was one of the earliest preproduction prototypes. I am not sure what went wrong, but using his own words: it was one of the rare cases where headphone didn't seem to measure the way it sounded. I suggest next time, before bringing Tyll's measurements into a meaningful discussion, try figuring out why all the sets from his "Wall of Fame" past and present, measure so differently from one another.

I use proprietary measurement system, quite different from industry standard and here is how the same set of PM-2 measures before and after modifications:

Here is distortion graphs:

If this isn't enough, here is waterfall and spectrogram measurements comparison between PMx2 and one of the industry leaders HD-650

 

[SilverEars]

On the innerfidelity graph the Pmx2 looks good but not great:

<

But the Harman target is not perfect. I think the 6khz region should read flat for the pmx2. Even Tyll said in a video that it is ok to have a notch there and many feel the same. But, overall, the Pmx2 is not more accurate, graphically speaking, than the Oppo Pm2.

Here you can see the Pm2 follows the Harman target more tightly, where it counts. Of course we know the Harman asks for more bass, I disregard that completely, and again, the Harman preference is more 6khz power, I dislike that as well. But looking at that, the Pm2 has a more neutral sound response.

Thanks for the graphs. Now I see why the treble sounds silky thin. All the treble energy is in the upper mids where thin treble are. It dips in the shimmery treble area. And I've read some people state it's neutral.. Welp, their neutrality is different from mine then.

 

[ScareDe2]

@ScareDe2
I am seriously puzzled by the post above. What was your point? First you say, how you don't trust "Harman" FR curve ( "Harman target is not perfect"; "Harman asks for more bass, I disregard that completely, and again, the Harman preference is more 6khz power, I dislike that as well"...). Then you declare original PM-2 following Harman curve more tightly, graphically speaking has more neutral sound response....???

I have spoken at length to Sean Olive (head of research for Harman), regarding their view on headphone FR target curve and discovered they already are coming out with an updated research, which led to some necessary changes to an old target. I believe this research is still far from over, making references to their current target curve quite misleading. All in all, headphone industry in general hasn't established a consensus on preferred target for headphone frequency response, therefore your "graphically speaking" claims simply make no sense.

As for the PMx2 Tyll had for measurements, it was one of the earliest preproduction prototypes. I am not sure what went wrong, but using his own words: it was one of the rare cases where headphone didn't seem to measure the way it sounded. I suggest next time, before bringing Tyll's measurements into a meaningful discussion, try figuring out why all the sets from his "Wall of Fame" past and present, measure so differently from one another.

I use proprietary measurement system, quite different from industry standard and here is how the same set of PM-2 measures before and after modifications:



Here is distortion graphs:







If this isn't enough, here is waterfall and spectrogram measurements comparison between PMx2 and one of the industry leaders HD-650

Ok, do not buy an early pre-production prototype because it is suggested it sounds different from more representative actual production units, do not trust Tyll measurements in a meaningful way, wait a final consensus on a preferred target and new consistent measurements, and don't waste your money. Tadam.

 

[quasimofo]

Ok, do not buy an early pre-production prototype because it is suggested it sounds different from more representative actual production units, do not trust Tyll measurements in a meaningful way, wait a final consensus on a preferred target and new consistent measurements, and don't waste your money. Tadam.

Please advise which setups you have heard PMx2 on. TIA.

 

[ScareDe2]

Please advise which setups you have heard PMx2 on. TIA.

I read headphones on innerfidelity graphs mostly. I can't offer any guarantee that they are accurate. Refer to the measurements complaints department. Thank you.

 

[m-i-c-k-e-y]

Another one on the Ignored list...

 

[rschoi75]

I read headphones on innerfidelity graphs mostly. I can't offer any guarantee that they are accurate. Refer to the measurements complaints department. Thank you.

If you haven't even heard these, what is the point of your post in the first place? What an odd, pointless soapbox rant.