[phthora]

Even tho no one can tell the difference between lossless audio codecs and high bit rate lossy mp3 compression.

What? Oh come on. That's easy! Just compare the file sizes or check the file extension. Works 100% of the time.

I have a feeling we have two distinct and opposite camps in here. I could bet that if Head-Fi had a poll of what's more important between having "bit perfect" or DSP capability, the vast majority would choose "bit perfect". Even tho no one can tell the difference between lossless audio codecs and high bit rate lossy mp3 compression.

If one cares only about avoiding OS sound APIs (aka Windows sound / DirectSound), there are many DSP, and even free PEQ, that do work under ASIO, WASAPI, KernelStreaming and other "bit perfect" sound APIs (also for Linux, OS X). For example, I have MathAudio components for foobar2000.

To your point though, I think you are generally correct. Though there are many such camps on Head-Fi, most them a spectrum rather than a binary. Personally, I default to bit perfect, but definitely see the point of DSP in many cases. My ultimate reason for not EQ'ing the 2C has nothing to do with that however: On the spectrum ranging from headphone monogamy to headphone polyamory, I definitely lean towards the latter. Correct sound then is not something I strive for in every headphone, or even very many. I like to have variety, and it's enough for me that the 2C sounds different from my other headphones and sounds good. I won't try to argue that the upper mids dip doesn't exist, that it doesn't bother me sometimes, that it's tonally correct, or that it shouldn't be EQ'd, but I will argue that it gives these headphones character and that I find that character very appealing. If it bothers me too much for particular music, I'll switch to another headphone since I have that option. Not saying that's the right way, but I enjoy having a headphone be itself, warts and all, unless there is something really off about it to my ears. With IEMs, I have fewer options to choose from, so I end up EQ'ing most of those, even several of my favorites.

Anyway, thanks for the MathAudio rec! I'll be using that for sure for the one or two headphones that I do EQ.

 

[roskodan]

Indeed, I got the LCD2C for the exact same reason. To complement my HD800 and Focal Clear. But only after I already gave up on the LCD series and HD800 as well.

Lived with just HD650 and Focal Clear for a few years, bit perfect (WASAPI) without any EQ. Then I discovered PEQ, and decided to give the LCD and HD800 another try. I'm glad I did. The HD800 benefited greatly from a simple bass boost, as did the LCD from bringing the presence region up. Keep in mind that my LCD may be more severely affected by the Audeze lottery vs the average one. As my previous LCD2 rev2 rosewood was quite a bit more present treble wise.

Had the same gear in the past, V200, and both HD800 and LCD2 rev2. No EQ. Just switching between the two, as a form of EQ by headphone, depending on which headphone benefited more my music, genre, mood. Anyone who experienced how two headphones can be complementary and supplement each other, should be able to understand no headphone is absolutely perfect, and the benefit hi-fi quality DSP, PEQ, bring when used correctly and to taste.

Not saying no headphone is good enough out of the box, as is. HD650, Clear, SE530, great all rounder headphones for me. But why limit enjoying those strengths, the LCD and HD800 have over those, because of a weak link in their performance. How many couldn't enjoy the HD800 or Clear because of the treble spike or low bass, or in my case the treble drop in the LCD2C. In a way I feel freed from any such limitation.

The LCD are still LCD, big, smooth, physical bass and mids, plus now the tonality and details are way more enjoyable. Same for the HD800, stage, air, details, all as before, plus now with bass too.

 

[Lolito]

I personally do not like to EQ. Especially if you spend a large amount of money on a headphone and have to EQ it to sound better. This is a deal breaker to me. The thing to remember is you are NOT EQing your headphones you are EQing the source and changing the frequency response of the source not the headphone.

I don't like to eq either my friend, no body does. Everyone prefers to get a device already sounding perfect, but guess what? not going to happen always my dear. In the audeze case, you can eq them, and have a best of the marquet sound for the price, you can not eq them, or you can go to other headphones directly, all worse sounding, ALL. Sennheiser hd800, wrose, any hifiman, worse, rossin, wrose. HD6XX, well, worse too, but a decent competitor, just like sundara, I guess, and some proper good beyer adn what not, but you get me.

It's a bit like; why tune my Porsche 911? Then don't tune it my dear, don't tune it, it's ok, leave it as it is and drive it without tuning my sweet boy. Have fun boy.

 

[Iknownothing1]

So have these for a bit over a month now, I didn't like them at first but now I totally do. However, the bass could slam a bit more imo. Never Eq'd before. Just downloaded "Apo + peace". What EQ settings would you guys advice to give these more slam ?

 

[Leonarfd]

So have these for a bit over a month now, I didn't like them at first but now I totally do. However, the bass could slam a bit more imo. Never Eq'd before. Just downloaded "Apo + peace". What EQ settings would you guys advice to give these more slam ?

Depends what you want, a little bass shelf around 80-100 is going to give you more slam.

 

[mbritt]

So have these for a bit over a month now, I didn't like them at first but now I totally do. However, the bass could slam a bit more imo. Never Eq'd before. Just downloaded "Apo + peace". What EQ settings would you guys advice to give these more slam ?

I just posted my experience using the Loki Mini + with the LCD2Cs compared to using software EQ in Roon. I think a lot of LCD2C users would enjoy tweaking the SQ with the Loki equalizer.

 

[Leonarfd]

Loki is nice and intuitive, feels much better to have it at your fingertips than tweaking it digitally. But that's subjective preference. Had the new Loki for some days then sold it since I ended tweaking more than I was listening to the music, still think its a good buy

 

[Lolito]

There is a new loki coming, like a proper large equalizer, with more bands. Loki is awesome of rthe price, but 4 bands not enough for this, maybe.

 

[Mausk]

So have these for a bit over a month now, I didn't like them at first but now I totally do. However, the bass could slam a bit more imo. Never Eq'd before. Just downloaded "Apo + peace". What EQ settings would you guys advice to give these more slam ?

I am also using these now for about 2 months. I found the following EQ settings wich seem to work great for me.
Load these parameters in "Commands" in the middle text box (After the device selection of you EQ configuration) and make sure ur EQ is flat. After loading u wont see any result in the EQ bars, but it works.

The version i use with -10 on preamp in peace:
Filter: ON LSC 25 dB Fc 32 Hz Gain 4 dB
Filter: ON LSC 27 dB Fc 75 Hz Gain 6 dB
Filter: ON PK Fc 100 Hz Gain 4.5 dB Q 1.32
Filter: ON PK Fc 250 Hz Gain -0.6 dB Q 1
Filter: ON PK Fc 480 Hz Gain 2.6 dB Q 1
Filter: ON PK Fc 1250 Hz Gain -2 dB Q 2.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 2100 Hz Gain 2 dB Q 1.4
Filter: ON PK Fc 4100 Hz Gain 4.7 dB Q 1.75
Filter: ON PK Fc 5930 Hz Gain -2.5 dB Q 7
Filter: ON PK Fc 6500 Hz Gain 5.5 dB Q 6.65
Filter: ON PK Fc 7345 Hz Gain 3 dB Q 10
Filter: ON PK Fc 8000 Hz Gain -2 dB Q 7
Filter: ON PK Fc 10500 Hz Gain 3.5 dB Q 1.9
Filter: ON PK Fc 15000 Hz Gain 3 dB Q 2.3706
Filter: ON HS Fc 2500 Hz Gain 1 dB
Filter: ON HSC 33 dB Fc 5730 Hz Gain 0.5 dB
(2 low shelf, 12 peak, 2 high shelf filters)

Tame version - -8,5 on preamp in peace:
Filter: ON LSC 24 dB Fc 32 Hz Gain 4 dB
Filter: ON LSC 27 dB Fc 75 Hz Gain 3 dB
Filter: ON PK Fc 100 Hz Gain 1 dB Q 1.32
Filter: ON PK Fc 250 Hz Gain -0.6 dB Q 1
Filter: ON PK Fc 550 Hz Gain 2 dB Q 0.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 900 Hz Gain 1.5 dB Q 0.895
Filter: ON PK Fc 1250 Hz Gain -1 dB Q 8
Filter: ON PK Fc 1500 Hz Gain 1 dB Q 4.1
Filter: ON PK Fc 2100 Hz Gain 2 dB Q 1.4
Filter: ON PK Fc 3000 Hz Gain -2 dB Q 3.2
Filter: ON PK Fc 4785 Hz Gain 1 dB Q 3.75
Filter: ON PK Fc 5300 Hz Gain 3 dB Q 1.8
Filter: ON PK Fc 6000 Hz Gain -4.1 dB Q 5
Filter: ON PK Fc 6500 Hz Gain 5 dB Q 4.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 7200 Hz Gain -3.5 dB Q 7.6
Filter: ON PK Fc 7400 Hz Gain 7 dB Q 4.8
Filter: ON PK Fc 8000 Hz Gain -3 dB Q 4.8
Filter: ON PK Fc 9500 Hz Gain -3 dB Q 3.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 11000 Hz Gain 6 dB Q 3.5
Filter: ON PK Fc 14500 Hz Gain 4 dB Q 3.1
(2 low shelf filters, 18 peak filters [sorry], 0 high shelf filter)

Credits to: https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/9oa9u6/lcd2c_eq_based_on_oratorys_eq_profile_and_the/

 

[simpletan]

I have a decent local deal I could get on the LCD 2 Classic and I'm really interested in getting a high-end planar. My best headphone right now is my Denon AH-D7200, but I also enjoy my 58x Jubilees. I saw someone on Reddit describe LCD 2 Classic's as an HD650/DT 1990 tonality hybrid, with less treble and a planar driver and it got me really interested. My only planar experience so far is Dekoni Blues, which I enjoy a lot, but don't enjoy the buzz that seems to come and go on them. I also saw that someone on here said the LCD 2C's are not very different from my Denon, which I'm not sure would be an issue for me, because then I would have an open and closed with similar sounds.

My main concerns are some things I have heard about the imaging on these and how there seem to be gaps in the imaging (like around the 45 degree left and right areas).

 

[gimmeheadroom]

I have a decent local deal I could get on the LCD 2 Classic and I'm really interested in getting a high-end planar. My best headphone right now is my Denon AH-D7200, but I also enjoy my 58x Jubilees. I saw someone on Reddit describe LCD 2 Classic's as an HD650/DT 1990 tonality hybrid, with less treble and a planar driver and it got me really interested. My only planar experience so far is Dekoni Blues, which I enjoy a lot, but don't enjoy the buzz that seems to come and go on them. I also saw that someone on here said the LCD 2C's are not very different from my Denon, which I'm not sure would be an issue for me, because then I would have an open and closed with similar sounds.

My main concerns are some things I have heard about the imaging on these and how there seem to be gaps in the imaging (like around the 45 degree left and right areas).

I have said that I find the HD 600 and LCD-2C similar but complimentary and I get skewered for that to the point I had to finally put some obnoxious slingers of personal attacks on ignore. I also find the DT1770 feels to me like a closed pair of HD 600s.

I haven't heard the DT1990s so I can't say. But I can say the LCD-2C doesn't have less treble, it is just warmer and more romantic. Smooth yet with slam. It is a superb all around pair of headphones at the price point with a good build and comfortable. They're easy to drive, unlike the Fostex based TR50/60rps. Imaging is something I haven't paid attention to (I don't game) but certainly there is no defect there or I would have heard it.

What kind of music do you listen to?

 

[simpletan]

I have said that I find the HD 600 and LCD-2C similar but complimentary and I get skewered for that to the point I had to finally put some obnoxious slingers of personal attacks on ignoe. I also find the DT1770 feels to me like a closed pair of HD 600s.

I haven't heard the DT1990s so I can't say. But I can say the LCD-2C doesn't have less treble, it is just warmer and more romantic. Smooth yet with slam. It is a superb all around pair of headphones at the price point with a good build and comfortable. They're easy to drive, unlike the Fostex based TR50/60rps. Imaging is something I haven't paid attention to (I don't game) but certainly there is no defect there or I would have heard it.

What kind of music do you listen to?

Thank you so much for your response! Being similar/complimentary to HD 600s would be a win in my book.

I listen to a variety, including: rock, punk, alternative, rap, pop, electronic, and the occasional game or movie soundtrack.

And imaging isn't a complete deal-breaker for me, but I guess I let DMS's review of them get into my head with his comments on imaging. Even if they end up not being ideal for gaming, I have my 58x Jubilees to fall back on for that, so it's not the end of the world if they aren't perfect for that.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Thank you so much for your response! Being similar/complimentary to HD 600s would be a win in my book.

I listen to a variety, including: rock, punk, alternative, rap, pop, electronic, and the occasional game or movie soundtrack.

And imaging isn't a complete deal-breaker for me, but I guess I let DMS's review of them get into my head with his comments on imaging. Even if they end up not being ideal for gaming, I have my 58x Jubilees to fall back on for that, so it's not the end of the world if they aren't perfect for that.

I think the LCD-2C would cover those kinds of music no problem. I can't really think of anything they do badly. They kinda take everything in stride. They're warm and smooth when it's called for but when you need some thumpin' bass they get up and dance.

I find the big Audezes very comfortable, among my most comfortable headphones. Depending on your head that might be an issue. They're heavy, but the strap is wide and distributes the weight well. I feel like I'm down in the headphones and I like that immersive feeling. Beyers and Fostex hurt my head, and the HD 600s clamp my jaws with a death grip. About the only complaint I have about the Audezes is they do get warm in the summer if you don't have A/C. But the fake leather pads on the 2C are some of the best fake leather pads I have felt.

 

[simpletan]

I think the LCD-2C would cover those kinds of music no problem. I can't really think of anything they do badly. They kinda take everything in stride. They're warm and smooth when it's called for but when you need some thumpin' bass they get up and dance.

I find the big Audezes very comfortable, among my most comfortable headphones. Depending on your head that might be an issue. They're heavy, but the strap is wide and distributes the weight well. I feel like I'm down in the headphones and I like that immersive feeling. Beyers and Fostex hurt my head, and the HD 600s clamp my jaws with a death grip. About the only complaint I have about the Audezes is they do get warm in the summer if you don't have A/C. But the fake leather pads on the 2C are some of the best fake leather pads I have felt.

Awesome! Admittedly, I am a bit of a bass-head, which is why I love my D7200s, but I also like to balance it a bit with the rest of the mix, so this sounds perfect for me.

Comfort is one of the things I'm most excited to try out. I have a ZMF co-pilot pad that failed on my Denon's, so if they are uncomfortable, I can slap that on there (might anyways).

Thank you again for all your feedback on these. I think I'm going to pull the trigger and try them for myself.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Awesome! Admittedly, I am a bit of a bass-head, which is why I love my D7200s, but I also like to balance it a bit with the rest of the mix, so this sounds perfect for me.

Comfort is one of the things I'm most excited to try out. I have a ZMF co-pilot pad that failed on my Denon's, so if they are uncomfortable, I can slap that on there (might anyways).

Thank you again for all your feedback on these. I think I'm going to pull the trigger and try them for myself.

Oh, you can't put a (co)pilot pad on the Audezes. The headstrap is a drilled out steel structure with some kind of suspension band.

The old style headband was something that maybe a pad could have changed. The new style suspension headband is totally different. I don't think it could hurt your head, the only question is probably whether the weight distribution works for you or not.