[franz12]

You are casting aspersions on Audeze's quality of production on all products over several years based on the unverifiable, homegrown measurements of a person whom you will not cite and whose measurements I can't even find. It is not impolite or unjustified to point out that that is an unsubstantiated claim. You might be offended by that, but I am offended by your recklessness assertions. If you had said, "hey, there is some evidence that..." or "I am concerned about X because of Y..." or "one person noted unit to unit variation..." we wouldn't be having this conversation. Even assuming that the alluded-to measurements are iron-clad, you cannot induce that the LCD-2 have wide unit to unit variation or that all LCD-2s do, and you certainly cannot use that as evidence of to support your suggestion that Audeze has problems with production consistency and QC throughout the entire life of their company. If you would care to weigh in with your personal experience, positive or negative, regarding this issue, please do so, but don't bandy about measurements of unknown reliability as gospel.

Because you know the site I am mentioning, it must be very easy to find those measurements. But because you already have a strong bias toward them, you won't check anything and you are a person who makes unsubstantiated claims. For disclosure, I am not even a member in that site, and I don't agree with them in many aspects.

However, those measurements about lcd2c came from the most prominent member there who is an ardent fan of lcd4, I trust them to some extent. He measured 3 different lcd2c, made them public, and graded each of them A, B+, C-, though he said it it is still improvement in their QC.

You may disagree with this, but still it is worth letting know other members about this and pushing Audeze to improve their QC.

I usually, don't talk to a person who possess a strong bias. So I won't continue this discussion further.

 

[phthora]

However, those measurements about lcd2c came from the most prominent member there who is an ardent fan of lcd4, I trust them to some extent. He measured 3 different lcd2c, made them public, and graded each of them A, B+, C-, though he said it it is still improvement in their QC.

Do you know anything about this person's measurement rig? It's calibration? The number of measurements taken? The physical placement of the headhones? Do you know anything about the headphones measured? The third seems to have been cherry-picked to be measured precisely because it had issues. Were the others damaged? Pre-production? Different pad wear? Less/more time on the drivers? Why assume that Audeze has poor QC, rather than assuming that this was not a reliable measuring? I've now read through that cat's measurements and posts, and I still have all those concerns about their reliability. Not from bias, but from the opposite: I simply have no reason to trust that these are reliable measurements until I have assurances about those concerns.

However, let's disregard that and return to the broader point. Even assuming that these three headphones show unit variation, you have no basis no assert that this problem of inconsistent production is endemic to Audeze. Frankly, you have only the scantest evidence that it is a problem with production on this particular model. You cannot extrapolate that out as you have done. That is an unsubstantiated claim. And, while you now seem to suggest that your motivation is to push Audeze towards higher QC, you were clearly trying to steer people away from Audeze by claiming that the headphones all have considerable variation between units as a result of poor manufacturing standards:

2c as well as other audeze products is known to show a considerable variation in measurements across units.

Some people argue that audeze build qualty is top notch which I never understand and thought quite superficial argument. Their production is not consistent at all after years.

Overstating the case like that demonstrates that you are the one with strong bias.

 

[omniweltall]

Considering how many small, unannounced revisions Audeze has gone through, it is no wonder measurements are different. However, given your source, I would assume that someone is comparing a 2.1 to 2.2F, or something similar.

Jeez, we are talking about the 2C, not 2.1 and not 2.2F, Keep up buddy.

They are not. Measurements are as close as can be for this type of product.

Now this is the very definition of unsubstantiated claims. Thread carefully guys. Lots of these things flying around here.

Do you know anything about this person's measurement rig? It's calibration? The number of measurements taken? The physical placement of the headhones? Do you know anything about the headphones measured? The third seems to have been cherry-picked to be measured precisely because it had issues. Were the others damaged? Pre-production? Different pad wear? Less/more time on the drivers? Why assume that Audeze has poor QC, rather than assuming that this was not a reliable measuring? I've now read through that cat's measurements and posts, and I still have all those concerns about their reliability. Not from bias, but from the opposite: I simply have no reason to trust that these are reliable measurements until I have assurances about those concerns.

How do you know those guys don't have the experience in taking measurement?


But is it really a surprise to you all? We are talking about Audeze here. Where have you guys been all these years?? I bought it knowing fully about the potential large product variation or driver failure. It is the risk you take. If you don't like it, go buy a Sennheiser!

I bought it not only for the sound, but the look as well. Best looking LCD so far imo. So, I'm taking the risk. As for driver failure, It is under warranty anyway. Audeze has always made good on their warranties. So don't lose sleep over it.

FYI, Audeze has made a lot of improvement in their production process, compared to in the past. And to their credit, making planar driver isn't exactly easy too (although other companies do fine).

Enjoy your 2Cs. It's a great can.

 

[phthora]

Jeez, we are talking about the 2C, not 2.1 and not 2.2F, Keep up buddy.

To be fair, I posted that comment before I was able to find the measurements or knew what specifically they were measuring. It is clear that they are 2C measurements, and I doubt he accidentally measured some other headphone.

How do you know those guys don't have the experience in taking measurement?

That is the whole point: I don't know one way or the other. But, even someone as experienced as Tyll or Jude makes multiple measures. Has this person done that? I don't know.

Now, I am not unreasonable. I could list the exact information I would need to know to trust these measurements (though, I'm not sure anyone cares), and I will try to satisfy my own concerns about whether or not those are met. Honestly, I am glad I have this new source of information to consider. But, I still see no one trying to defend the inductive leap made earlier. That is the real source of my aggravation.

 

[betula]

Wrong thread. Apologies.

 

[omniweltall]

Look guys, my suggestion is just enjoy the can. I dont even know what grade my LCD2C is. I dont even bother to find out. Enough nervosa in this hobby.

Have you tried their new pads? I love it. YMMV of course.

 

[phthora]

Have you tried their new pads? Gawd I love it. YMMV of course.

My LCD-X has the new pads, while my LCD-2 has the older pads. The new pads are beautiful and high quality, with some great memory foam in them. My only quibble, and it is small, is that the older pads compressed less and so offered slightly more clamp. I found that helped alleviate the weight. The new ones sit looser and are a bit more comfortable as far as that goes, but tolerate less head movement. I think I prefer the old ones, but both are wonderful.

Something I did recently that helped improve the seal and bass was to treat the leather pads with leather conditioner. Cost me 8 bucks and 10 minutes, making it one of the most cost effective improvements I've ever done. They look gorgeous and lush now, and the leather is softer on the ears.

 

[chef8489]

Jeez, we are talking about the 2C, not 2.1 and not 2.2F, Keep up buddy.


Now this is the very definition of unsubstantiated claims. Thread carefully guys. Lots of these things flying around here.

.

You do realize that Audeze are making these by hand while everyone else are using automated manufacturing such as Hifi man and that is why that applies. When you have handmade products you get variations between each one. Hell even with automated manufacturing you get variation between units. Hell Audeze has made leaps and bounds on getting their drivers closer to each other and that is why they are not including measurements any longer . You get people like Zeos on youtube that knows jack all about audio and other people on websites, yet they get all the attention and quotes. People just need to listen for themselves.

 

[LaCuffia]

I hate to switch topics, as this recent exchange is very entertaining (not), but is there a significant weight difference between the 2C and the current LCD-2? With the addition of the new headband on the LCD-2, I would think they would be quite similar in weight - but I am not sure how much heavier the bamboo wood is from the composite material on the 2C.

 

[iamjaymo]

Just a quick break from the 2C measurement talk to give an impression of these cans, seeing as this is an “impression” thread....

I’ve had the Classics now for a couple of months. Been listening over the last week or so through the balanced output on my NFB-28.38. I gotta say, IMHO these are some of the best headphones I have heard. I don’t do audiophile language but the imaging as well as the depth and tightness of the bass on the DSD version of MJ’s Thriller, for example, is quite amazing.

I usually like a bit more bass quantity with my music but the clarity and midrange musicality is just so overwhelming I don't miss the really deep sub-bass...again, IMHO, which isn’t saying much. I’m happy!

 

[chef8489]

I hate to switch topics, as this recent exchange is very entertaining (not), but is there a significant weight difference between the 2C and the current LCD-2? With the addition of the new headband on the LCD-2, I would think they would be quite similar in weight - but I am not sure how much heavier the bamboo wood is from the composite material on the 2C.

Not sure of the exact weight difference as you also have no fazors in the lcd2c.

 

[betula]

I hate to switch topics, as this recent exchange is very entertaining (not), but is there a significant weight difference between the 2C and the current LCD-2? With the addition of the new headband on the LCD-2, I would think they would be quite similar in weight - but I am not sure how much heavier the bamboo wood is from the composite material on the 2C.

The weight is pretty much the same, however with the new headband the weight distribution is much better, more even. Also the big memory foam pads help. Many people say these are the most comfortable LCDs ever. I am yet to check if that is true.

 

[chef8489]

The weight is pretty much the same, however with the new headband the weight distribution is much better, more even. Also the big memory foam pads help. Many people say these are the most comfortable LCDs ever. I am yet to check if that is true.

With the original headbands when the LCD2C released here are the weights.
Sine: 318g
EL-8 Open: 520g
EL-8 Closed: 540g
LCD-2C: 549g
LCD-2 Bamboo/Shedua: 565g
LCD-2 Rosewood: 585g
LCD-3: 629g
LCD-X: 630g
LCD-XC: 680g
LCD-MX4: 555g
LCD-4: 695g

 

[LaCuffia]

Thanks.....I had the LCD2C when they were first released, and kicking myself for returning it. I thought it was extremely comfortable - for some reason it just felt more right on my head than most other headphones despite the weight. I am not looking to buy anything now but at some point I will go back to Audeze. I also miss the rich and weighty sound.

 

[Sound Eq]

can we for gods sake talk bout the mids of lcdc instead of all the measurement talk, plz i need more info bout mids