[sludgeogre]

  I have to respectfully disagree with highs being rolled off. There is plenty of extension up to 20k. Graphs show it and my ears hear it. More than many phones and pretty much any iem for that matter.
 
What is mistaken for rolled off highs is an overall lack of air in the presentation and a weighty meaty sound. The lack of air can sound like a rolled off top end, but its really not because it effects the mid range more than anything and you can hear extension through the higher frequencies. just my experiences.

I hear you, I've been in this argument before, but many of the graphs do show a slow roll-off in the upper midbass/lower treble. I don't have mine as I don't care to pick apart my headphones like that, I just love the way they sound. I think because the LCD-2F is so clear, the slight roll-off isn't very perceptible. You still hear all of the detail and nuance that is there, but it isn't in your face or above the mix like it can sound through something like a Grado.
 
I remember when I've read the comments like the ones you have spoken of, and it kind of shocked me until I saw the same comments over and over again and saw some graphs with a big dip in the treble region. I think some people take that dip WAY too seriously, because you really can't hear it all that much. If anything, I think it makes the treble sound more natural, but I guess some people think it makes them lose detail. I don't agree with that either.
 
Another huge benefit of that dip (I think, just a theory) is that it helps my tinnitus. I've been to way too many death metal concerts with no hearing protection and bright headphones at louder volumes (like my Grados) make my tinnitus go totally nuts. The smooth quality of the LCD-2F treble makes it so I can listen to music for many hours with zero pain, but still hear all of the detail and air around instruments. It's a weird thing and I can't explain it to well and some people disagree with it.

 

[sludgeogre]

  ... and [u][color=rgb(0, 0, 128)]sludgeogre,[/color][/u] that comment wasn't directed at you in particular. I have just heard that comment about rolled off highs and figured id weigh in on that debate!

No problem at all, I actually agree with you in a way. It's weird discussing the FR graphs and how these headphones actually sound sometimes.
 
It's very similar to talking about the Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers that I have. The RAAL tweeters are detailed AND smooth at the same time. You don't get that with a lot of other gear, but you do with the LCD-2F as well. Usually smoother treble means less detail, and I think that sometimes when people hear that smoother sound they just assume it's not detailed. That might be unfair, but it's something I think happens.

 

[kernel8888]

yea the dip helps give it a forgiving response, but I think that overall the headphone is characterized by its presentation more than its frequency response. By that I mean that it has a full sound, less air than many phones (especially hifiman), somewhat small soundstage, but still retaining excellent imaging and extension from 10-20k.
 
But I do agree the dip and slightly less air probably accounts for the perception of roll off.
 
I did find that a grill mod on the fazor model almost completely gets rid of the lack of air, but adds JUST A TAD extra emphasis on the upper mids. Its worth it though for me.

 

[PinkyPowers]

I can only speak to the Fazor model, but the highers are very present. It's no where near a bright signature, but they are certainly not rolled off.

 

[bavinck]

I think part of the issue is in understanding what "rolled off" means. It does not mean highs (or lows) are non existent, but rather that they are reduced in dB relative to the spectrum in a (relatively?) unnatural way. I think lcd2 highs are rolled off a little, but I agree they are super clear and I like the rolled off highs that do not shove treble in my face.

 

[marcan]

I wouldn't say LCD2 has a small soundstage, what you lose in wideness is compensate by the deepness.
And concerning the fazer, what you get in upper mids is lost in the sub.
Personally I find the LCD2.2.2 very natural. It's not in your face (it can be if you raise the volume) but extremely detailed. The fazor isn't for me, less foundation and a bit gritty.

 

[Ampeezy]

  I have to respectfully disagree with highs being rolled off. There is plenty of extension up to 20k. Graphs show it and my ears hear it. More than many phones and pretty much any iem for that matter.
 
What is mistaken for rolled off highs is an overall lack of air in the presentation and a weighty meaty sound. The lack of air can sound like a rolled off top end, but its really not because it effects the mid range more than anything and you can hear extension through the higher frequencies. just my experiences.

I have to agree with you man, any more emphasized highs on my lcd-2F and i will have a problem...Its definitely not a dark phone anymore like the prefazors i had a year and a half ago. I feel they are really nicely balanced at this point; not a bright phone but if you're a treble head well...

 

[rothkowitz]

I think part of the issue is in understanding what "rolled off" means. It does not mean highs (or lows) are non existent, but rather that they are reduced in dB relative to the spectrum in a (relatively?) unnatural way. I think lcd2 highs are rolled off a little, but I agree they are super clear and I like the rolled off highs that do not shove treble in my face.

That's a good way of putting it. To me, they're a good horse for a certain course. Where you want a feeling of push, presence and trajectory they're tops. Where you need a certain airiness and heck, finesse (?) I go back to HD600. What they're certainly not guilty of is glare. The detail is there nonetheless

 

[CanadianMaestro]

When I owned a non-fazor LCD-2.2, I felt its highs were not "rolled off", they were just more pleasantly tolerable at louder volumes, than other HPs like many Grados. Then I realized that the 2.2's bass was probably a bit more dominant than many other HPs, which may explain the less strident treble regions. (I'm not too enamored by the graphs, which are always measured with one system at the company's labs; I use my ears most of all, to judge SQ and freq balances in my system).

 

[marcan]

  When I owned a non-fazor LCD-2.2, I felt its highs were not "rolled off", they were just more pleasantly tolerable at louder volumes, than other HPs like many Grados. Then I realized that the 2.2's bass was probably a bit more dominant than many other HPs, which may explain the less strident treble regions. (I'm not too enamored by the graphs, which are always measured with one system at the company's labs; I use my ears most of all, to judge SQ and freq balances in my system).

Actually bass will make the highs more tolerable because it compresss the ear. I guess LCD owners like to push the level a bit because I don't know how they could listening to this kind of level with an HD800...
Moreover an Audeze has better THD% at 100dB than 90dB, so these hp ar made for power.

 

[obsidyen]

I think it does. The bass is more impactful. This is a bit masked by the overall warmer sound sig of the mojo, but I liked it a tad better with the iDSD micro. But what I love about the mojo instead it's just so easy. No switches and buttons, just connect and enjoy it.

Anyhow both make the LCD-2 sound fabulatastic.

Cheers.

Does LCD2f bass have more impact and slam than PM-2 which I find to be disappointing in this regard while listening to EDM?

 

[TheGadaffiDuck]

Will the wood trim be able to stand the rigors of mixing environments? Looks more for the audiophile unless something about the wood and sonic performance were the reason for using it. 

Try the audeze lcd x in audeze line up

 

[Ampeezy]

 
Does LCD2f bass have more impact and slam than PM-2 which I find to be disappointing in this regard while listening to EDM?

Currently listening to my fazor lcd-2...I don't think it will ever be lacking in slam imo and i believe most will agree. I have not heard the PM-2 however.

 

[Koolpep]

Does LCD2f bass have more impact and slam than PM-2 which I find to be disappointing in this regard while listening to EDM?

Yes. It has a bit more impact and slam. Has your PM-2 gotten the PM-1 pad upgrade? It helps with the bass in particular. At least on mine.

Cheers

 

[floppiness]

Just out of curiosity, what would be a good dac amp combo at around $500? I was thinking the stealth dc-1, o2odac, what else????