Apple vs PC for music files?

[gdg]

Hi,
I'm new here. I am trying to build a computer "jukebox" and am confused by the new trend in copy protected CDs. I like what I hear about apple computers (quiet, good operating system, less susceptable to virus's than a PC etc). I am worried that the limited amount of ripping software will reduce my ability to deal with copy protected CDs. I've also heard that itunes is not as good as EAC for ripping and does not have good error correction.
Any thoughts or opinions on the subject of apple vs PC would be greatly appreciated.

 

[blessingx]

Welcome to Head-Fi.

Well, there are pros and cons to each OS. iTunes does have error correction (undervalued around here if you ask me), however it does not equal EAC for ripping or (maybe more importantly) reporting.* If you want to use iTunes as a player, its output (bit perfect CoreAudio - no ASIO drivers) and third party support (see my sig) wins easily on OS X. The flip side is your player options are far greater on the Windows side (Winamp, Foobar, etc.) if you don't plan on using iTunes. I hope this slightly changes soon though.

As for copy protection, so far schemes are trying to stop/slow down the most and ignoring the rest. This means Apple is pretty much invisible as a target... so far. Again ups and downs. You don't have EAC to help get around things... but you usually (I haven't seen it) don't need to because there's no copy protection in the way. This could of course change in the future should Macs get more popular, but the way discs mount on Macs (OS X like other UNIXs) makes it a little more difficult. On the other side if they ever completely alienated the entire Mac user base, they could probably care less. Same invisible argument either way.

Although (yeah I've said it before) I get paid to write MS ASP code and on Windows all day, I much prefer OS X as an OS, but not because of specifically audio. There's arguments for both platforms (and Linux, etc.), but to be honest I'm not sure audio should be a deciding factor. Figure out your other needs are and see where that leads you. You can get great sound out of OS X or XP.

[size=xx-small]* There supposedly is a CDParanoid version for Mac's but I haven't used it. I have a PC at home solely for EAC, but rarely use it anymore. [/size]

 

[gdg]

Your input is very instructive and corroborates much of my own research. One thing I didn't mention was that I plan to use a Squeezebox (into a moderatly high end system) so I don't believe that the advantages of Coreaudio would be realized. I could be wrong about that and let me know if I am.
Ps I've got my eye on an iMac G5 (1.8 version).
PPS Is there any price to be paid for lossless compression if using a Squeezebox. (I understand wav. files are best, but again, I could be wrong)

I would be going
Mac or PC > Big Ben > Tact 2.0s Room Correction Processor > Benchmark Dac1 > Bryston 4bsst > Theil 2.4 speakers

 

[grawk]

Do you already have the squeezebox? Is there a reason you aren't going to go with an airport express?

 

[blessingx]

If you want to use lossless, grawk has a good point. Not sure if you're considering, but with Airport Express refurbs going for $99, you'd save about $200. Haven't heard a digital out shootout though between the APX and Squeezebox2.

For maximum effeciency you'd be using different lossless codecs. ALAC (Apple Lossless) for the APX and FLAC (though you could use ALAC, etc., but FLAC is natively supported) for the Squeezebox2. Either could be used with a PC or Mac. Little reason to use WAV/AIFF (especially over the network - though with SlimServer you may transcoding on the fly some codecs). iTunes/Airtunes for APX. SlimServer for SB.

APX is a little slow getting a lock with some DACs. I didn't have a problem. SB has that great display and remote (getting away from the computer). Also lots of thrid party support and cool RSS screensaver feeds.

APX can be used as a portable router and if used with a Mac can be expanded with Airfoil. Both can stream internet radio, but SlimServer is a bit better here.* All give and takes.

[size=xx-small]* You should be able to use SlimServer with either- SlimServer natively with SB and streaming back to iTunes with APX.[/size]

 

[IstariAsuka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gdg Your input is very instructive and corroborates much of my own research. One thing I didn't mention was that I plan to use a Squeezebox (into a moderatly high end system) so I don't believe that the advantages of Coreaudio would be realized. I could be wrong about that and let me know if I am. Ps I've got my eye on an iMac G5 (1.8 version). PPS Is there any price to be paid for lossless compression if using a Squeezebox. (I understand wav. files are best, but again, I could be wrong) I would be going Mac or PC > Big Ben > Tact 2.0s Room Correction Processor > Benchmark Dac1 > Bryston 4bsst > Theil 2.4 speakers

The benefit of what he was talking about with CoreAudio is that on the Mac your soundcard will, without any work on your part, spew out the audio bit-perfectly. This is a good thing. On windows it'll require varying amounts of work, depending upon soundcard chosen and software used, since you have to set up ASIO or Kernal Streaming. In this sense, it's easier on a Mac (it's not HARD on a PC, though).

There is no reason to use wave files. Various lossless codecs are better, since they are smaller files, and because they're taggable. There is no quality loss, hence the name--so they're sonically identical to unadultured waves. On iTunes you'll likely use Apple Lossless, while on a PC you have some choices, but the most common is FLAC.

 

[gdg]

Hmmm...I learn a little more everyday.
By the way the reasons I'm going with a Squeezebox are:
1) Remote control
2) I could only find the one kind of reciever for APX and it only had optical out (my predjudice is towards coax)
3) The squeezebox seems to be gaining fairly wide recognition for both it's sonic quality and very practical slimserver software.

Don't get me wrong. I'm always open to new ideas. Up untill today I never even considered compression. The people over at Empiric Audio (who seem right on the cutting edge of the computer thing) claim that wav. files give the best results when using itunes (apple) or foobar(PC). I'm not sure how that fits in to the ethernet thing but one possibility that compression raises is going to a Mac Mini (only 80gigs but very cool).

 

[blessingx]

Are they saying there are sonic advantages to uncompessed (WAV/AIFF) over lossless (ALAC/FLAC/etc.)? You hear that occasionally, but provided the encoder and decoder are up to par there should be no difference between the two (data or audible).

The SB2 (if I understand it - someone correct me if I'm wrong) streams MP3, FLAC, and WAV natively and transcodes the rest (so for instance you could still use ALAC and stream WAV). For the network though keep in mind depending on your network setup, your files will go to a router then SB2 (so streaming double), so lossless does helps prevent drops. And as you mentioned it has drive savings advantages.

I haven't used FLAC on a Mac since ALAC was introduced, but when I did I encoded with FLACer and MacFLAC. Tag support wasn't great then, so I'd definitely look into that. You'd want things tagged to take advantage or SlimServers browse and search (and display) properties. MediaRage may be able to help.

 

[Nospam]

Keyspan makes a remote control for controlling iTunes with an Airport Express. Amazon has a deal on it right now, for around $28 after rebate.

 

[gdg]

I need a remote and a display.

 

[Little J040]

APX is definately one of my best investments IMHO, because of it wireless router and very good optical out again IMO. Where is this remote, I've been wondering if they made any!

 

[jesse_w]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka There is no reason to use wave files.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't compressed lossless require more processing power for decoding?

jesse

 

[blessingx]

You're right. If that counteracts increased router processing, additional HD spins, greater HD inefficiency, etc. (not to mention psychological bills required with no real tag support) of WAVs, I'm not sure.