[austonia]

http://news.com.com/2100-1041_3-5181...l?tag=nefd_top

if succesful, companies like Creative and Rio may have to pay Apple for thier hierarchically-ordered menu systems.

edit: maybe I spoke too soon? I am trying to read the patent application but its hard to follow. Some parts at the end relate specifically to the iPod and its wheel-based input.

http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...RS=20040055446

 

[carlin]

This is good, I am sure apple is tired of these half ass companies (*cough* dell) who take the iPods interface and make it their own by changing very tiny things. I hope this does play through...

 

[Csidinim]

Quote:

Originally posted by carlin This is good, I am sure apple is tired of these half ass companies (*cough* dell) who take the iPods interface and make it their own by changing very tiny things. I hope this does play through...

What about all of those other companies that borrow from it and make it better or provide consumers with more choices?

 

[MN Ham Phones]

Quote:

Originally posted by Csidinim What about all of those other companies that borrow from it and make it better or provide consumers with more choices?

Let 'em invent their own interface....Apple spent millions getting it right and should be allowed a patent to finish capitalizing on that.

 

[Sweet Spot]

If we're talking about the GUI and OS, Apple didn't invent either. They paid for outside companies to program them. And I think we need to get our facts straight about exactly what they're trying to protect here. I mean, if were talking about the basic interface and how the menu is browsed by the end user, it's pretty easy to see that the existing design is a play off of other existing GUI's. (Not talking about the DAP market necessarily) So when you say 'changing little things', the same thing is applied here.

 

[MN Ham Phones]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sweet Spot If we're talking about the GUI and OS, Apple didn't invent either

Nope. Different argument

Talking about the scroll wheel and menu system used on the iPod. The iPod was the first hard drive based music player that had an interface you could easily navigate the 100s/1000s of songs stored on it. A few players now are hardware feature competitive, but Apple was first to make it usable. Yes, I'm a bit biased.

 

[Cor]

Basically this is the same thing as if someone invented a new kind of personal transport and then somebody completely different came along and patented the idea of sticking a steering wheel on it. It's pure greedy exploitation of a flawed patent system.

 

[carlin]

like what, which player exactly are you talking about? iRiver is nowhere close, its that crappy joystick thing, the nomad has the little scroll nobby thing...which player are you talking about...?




Quote:

Originally posted by Csidinim What about all of those other companies that borrow from it and make it better or provide consumers with more choices?

 

[Sczervok]

I don't really understand... from reading and comprenhending as much as I could... (those damn legal people... why do they have to be so friken cryptic?)

Apple just seems to want to patent a menu system that is used in almost every DAP out there.
The Rio500 was out hella long before apple's iPod, and it has a hierarchical menu system.

Either that, or Apple is getting a patent on how the menu is arranged... which is kinda stupid, cause I doubt anyone would completely copy the iPod menu system so that a previous iPod user would faintly be familiar with it...

The GUI costing millions of dollars to come up with? I don't know about that... I bet a programmer could make a menu system on a computer, and convert it to a portable device in less than a day.

I did not really see anything about a 'wheel' in the patent... all it said was about how the menu system was arranged, how it would function.

It somehow relates to when that one theme park tried to patent the word 'land' in their name.

 

[4P4me]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sweet Spot If we're talking about the GUI and OS, Apple didn't invent either. They paid for outside companies to program them. And I think we need to get our facts straight about exactly what they're trying to protect here. I mean, if were talking about the basic interface and how the menu is browsed by the end user, it's pretty easy to see that the existing design is a play off of other existing GUI's. (Not talking about the DAP market necessarily) So when you say 'changing little things', the same thing is applied here.

I'm not sure that's true necessarily. The only other "jukeboxes" that were out there when the IPod was introduced were the Nomad Jukebox 1 and the Archos, and the PJB, that I remember anyway. Of these, the only UI that may have been similar to the Ipod might have been the NJB1, or vice versa as it may be.

The Archos had the file tree system, and I'm not sure about the PJB.

As far as other things using this type of UI, I'd be interested in the other devices you're thinking of.

 

[CheewyMuffin]

if you ask me this is ludicros. I think my Rio Karma's interface is way superior to the ipod.

 

[DragonFly]

Quote:

Originally posted by carlin This is good, I am sure apple is tired of these half ass companies (*cough* dell) who take the iPods interface and make it their own by changing very tiny things.

Riiiiiight.

 

[Edwood]

Yes.

Apple is truly an innovative company that designs products years in advance, waits until it is a standard, older technology, puts it in a pretty box, doubles or triples the price, and then puts it on the market.

-Ed

 

[e-r0ck]

pfft. i dont get why anyone would support this... any consumer i mean. why would you want one company to have the rights to anything.

i had an ipod and an archos recorder and an archos multimedia. now i have an ihp. i hope someone kicks iriver's ass next year so the technology can move on and get bigger and better. i dont see how anyone could view this as a "good" thing. (except for apple

)

 

[Sweet Spot]

Quote:

I'm not sure that's true necessarily. The only other "jukeboxes" that were out there when the IPod was introduced were the Nomad Jukebox 1 and the Archos, and the PJB, that I remember anyway. Of these, the only UI that may have been similar to the Ipod might have been the NJB1, or vice versa as it may be.As far as other things using this type of UI, I'd be interested in the other devices you're thinking of.

Yeah, I'm following you totally. It's such a fine line that they've drawn here though. Have you looked at that second link that Austin provided ? It's really nuts man...I could barely get through a third of those outlines without getting really tired !

I'm not necessarily meaning to say that other DAP's or devices have an exact same method of a menu hierarchy, but rather 'similar' where it's easy to see that a human being who is a programmer, might have gotten some rudimentary ideas from what to build their GUI from. It seems like a very basic rule to follow in the business. Besides that, if you look at the iPods GUI in particular, one can see that the method they use seems like the most logical design derived from past ideas which one might be able to find if they're so inclined.

As for what I may be able to offer as proof, I'd really need to be very interested with all this in order to find something of an uncanny resemblance, but I'm not. If I happen to remember or come across something, I'll be sure to post it.

P.S. I can't quite get over the feeling that I've seen similar GUI's before...think about it, there's a lot of stuff out there, we all must have seen something in the B.i. erra that resembles said menu system.