Any large gains from moving to DAC with MP3s as source files?

[MikalCarbine257]

I've been reading up more and more on external DACs, MP3 sample and bit rates, etc etc and I was curious if there is much of a gain from moving to an external DAC from an Audigy 2 ZS when the majority of music are MP3s within the 192kbps-384kpbs/44khz format with a few FLAC collections. Before I go dive in and spend money that will get me no where with sound quality with my music I figured I'd ask you guys.

I did a little test of my own today, I played a cd directly from the CD drive and then compared it to my 192kpbs/44khz rip. I also compared a FLAC rip of the same cd to the lower quality songs. I could rarely hear the difference. This may be because of my sound setup though? I am using Winamp with otachan's asio out plugin to my creative asio driver (the native with audigy 2 zs) with my DT770Pro/80ohm. Could it be that I didn't hear the difference because my source is just crappy?

Any input will be appreciated

 

[MikalCarbine257]

Anyone? I've read that MP3s from 128kbps and upwards will sound better but I just want some verification from the pros

 

[diego]

I am no pro but my opinion is that you will hear a difference with a good DAC. I used to have an Audigy2 ZS and I have also heard several DACs and they all sounded better than the Audigy. In fact, it is much easier to hear the difference between it and a Dac than between a CD and a 192kbps mp3. A high quality mp3 is difficult to tell from the CD using any reasonable cost system.

It's up to you to decide if the differences are worth the extra money for the Dac though.

 

[terriblepaulz]

For me, an external DAC is the only way to play lossless files. I could play them on my iPod, but I don't think that's a revealing enough source, and the battery drain is killer. Beyond that, it depends on the specific unit, but just about any moderately priced dac/amp combo playing lossless files will outshine an iPod.

 

[mcmyers]

I listen primarily to mp3s, and when I had a Predator I used to attach it to both my iPod and my laptop simultaneously. I could play the same song from each and flip back and forth between them. The Predator DAC sounded significantly better than the iPod. And that was with mp3s. So I think you'll hear a difference.

 

[FallenAngel]

Of course there is, but you'll like it even more when you move to lossless or at least 320kpbs (which I still can't really tell the difference between).

 

[darwinshardhat]

To answer your question... yes I have no doubt. Even the cheaper external DAC's usually outperform your internal sound card DAC.

I would recommend starting out with improving the source, then moving down the foodchain by swapping out any highly compressed music files with FLAC files if you still have the original source material. That's an upgrade in itself and only costs time, even if the differences at this time are only subtle at best. You'll grow into them if you hang out here long enough.

I theorize part of the reason you can't tell the difference between many mp3 and native rate files is because you are listening to a computer headphone output with 80 Ohm headphones. While the computer sufficiently drives your headphones, it is probably not putting out enough current to really get you the soundstage and dynamic range your phones are capable of.

I was amazed at how my existing AKG K240/50 Ohm headphones performance came to life with a fairly entry level headphone amp. Suddenly I had some soundstage and I understand what the word means now! I then started re-ripping my entire CD collection in ALAC. My next step is a portable combo DAC/Headphone Amp to take my cheap-o computer and iPod DAC's out of the equation. So far the differences are astounding and it will only get better.

 

[MikalCarbine257]

Thanks for the information, I've been reading elsewhere too that a good start before a DAC is to invest in an AMP. I've been looking into the M^3 as a good start and will begin looking further into amps

 

[sonci]

This is really an interesting argument.
A good quality external DAC will amplifie the crackle and noise of the low bitrate mp3,
After upgrading my PC sound (I'm not talking only about the dac), I cant hear to the mp3 files anymore, maybe except some really good ripped.
I still recommend you to upgrade, even if you have "only one flac album" (SOD&GOM), but I recommend to start with the speakers and ampli, and the sound will bloom even with the Audigy..

 

[krmathis]

Yeah, imo you gain sound quality from using a high quality external DAC even when playing back MP3 files. Of course you may (or will) benefit further from lossless files, but that should not stop you from going the external DAC route.

 

[MikalCarbine257]

I've read cheap DACs aren't so great buy my budget is limited to around $200 for a DAC, any recommendations? I don't need any fancy inputs like MIDI and what not like the E-MU 0404 USB has...

 

[apatN]

A better source will give you better sound quality. A shame if you were only to play mp3s through it though as mp3 is inferior to lossless.

 

[Taikero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikalCarbine257 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I've read cheap DACs aren't so great buy my budget is limited to around $200 for a DAC, any recommendations? I don't need any fancy inputs like MIDI and what not like the E-MU 0404 USB has...

Here, I'll just link you to my post on the EMU 0404 USB. Main point: The EMU 0404 isn't just for recording engineers and people who need the extras. It's a good DAC with a mediocre amp inside for a great price. That's what Head-Fiers buy it for primarily. Also, balanced output is nice no matter what for future amp options.

Why you shouldn't worry about buying the EMU 0404 USB

 

[darwinshardhat]

you'll want a PC DAC with a pre-amp/headphone amp. A DAC alone wouldn't give you the necessary volume controlled output for your headphones. From what I hear the E-MU 0404 is a good choice at your price point. I don't know too much about these solutions though so I'll leave it to others to recommend. This question does come up in threads very regularly so you should be able to find many options and opinions (lots of those!) right here on head-fi.

 

[MikalCarbine257]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taikero /img/forum/go_quote.gif Here, I'll just link you to my post on the EMU 0404 USB. Main point: The EMU 0404 isn't just for recording engineers and people who need the extras. It's a good DAC with a mediocre amp inside for a great price. That's what Head-Fiers buy it for primarily. Also, balanced output is nice no matter what for future amp options. Why you shouldn't worry about buying the EMU 0404 USB

Quote:

Originally Posted by darwinshardhat /img/forum/go_quote.gif you'll want a PC DAC with a pre-amp/headphone amp. A DAC alone wouldn't give you the necessary volume controlled output for your headphones. From what I hear the E-MU 0404 is a good choice at your price point. I don't know too much about these solutions though so I'll leave it to others to recommend. This question does come up in threads very regularly so you should be able to find many options and opinions (lots of those!) right here on head-fi.

Thanks for the advice, I don't look down on the EMU0404 because of the extra capabilities but it is a larger unit because of the extras and I'm curious if I can find an equal/better unit that is a little smaller. I am currently living in a college dorm and space doesn't come in plenty. I'll definitely consider this unit now, I have done prior research on it also. My primary concern now is finding a decent amp for my DT770Pro/80's, if you guys have any suggestions please see my thread here:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f5/loo...-range-407301/

Thanks!