4G - 20gb or 40gb - That is the question!

[Derek N]

Ok, guys I need some of your knowledge. I am mostly a lurker and have read as many threads on this subject as I could.

I am looking at a player and have narrowed it down to the 4G ipods. Here is my dilemma; trying to decide between the two new versions.

I don't need more capacity then 20gb but when I buy the dock I am up to $340 vs $399. This is not a big difference to me so the decision is harder.

Am I missing something as far as features between the two? Or is the choice just as simple as deciding which capacity i want or price I am willing to pay?

I like the size of the mini but for $50 more I can get the 20gb so I don't quite get that pricing scheme.

Thanks

-Derek N

--> I am also posting a headphone (for ipod) question in the headphone section for those who would like to spread their knowledge.

 

[pank2002]

Also remeber, the 20gig version is significantly thinner than the 40 gig. On paper i dosen't look like anything, but when your actually hold it, it's much thinner.

 

[Derek N]

thanks, this was exactly what I was looking for. I have only had the mini and 20 in my hand as no one around here seems to display the 40gb. I guess they think people handling the similiar 20gb is enough?

-Derek

 

[Illiad]

I've got a 4G 20Gig. This model iPod is almost diminuitive in size and the mini is even smaller. However, the issue for me is now capacity. Were I to make the purchase again, I'd go for the 40Gig. 20Gig is not nearly enough as I've discovered. However YMMV as I rip and playback in .AIFF which is not space friendly. If you are going to use one of the low-res formats such as .mp3, you may be happy with the 20Gig.

Illiad

 

[sc53]

I think the 40 GB is only 1 mm thicker than the 20 GB! It is really small and light, in any event, so I don't think I would use size as my deciding factor. I would go for the larger hard drive because in the future you may decide you want to rip at a higher level of resolution (Apple lossless sounds much better than MP3 IMO) and with the 40 GB you'll have that option. Every time I've gone for the smaller hard drive on any computer, I've regretted it. Somehow I always end up wishing I had more space.

 

[GSTom1]

My philosophy is to always go for as much space as you can afford. You may not think you need the space now, but if you end up keeping your player several years, you might need the space later on. Running out of space means you have to swap tracks/albums out, while you don’t have to worry if you had excess space. Plus, you can use the excess space to store other non-music files.

 

[kugino]

i agree with GSTom1...if you can afford it, get the larger 40gb. even if you don't fill it up with music, you can use it to back up your files...if apple ever adds additional functionality (like home on the ipod), you'll have plenty of hard disc space to mess around with.

 

[pank2002]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sc53 I think the 40 GB is only 1 mm thicker than the 20 GB! It is really small and light, in any event, so I don't think I would use size as my deciding factor. I would go for the larger hard drive because in the future you may decide you want to rip at a higher level of resolution (Apple lossless sounds much better than MP3 IMO) and with the 40 GB you'll have that option. Every time I've gone for the smaller hard drive on any computer, I've regretted it. Somehow I always end up wishing I had more space.

more like 0,4cm; the 20gig is 1,4cm width and the 40gig is 1,8cm width.

 

[Derek N]

Thanks for all the replies!

I am familiar with the mp3 format. How much space does the lossless format take up. Perhaps an easier way to say this is, in lossless format how many albums would fit on the 40gb or 20gb for that matter.

-Derek

 

[pank2002]

Well, it really depends on what kind of music you encode to lossless. Fx Rock and especially Lo-Fi rock like the Raveonettes is rally hard to encode to lossless and will have some crazy bitrate around 1000kbps. Fx the first Raveonettes EP (Whip it on) is like 160 for 25 min. (with APE -- a lossless codec.) Other kinds of music is 'easier' (as in, getting a smaller file) to make lossless copies of. I think classical should be fairly easy encode to lossless.
A normal rock album on around 45-50 min is normally no bigger than 300megs and usually no smaller than 220megs (in my experience.)

Is lossless worth it? Well, you won't ever have to rerip your cd collection, so in that way yes, but for portable I personally think it's an overkill, but than again in really depends on the phones your using. The only way I can tell the diffrent from a lossless vs a lossy file, is that the soundstage seems wider and bigger on lossless (or cd for that matter.)

 

[adhoc]

dont listen to them; the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

take it from someone who has been through your dilemma (albeit with a zen xtra instead of a ipod):

1. no, you wont need 40gb. 20gb will be fine for, oh, a hundred or so cds in alt preset extreme mp3 quality. i have difficulty filling up my 30gb xtra - currently i'm only just over halfway with what is almost my entire collection of cds.

2. unless you have superlative associated equipment (eg er4s, portable amp), you will be hard pressed to tell the difference between lossless and HQ lossy. and, to make things worse..

3. ..using lossless music will drain your battery in triple quick time. for the ipod with it's relatively weak battery stats, i can imagine this to be a potentially huge problem.

4. a difference of 4mm may sound small, but trust me, in reality it isnt.

5. it does not make sense to get the extra 20gb so that you will be able to transport data files around - i dont think you would be luggin your cables and driver disc around everywhere you go.

6. plus, transferring huge data files onto a DAP will, once again, drain the battery in triple quick time. imo it's not fun to pay $348 for a portable harddrive that needs batteries.

hope that helps.

 

[vranswer]

I respectfully disagree with my right friend's (above) viewpoint. I personally can clearly hear the difference between lossy and lossless upon critical listening. And since I don't wish to listen critically on a regular basis (I just wish to enjoy the music), I encode to ALAC and know I'm getting it all. I don't have to worry about an artifact rearing its ugly head or whatever. You need the disk space to have this luxury. IMHO.

 

[Spankypoo]

Transfering files won't kill the battery, if it's a powered USB or FireWire port. Moot point.

Size: If your goal is to keep it in your shirt/pants pocket, without a case, and carry it as much as possible, size matters. If you're putting it in a case and tossing it in a bag, it doesn't matter. Even the 40 is thin enough to put in the pocket - it's mainly an aesthetic disadvantage, as the 20's a bit sleeker.

Storage: More = better. You'll want the space, sooner or later. If you only plan on keeping it a year, then perhaps the 20's a good idea. I have a 20 and have NO trouble filling it up. And it's always nice to keep 4-5 gigs free in case you're out and need to grab something from someone.

Lossless: You've just got to try it with your headphones and see if you can tell the difference. I, using ER4Ss unamped, on a 3G iPod, can easily tell the difference. It's worth it to me on some things to take the storage hit; on others it's not. Depends on you, and you just have to listen and decide. Many don't notice/care.

So, if you're not a nit-picker about size and have the cash, the 40 would allow you some more freedom.

If size is your concern, go for the 20 - but if it's that big a deal, get a mini. How important is it to you?

 

[adhoc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spankypoo Transfering files won't kill the battery, if it's a powered USB or FireWire port. Moot point.

wrong. try it yourself. it's why manufacturers recommend that you keep your dap plugged into the mains when doing a firmware upgrade - to eliminate the possibility of your battery going flat on you halfway and leaving you with an expensive chunk of (useless) hardware.

afaik, portable daps do not run off the powered port. there is a lot more (power hungry) circuitry that needs to be powered when a dap is used when compared to a portable hdd: opamps need to have some idling current, caps need to be charged, etc etc.

wrt to hdd space - i would recommend that you first look at your needs before jumping for the 40gb. do you have 40gb of mp3s? very few people do legally.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vranswer I respectfully disagree with my right friend's (above) viewpoint. I personally can clearly hear the difference between lossy and lossless upon critical listening. And since I don't wish to listen critically on a regular basis (I just wish to enjoy the music), I encode to ALAC and know I'm getting it all. I don't have to worry about an artifact rearing its ugly head or whatever. You need the disk space to have this luxury. IMHO.

depending on how you look at it, you may have just strengthened my argument: few of us listen critically when commuting.

if i wanted to listen critically, i would not be using an ipod in the first place.

remember though, ymmv, and that is strictly imo/ime. personally i value the battery life/performance ratio that HQ lossy gives me over the peace of mind and low battery life when using lossless.

 

[Pov]

I've got the 20 gig 4G. If I knew that I definitely wanted the dock I might well have sprung for the extra $$$ and gotten the 40 gig just to have the extra capacity in case I needed it, given that with the Dock you are effectively paying $61 for another 20 gigs. OTOH, if you think you are only going to keep the unit for a year or two, by then you'll probably see 60 gig or more units at the same price by the time you are ready to upgrade.

I have a little under 5 gigs of music on my iPod right now. I rip my CDs using EAC and encode in MP3 format using LAME at its "alt preset standard" setting. I've done a lot of experimenting and found this to be the best overall compromise between sound quality and file size. Average CD will be somewhere in the neighborhood of 70-80 mb. Most of the time (in fact, except in a few rare circumstances) I can't tell the difference between that and the source material.