Schiit Jotunheim Review / Preview - Head-Fi TV
Jul 16, 2017 at 2:21 PM Post #4,741 of 6,468
If you're using the Jot as a DAC you won't get the tube effect. Vali 2 is okay as a tube pre for Jot but you're not really upgrading your sound, just changing it. It might be worth going for a better amp or DAC instead.
 
Jul 16, 2017 at 2:24 PM Post #4,742 of 6,468
I would like to try out a tube amp or a tube sound between the Jot and my headphone and as preamp without spending too much.
To continue using the Jot internal DAC as source, your only option is Jot as preamp to an outboard tube amp. A balanced tube amp will get expensive, so you'd have to go with one of the single-ended tube amps.
 
Last edited:
Jul 16, 2017 at 2:52 PM Post #4,743 of 6,468
Hello...Love the Jot/internal DAC with my Audioquest Nightowls-balanced cable and as pre-amp with my Audioengine N22 Amp. I would like to try out a tube amp or a tube sound between the Jot and my headphone and as preamp without spending too much. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance

If you still want to use the Jot as an amp then the only way to get tubes in the audio chain would be to get a DAC with tubes and the only DACs that have tubes and a balanced output is the MHDT Pagoda, about $1700 if you want balanced, they also have a SE model (Stockholm 2) with tubes. Another alternative would be to get the Saga (SE) that @cskippy noted in his post or the Freya if you want to go balanced.

I think it might be cheaper to just get a amp with a tube buffer like the Vali2 that was mentioned above or if you want a more flexible amp then the Garage 1217 Ember II would be my recommendation.
 
Jul 18, 2017 at 12:18 PM Post #4,744 of 6,468
If you still want to use the Jot as an amp then the only way to get tubes in the audio chain would be to get a DAC with tubes and the only DACs that have tubes and a balanced output is the MHDT Pagoda, about $1700 if you want balanced, they also have a SE model (Stockholm 2) with tubes. Another alternative would be to get the Saga (SE) that @cskippy noted in his post or the Freya if you want to go balanced.

I think it might be cheaper to just get a amp with a tube buffer like the Vali2 that was mentioned above or if you want a more flexible amp then the Garage 1217 Ember II would be my recommendation.
Actually he doesn't have to use an balanced tube dac if he wants tube sound to keep doing balanced. I don't know if you are aware of this or not, From the schiit engineer email back,due to the way the jotunheim is design it also does balanced when the RCA input connection.

So his options are far more open, so he can still get any tube dac while still being able to use balanced.
 
Last edited:
Jul 18, 2017 at 12:46 PM Post #4,745 of 6,468
Actually he doesn't have to use an balanced tube dac if he wants tube sound to keep doing balanced. I don't know if you are aware of this or not, From the schiit engineer email back,due to the way the jotunheim is design it also does balanced when the RCA input connection.

So his options are far more open, so he can still get any tube dac while still being able to use balanced.

I do know that you have to don't have to use a balanced DAC to keep using the balanced output. But it you want a balanced DAC with a tube stage there aren't many out there.
 
Jul 20, 2017 at 6:39 AM Post #4,747 of 6,468
Can someone please explain, what I would lose by going to a unbalanced DAC like a Bitfrost (either version) as opposed to the balanced internal DAC of the Jotunheim? I am using a balanced cable to my Audioquest Nightowl headphones. Does that negate the balanced output chain? Thanks
 
Jul 20, 2017 at 6:43 AM Post #4,748 of 6,468
Can someone please explain, what I would lose by going to a unbalanced DAC like a Bitfrost (either version) as opposed to the balanced internal DAC of the Jotunheim? I am using a balanced cable to my Audioquest Nightowl headphones. Does that negate the balanced output chain? Thanks
You won't lose much, and the Jot will output balanced anyway. Bifrost, or even mimby, will sound better than the Jot dac.
 
Jul 21, 2017 at 5:42 PM Post #4,749 of 6,468
Tech support question:

I just got my Jot and was planning to use it as the bedside headphone amp for playing music from my Pixel XL Android device. The problem is when I connect my phone to the Jot's USB DAC input using an OTG cable, the pixel does not recognize the Jot as a device. My wife has the same phone, just slightly older, but her's works perfectly. Is there any setting in my phone I need to adjust? I have no idea why her's works fine while mine doesn't at all. It's probably some kind of phone issue, nothing wrong with the jot I'd imagine.
 
Last edited:
Jul 21, 2017 at 5:56 PM Post #4,750 of 6,468
Tech support question:

I just got my Jot and was planning to use it as the bedside headphone amp for playing music from my Pixel XL Android device. The problem is when I connect my phone to the Jot's USB DAC input using an OTG cable, the pixel does not recognize the Jot as a device. My wife has the same phone, just slightly older, but her's works perfectly. Is there any setting in my phone I need to adjust? I have no idea why her's works fine while mine doesn't at all. It's probably some kind of phone issue, nothing wrong with the jot I'd imagine.
Similar situation. Two identical Nexus 5X phones. One works with a particular DAC (not Jot), the other doesn't. The phones have the latest Android 7.1.2, the same as yours I assume. I am planning to do a factory reset of the phone that doesn't work with the DAC but haven't done it yet. The mystery is not solved yet. If you find an answer please post here.
 
Jul 23, 2017 at 12:41 AM Post #4,751 of 6,468
I own a Jot with DAC module, Mimby, and Bimby with the HD650 headphones. To me, the tonal balance and characteristics throughout low, mid, and high frequencies is fairly consistent between all 3 DACs. The biggest difference is the soundstage and separation increasing with the Mimby and slightly more so with Bimby. It is more noticeable with good recordings, with the difference between Jot DAC and Mimby about 2x greater than between Mimby and Bimby (Law of diminishing returns). Bimby does seem to have a slightly warmer sound overall compared with Jot DAC and Mimby and is my favorite of the three. Value-wise, you won't be disappointed with Mimby.

Thanks for your reply. I recently acquired a Jot+DAC and the JDS Labs Element. When I first heard the Element, I had it a whole week longer than the Jot, I immediately fell in love with how it sounded. My 48ohm Shure SRH-840 sounded full-throated and confident. I don't know how else to articulate that sound quality. It was not louder, it was fuller. And the soundstage was great.

Then I learned about the Jot. I was so impressed with the specs and Schiit seemed a favorite in the forum so I took a chance with the Jot+DAC. When it arrived, it was shrill. I could not stand it. My friend suggested burning it in. So I did. At high gain, I plugged in the SRH840. Turned the Jot knob to 3 o'clock or approximately 75% and played pink noise overnight. when I awoke, the sound was much better. But, it remains much brighter than the Element. The 3D imaging of sound also remains inferior to that of the Element. I have run the pink noise only for one night. I will run the pink noise exercise again for a total of five nights and then see whether the Jot improves further.

To diagnose, I isolated the Jot amp from its onboard DAC by using the Element as the source. Sure enough, the Element sound signature shined through which convinced me that the brightness was due to the Jot's onboard DAC. I tried to do the reverse; I made the Jot be the source for the Element. I had a little trouble at first until I figured out that the Jot controls the volume of the pre out RCA jacks. To get a listenable volume, I had to turn the Jot knob to 12 o'clock and the Element knob to around 6:30 or bearing 190 degrees. This is the position where the Element's volume becomes equal on both sides. The sound was definitely brighter even at lower volumes.

Here's the problem: I want to like the Jot+DAC. I don't want to return it, but it's hell bent on convincing me otherwise. The amp portion is actually fantastic, but the onboard DAC is hear-damagingly bright, flattens a 3D image, and it simply feels like I am playing really loud music inside a cramped cardboard box; it feels so claustrophobic. It squeezes dynamic range so everything is fast and whispers are essentially normal voices and the loud parts of songs seem to lose their expressive characteristics. While all details are there, they do not necessarily grab attention anymore. In Michael Jackson's Billy Jean, the intro has maracas. With the SRH-840 plugged into my MacBook Pro directly, they grab your attention. There is more to that intro that becomes unnoticeable despite them still being heard from within the Jot+DAC. But when I plug in the SRH-840 to the Element, then the experience is so much more pleasureable and visceral.

I am a pianist. My piano is placed unfortunately at a corner in my house where the acoustics are such that if I hit the keys strong enough, the octaves above middle C, the sound seems to float only in that corner and jumble up and I hear a slow moving wah wah wah. My Jot+DAC exhibits this in the SRH-840. In short, aside from the sibilance, the higher frequencies seem to lose control.

Unfortunately, I had to travel only after a week of receiving the Jot. This is why I was able to do the pink noise exercise only for one night. And what's worse is when I get back, I will be past the 15 days where Schiit will accept my return.

So, I may end up having to sell the Jot+DAC at a loss. I'm a little disheartened. In any case, I too was thinking of purchasing the Bifrost Multibit to replace the onboard DAC. Although, I am torn because then it defeats the purpose of the all-in-one chassis which was one of the selling points of the Jot. I wonder if despite being past their return policy if they will still let me return at least the onboard DAC and replace it with a purchase of a Bifrost Multibit.

Thanks to your thoughtful post, I think there is a Bifrost Multibit in my future.
 
Jul 23, 2017 at 12:57 AM Post #4,753 of 6,468
Thanks for your reply. I recently acquired a Jot+DAC and the JDS Labs Element. When I first heard the Element, I had it a whole week longer than the Jot, I immediately fell in love with how it sounded. My 48ohm Shure SRH-840 sounded full-throated and confident. I don't know how else to articulate that sound quality. It was not louder, it was fuller. And the soundstage was great.

Then I learned about the Jot. I was so impressed with the specs and Schiit seemed a favorite in the forum so I took a chance with the Jot+DAC. When it arrived, it was shrill. I could not stand it. My friend suggested burning it in. So I did. At high gain, I plugged in the SRH840. Turned the Jot knob to 3 o'clock or approximately 75% and played pink noise overnight. when I awoke, the sound was much better. But, it remains much brighter than the Element. The 3D imaging of sound also remains inferior to that of the Element. I have run the pink noise only for one night. I will run the pink noise exercise again for a total of five nights and then see whether the Jot improves further.

To diagnose, I isolated the Jot amp from its onboard DAC by using the Element as the source. Sure enough, the Element sound signature shined through which convinced me that the brightness was due to the Jot's onboard DAC. I tried to do the reverse; I made the Jot be the source for the Element. I had a little trouble at first until I figured out that the Jot controls the volume of the pre out RCA jacks. To get a listenable volume, I had to turn the Jot knob to 12 o'clock and the Element knob to around 6:30 or bearing 190 degrees. This is the position where the Element's volume becomes equal on both sides. The sound was definitely brighter even at lower volumes.

Here's the problem: I want to like the Jot+DAC. I don't want to return it, but it's hell bent on convincing me otherwise. The amp portion is actually fantastic, but the onboard DAC is hear-damagingly bright, flattens a 3D image, and it simply feels like I am playing really loud music inside a cramped cardboard box; it feels so claustrophobic. It squeezes dynamic range so everything is fast and whispers are essentially normal voices and the loud parts of songs seem to lose their expressive characteristics. While all details are there, they do not necessarily grab attention anymore. In Michael Jackson's Billy Jean, the intro has maracas. With the SRH-840 plugged into my MacBook Pro directly, they grab your attention. There is more to that intro that becomes unnoticeable despite them still being heard from within the Jot+DAC. But when I plug in the SRH-840 to the Element, then the experience is so much more pleasureable and visceral.

I am a pianist. My piano is placed unfortunately at a corner in my house where the acoustics are such that if I hit the keys strong enough, the octaves above middle C, the sound seems to float only in that corner and jumble up and I hear a slow moving wah wah wah. My Jot+DAC exhibits this in the SRH-840. In short, aside from the sibilance, the higher frequencies seem to lose control.

Unfortunately, I had to travel only after a week of receiving the Jot. This is why I was able to do the pink noise exercise only for one night. And what's worse is when I get back, I will be past the 15 days where Schiit will accept my return.

So, I may end up having to sell the Jot+DAC at a loss. I'm a little disheartened. In any case, I too was thinking of purchasing the Bifrost Multibit to replace the onboard DAC. Although, I am torn because then it defeats the purpose of the all-in-one chassis which was one of the selling points of the Jot. I wonder if despite being past their return policy if they will still let me return at least the onboard DAC and replace it with a purchase of a Bifrost Multibit.

Thanks to your thoughtful post, I think there is a Bifrost Multibit in my future.
IS it so important to have it all in one box? You could just stack the bimby and Jot on top of each other, it looks pretty neat and has the same footprint. If you use Schiit's pyst RCA's, you won't get any excess cable mess either.
 
Jul 23, 2017 at 1:03 AM Post #4,754 of 6,468
Its a statement like the above that makes me scratch my head, if the output impedance does not change between high and low gain what is causing the differences noted? This means that the Jot is coloring the sound in some way which is a contradiction to what people say is a very transparent amp.
I just found one extra bonus of owning Jot. It offer you high gain and low gain mode. Not just volume is different, the sound signature is also audible different. In low gain, the vocal sounds more close and immersing, and high gain give you more bass and treble extension and dynamic. You could switch them accordingly when you listen to different kind of music. Pretty obvious from my own perspective. Give it a try.

Hi Chris,

I too experienced this, although I discovered shortly thereafter that it was my fault. I was listening to Amazon Prime Music. Their service client has its own volume control which defaults to 50%. I realized that there was an EQ difference between low and high gains because of this; at low gain, the sound was airy, at high gain the sound showed more bass.

After I put the Amazon Music client's volume to 100%, switching between high and low gain I was no longer able to discern an EQ difference.

Peter
 
Jul 23, 2017 at 1:09 AM Post #4,755 of 6,468
IS it so important to have it all in one box? You could just stack the bimby and Jot on top of each other, it looks pretty neat and has the same footprint. If you use Schiit's pyst RCA's, you won't get any excess cable mess either.

Part of the reason I chose the Jot was this all-in-one feature. Ergo, having it all in one box is of importance. But the crux of my post was hardly about its footprint. In fact, I am seriously considering a Bifrost Multibit.

Would you be okay with dropping $500+ on something that causes you pain when you are trying to listen to music?
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top