[Sonic Defender]

   
You're trolling, right? You're basically implying anybody who disagrees with you is wrong. It's your subjective opinion, not objective.

I think it was more an awkwardly worded point he was making, I don't get the sense that he is implying only his viewpoint is correct.

 

[Kukua]

You're trolling, right? You're basically implying anybody who disagrees with you is wrong. It's your subjective opinion, not objective.

the accent is on *my objective position*......pretty straight forward expression actually!!

 

[brokenhat]

I wish they were closed without effecting the sound and black but besides that L.O.V.E. them.

 

[Sonic Defender]

 
I wish they were closed without effecting the sound and black but besides that L.O.V.E. them.

I have returned them to my friend already, a few days back, but I really grew to enjoy the P9, quite a bit. As I have said, once you forget about any notion that there is only one correct approach to representing an audio signal and just listen to the musical experience, clearly the P9 is a very engaging signature. I will continue to hope that B&W make a full on, around $1300-1500 50mm at home headphone. I think it is clear that they have more than enough audio chops to create a seriously compelling headphone, and up to now they have just been after mobile, which while a massive market, I think their core customers are actually ideal for a non-portable, statement headphone.
 
I know people will curse about the price point I am suggesting, but that ship has sailed. Seriously invested audio companies aren't going to swim in the budget waters so when they come to market, they are doing so with high-end statement pieces like the P9, which while a great step, it was just the beginning I hope for B&W at this level of headphone design. Same with KEF, I really enjoyed the M500 and feel that a designed for home use model is the way to go. Come on B&W, you need to do this!

 

[peter2]

I am listening to the P9 right now. The album is Scott Hamilton "Nocturnes & Serenades".
 

 
Scott Hamiltons tenor sax is obviously the center of attention. I confess I am not used to closed HPs. My main headphones are Sennheiser HD800S, Focal Elear and Grado PS1000e. The first impression is a heavy veil covering the sound image. But after a while the veil thins out, revealing a full sound with a very deep bass, detailed mid and smooth hights. 
 
The sound is very different to all of my main HPs. Focal Elear comes closest while HD800S is very far away. HD800S is also my favorite HP. Still, I like the sound. I like it very much. It is veiled, encapsulated in a way and at the samtime very rich and detailed.
 
Earlier today I went on a walk with the same album and Audezes iSine 20. I think I was even more impressed with the iSine (both HPs are quite new for me) but the P9 intrigued me more. I am not sure what it is in the P9 that is making my body respond. But it does
 
The P9 are defenitly veiled and bass heavy but the bass is defined and by now way muddled.
 
Oh, I am listening through a microRendu and Mojo right now. I have not fiddeled with the DSP yet with these HPs. Perhaps I will. I have some ideas.

 

[Sonic Defender]

@peter2 we sound very similar in our assessment of the P9, and coincidentally up until I picked up a Z1R, the 800S was my favourite headphone. I wish I had both the Z1R and 800S at the same time, but I never feel good keeping two such expensive headphones on hand. First world guilt perhaps?

 

[peter2]

  @peter2 we sound very similar in our assessment of the P9, and coincidentally up until I picked up a Z1R, the 800S was my favourite headphone. I wish I had both the Z1R and 800S at the same time, but I never feel good keeping two such expensive headphones on hand. First world guilt perhaps?

@Sonic Defender First wold guilt is a very good way of putting it. Now I'm feeling a bit ashamed of having 4 expensive HPs at the same time - and the sad thing is I didn't mention all of them. No I am listening at the same album with Focal Elear. It is the same weight of the music, but still very different. I hesitate to use words as good and bad. The Elears definitly make this album sound cleaner, but with the same warm, darkish sound. But it is still the same sound I am used to, ie the audiophile neutral sound. The P9 are different and interesting. How can a headphone be so warmish and detaild at the same time. It's beyond me. I just remembered the genre I listening to is called cool jazz That's kind of funny.

 

[Sonic Defender]

  @Sonic Defender First wold guilt is a very good way of putting it. Now I'm feeling a bit ashamed of having 4 expensive HPs at the same time - and the sad thing is I didn't mention all of them. No I am listening at the same album with Focal Elear. It is the same weight of the music, but still very different. I hesitate to use words as good and bad. The Elears definitly make this album sound cleaner, but with the same warm, darkish sound. But it is still the same sound I am used to, ie the audiophile neutral sound. The P9 are different and interesting. How can a headphone be so warmish and detaild at the same time. It's beyond me. I just remembered the genre I listening to is called cool jazz That's kind of funny.

Yes, guilt is part of the hobby for some of us. The P9 is an enigma of sorts, it should be perceived as congested yet it isn't, it just manages to be a very listenable and rich signature with a solid amount of detail and timbre despite the mid-bass lift. There were the odd track that I felt didn't fare well with the P9, but they were few and far between in my time with the P9 (that rhymes).
 
There is a very interesting and fairly eclectic Nu-Jazz collection compromised of 18 volumes, many double CD issues called Saint-Germain des Pres-Café that I very much like. There is plenty of excellent music. I started collecting them after finding I think volume 14 in a used music bin. Much of the material is I find quite good, some even excellent, almost all well recorded and again some stunning mixes. If you ever see any of the collection for reasonable prices I say grab and try it. There is a little of it on Tidal if you have that service, but not much and certainly not the best of the collection.

 

[larzy]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but would I benefit from downloading and purchasing the Onkyo HF player for my iPhone? Right now, I have Apple Lossless files transferred to my iPhone and they are played from Apples own music player - the iPhone is connected to an Denon DA10 dac/amp while listening with the B&W P9. The ALAC files have been converted from FLAC files via the Mac app XLD.
 
I just want to make sure I'm not missing out on anything because I have read many places that iPhones are not able to output high-res audio, but since I'm using a dac/amp that should enable the output since the files are ALAC/lossless. I know if I want to playback FLAC files I'd have to use something like Onkyo HF player.

 

[peter2]

  Sorry if this is a stupid question, but would I benefit from downloading and purchasing the Onkyo HF player for my iPhone? Right now, I have Apple Lossless files transferred to my iPhone and they are played from Apples own music player - the iPhone is connected to an Denon DA10 dac/amp while listening with the B&W P9. The ALAC files have been converted from FLAC files via the Mac app XLD.
 
I just want to make sure I'm not missing out on anything because I have read many places that iPhones are not able to output high-res audio, but since I'm using a dac/amp that should enable the output since the files are ALAC/lossless. I know if I want to playback FLAC files I'd have to use something like Onkyo HF player.

 
You say lossless, wich is not highres. If I had my music in ALAC 16/44, I would be very happy to use the default iPhone player. For 24bit and DSD I choose iAudiogate (or Onkyo HF player or anonter high-res player). I think the interface of the iPhone's default player is superior to the other mentioned players and it plays lossless ALAC files very well.

 

[larzy]

   
You say lossless, wich is not highres. If I had my music in ALAC 16/44, I would be very happy to use the default iPhone player. For 24bit and DSD I choose iAudiogate (or Onkyo HF player or anonter high-res player). I think the interface of the iPhone's default player is superior to the other mentioned players and it plays lossless ALAC files very well.

But ALAC can also be coded in 24bit with 48,000 kHz. I have some albums in that encoding as well. Wouldn't that be considered high-res?

 

[peter2]

 
But ALAC can also be coded in 24bit with 48,000 kHz. I have some albums in that encoding as well. Wouldn't that be considered high-res?

Yes, 24/48 is highres. ALAC can be in the same bit deph/sample rate as FLAC. Perhaps the default app can play 24/192 to a compatible DAC, but I have never tested more than 16/44. I do not think the default app is constructed to play high-res files, while apps like iAudiogate and Onkyo is. So if you are on a path to high-res music, one of those apps might be the best solution. Why don't you do a test? You will learn a lot by test things like this and listen for differences in sound, and reflect about design differences.

 

[netdog]

 
But ALAC can also be coded in 24bit with 48,000 kHz. I have some albums in that encoding as well. Wouldn't that be considered high-res?

ALAC can handle all sorts of sample rates up to at least 192kHz and, as you mentioned, bit depths of up to 24, so really the question is what rate and depth are the original source files.
 
IIRC, iOS devices using the music app can handle 24bit and will downsample high sample rates to 48 or 44.1 kHz depending upon the original sample rate.

 

[peter2]

 
ALAC can handle all sorts of sample rates up to at least 192kHz and, as you mentioned, bit depths of up to 24, so really the question is what rate and depth are the original source files.
 
IIRC, iOS devices using the music app can handle 24bit and will downsample high sample rates to 48 or 44.1 kHz depending upon the original sample rate.

Does iOS downsample highres in the default music app even if the iPhone is connected to a hig-res compatible DAC?

 

[netdog]

Connected how?  Via the Lightning connector?  If so, I think it handles up to 192k.