New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Zu or Silver Moon - Advice needed

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
This question has been asked a lot, but please bear another one.

Recently I purchased a HD 650 and Corda HA-2 and and for the first time in maybe a year or so I’m starting to get the feeling of buying more CDs again. Before, it always used to be the pursuit for a better system. The search may never end but right now is a very good time to just sit back and listen.

In any case, the final thing I need is an upgrade cable to complement the HD 650. Even after reading both Tuberoller’s and JaZZ’s excellent reviews on Sennheiser aftermarket cables I still can’t decide between the Zu or Moon Audio silver cable. Before I actually got the HD 650 it was "clear" to me that I would go for the more widespread and supposedly more natural sounding Zu cable since the Moon Audio cable was recounted be too hyperdetailed, hence causing listening fatigue which I am very prone to. However, right now I’m not so sure about it anymore.

Firstly, I was rather afraid of silver due to the supposedly increased treble energy as compared to copper cables. Yet, after having my HD 25-1 upgraded with a silver cable by Larry from Headphile I’m starting to believe that silver might not be too bad after all. The silver cable on my HD 25-1 sort of opened a new window for the music to shine through. I actually took the term “opening a window” from Larry himself but it hits the nail on the head. Well, at times, I do encounter the infamous ‘silver cable treble emphasis’ but that emphasis lies beyond the 8khz mark and I’m prone to the mid highs in the 5-7khz range and some lower highs as well. Further, that treble emphasis only gets annoying on sources such as my portable players.
Secondly, my major issue with the HD 650 lies within its limited treble extension and the slightly too smooth and polite midrange. Sometimes, my upgraded HD 25 have the upperhand in the treble area, i.e. more air, more sparkle. I think sparkle is the right word to use. I want sparkle with the HD 650. And I want more attack in the mids (not upper mids). There’s no veil but I’d like to lift the slightly dark presentation bit a little bit.
Tuberoller said in his review that the Zu was probably designed with the HD600’s veil in mind and has a rather forward midrange. JaZZ’s review on the other hand says that the Zu has more of a recessed midrange (very subtle however). One reason could be that Tuberoller used the HD600 and JaZZ used the 650 as reference headphone for evaluating the cables. I'm rather confused on this issue here.

I am fine with the HD650’s bass right now as it’s among the best I’ve heard but in my opinion it may need a slightly better control/damping to be a first-class headphone.

The Behringer digital EQ which GerG has mentioned is also out of question as I’m not planning on getting an external DAC in the near future and the Behringer 2496 is already quite expensive by itself.

Any input would be very helpful.
post #2 of 19
The best solution (although not always practicable depending on cash flow) is to order both, try them, keep the one that sounds best and return the other one. It's so hard to say what you would like best, because IMO these things are heavily system dependant and listener dependant. I have the Silver Dragon with the HD-650's, and I like it with the rest of my system. There is no trace of brightness or digital harshness, but that may be due to the rest of my system, I don't know. But I never tried the Zu, although I'd like to. The only real way to tell for sure is to try them over a period of time. Wish I could be more helpful.
post #3 of 19
zu mobius is very expensive but i think it has done a very good job in improving the hd 650s, and it does have a slight midrange recession that's hardly noticeable.
post #4 of 19
The Zu is a far more popular cable for the 650, but I think that is just because so few people seem to actually have listened to a fully burnt in SD/650 combo. Full burn in on the SD is at least 200 hours, although it's pretty close to it's final personality by 100 hours.

Honestly I flipped a coin and figured I'd win either way. I think you're probably in the same boat.

The SD does a decent job of pushing through the infamous veil of the 6xx series. I think the rest of your system is going to determine if you get harshness out of the SD or not. My interconnects are silver as well (from larry), driven from an emu 1212m, and I notice details, clarity, and precision, although smoothness can at times be lacking. There definatly was a step up in energy. The music feels more alive compared to the stock cable, more vibrant, but at the same time it also feels a hair colder and more analytical. At the end of the day, for me personally, the SD is more enjoyable to listen to than the stock cable by a good margin. I highly reccomend it.
post #5 of 19
the 650's DO NOT HAVE a veil.


I've had both cables, and i think the SD is for you. I've told a few people here, i feel it does have a more noticable highend, which seems a bit highlighted, smoothed, and more defined. This to me is the main distinciton between the cables, the mobius always seemed to have a better sound stage, but this headphone up top has better resolution. My cable is well broken in with over 300 or so hour so in, probablly alot more by my guess.


I think the SD might add the edge your looking for : ]
post #6 of 19
As has been said before, the 650s have great tonal balance but at the expense of just a little more treble extension. I think the SD added a bit to it, but don't expect miracles. It's a notch up but not a big notch, imo. I had the cable for under 200 hrs., but definitely more than 100 hrs. The SD will certainly add a little sparkle up top too.

I think with silver ICs and the HA-2, you're doing about everything you can to brighten things up. The SD won't change things in a big way.
post #7 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjg
the 650's DO NOT HAVE a veil.
They certainly do with the stock cable.

I had to go back to the stock cable when my SD got lost for a month during moving. I kept thinking that I was imagining the differences, kept trying to convince myself that the feeling of something "missing" was just a placebo... but once I found the SD again and plugged it back in, I knew in seconds that I wasn't imagining the veil or the lack of details or the lack of vibrancy on the stock cable. The SD is for real. Anybody who can't hear the differences between Senn cables needs to be in a different hobby.
post #8 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarecrow
They certainly do with the stock cable.

Anybody who can't hear the differences between Senn cables needs to be in a different hobby.
This issue of a veil has been argued ad nauseum here. The Senns have a SOUND which some refer to as a veil. A cable is NOT going to change the signature sound of these headphones. You'll ned a different headphone for that.

saint.panda, if you really want to change the sound have you considered buying a nice used EQ? SAE made a really nice EQ that can be had on the used market. The use of an EQ or a different amp would do much more to the frequency spectrum than a cable swap. Audiophile purists may have a propblem with an EQ in the signal path, but all CDs are EQ'd during post-production/mastering. My change from a tube amp to a Gilmore sure made a difference in treble extension, but I definitely made a trade-off in other areas.
post #9 of 19
Thread Starter 
Hey, thanks for all the advice.

PhilS, this is very a reasonable and at first hand obvious idea but buying both and returning one would be quite expensive for me considering the shipping costs to Zurich.

stryker, I don't have silver ICs (my ICs will be a copper-silver-gold alloy when they finally get here), it's just the HD 25's cable which is silver and I just took that silver cable as a reference point for my silver assumptions.
I'll consider the eq idea although the downside would be getting another quite expensive cable.

Actually I don't want to change the sound of the HD 650 at all, just improve it a little bit. After passing the initial new-toy stage, I can say that it's still the best headphone I've ever had. Don't know if this opinion will change in the future but right now I am very content.
post #10 of 19
You could meet JaZZ and try both cables.
post #11 of 19
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt
You could meet JaZZ and try both cables.
Today 2:00 pm
Very nice of him
post #12 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by saint.panda
Today 2:00 pm
Very nice of him
I'll be interested to hear your opinions on both cables with the same set of cans. I ALMOST bought a Zu when I thought my SD was gone for good... I found the box with the SD (and other missing cables) about 4 days before I was gonna buy the Zu (was just waiting on a large paycheck).
post #13 of 19
Zu Mobius over Silver Dragon.....Reasons--
The Zu has more treble detail while being less fatiguing at the same time. The SD is a brighter cable.
The Zu has more controlled and deeper bass than the SD.
The Zu while offering more extension in both directions is still the warmer and easier to listen to cable. For such a warm cable it is amazing the amount of deatil this cable lets through.
The Zu is much better built than the SD.
The Zu is much more manageable than the SD.
post #14 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom hankins
The Zu is much better built than the SD.
The Zu is much more manageable than the SD.
Tom,

What does much better built mean in terms of specifics?

Also, I read some people's posts that the Zu was less manageable and more microphonic than the SD. That was from a very few posts as few people have had the chance (opportunity, motivation, interest) to extensively listen to both.
post #15 of 19
I see no problems with the build quality of the SD, and while the SD is a tough beast of a cable to handle, all the reports I've heard are that the Zu is just as unmanagable if not worse. Elaborate?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav: