Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Grado Gripes?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Grado Gripes? - Page 2

post #16 of 44
Quote:
Originally posted by thomas
...This is actually quite common in different industries- for example, in computers, P3's and Celerons at all the different speeds are exactly the same chips, with different parts deliberately disabled and set at different speeds based on what will make intel the most money...
A word of explanation re CPUs... CPU speed is based upon what speed that cpu relaibly tests at. You can get away with overclocking, but there are no guarantees that the part will run reliably at your overclocked speed. It would be to a chip manufacturer's advantage to sell every part for as high a rated speed (and therefore price) as possible and that's what they do. They're just more conservative than the gamers that overclock them because they have to stand behind them. Business is business...
post #17 of 44
Quote:
. It would be to a chip manufacturer's advantage to sell every part for as high a rated speed (and therefore price) as possible and that's what they do

well, not exactly

Pricing and performance has much more to do with business than the actual capabilities of the chip.. A company like intel has to cover all market segments, from $500 entry level systems to the best high-end workstations and servers. Obviously the margins for the expensive high-end chips is much higher, as R&D and production costs for any chip is essentially identical. But if all of their chips were expensive/high performance, they would get much lower sales, as far more people want/can afford the cheaper systems... The only way they can differentiate between the cheap and the high end products is to deliberately make the cheaper products perform worse than the better ones...

They could do that by making seperate production runs for high-end and low-end products, but that would greatly increase their production costs, and any chips that don't perform to spec will have to be thrown out. So instead, they make everything on the same production line, and grade the chips based on possible performance- the better ones will run more reliabilly at high speeds, the ones that aren't as good are crippled and sold at lower prices...

I'm sure companies like grado do somthing similar, they make all the drivers using the same process, then test them, the better ones are wired with better wire/"destressed" and used for expensive models, the worse ones are used in the cheaper models. The rejects are sent to china for SR-40s. Of course they could probably make all their drivers into RS-1s, but then they'd lose out 90% of their sales which are from the cheaper models, and they'd be throwing out piles of defective drivers that aren't quite good enough. Or they could make their SR-60's perform as well as the RS-1s for virtually no additional cost, but then no one would buy the RS-1s.
post #18 of 44
Quote:
Originally posted by thomas

well, not exactly
So instead, they make everything on the same production line, and grade the chips based on possible performance- the better ones will run more reliabilly at high speeds, the ones that aren't as good are crippled and sold at lower prices...
Thomas,
That's basically what I said. The chips are graded while being tested. The higher qualifying chips are sold for a higher price. While the PIIIs and P4s are set to their rated frequency, the Celerons can be overclocked beyond their validated frequency, but again if you do overclock them, you have no guarantees.
I strongly suspect Grado does much the same thing on their production lines. The drivers that test best go into the RS-1s and RS-2s, and so forth... Hey, who knows, maybe Grado had their mfg process so well dialed in that their yield of RS-1 quality drivers is higher than market demand and so they drop an rc network into the cheaper cans to compromise performance, or conversely, perhaps they need to put in an RC network on the RS1s&2s to smooth their FR properly and they run the lesser cans un-compensated.
post #19 of 44
i believe grado manufactures their cans, so you do have to factor in the cost of the equipment to mold the plastic and stuff, and i can olny guess that it's pretty expensive.

i've got a few things i don't like about the insides of grado cans. for one, the cable is secured by a plastic tie with a glob of hot glue melted on it. if the glue gets loose (which happens very often) the cable can move around inside the cup and cause clicking sounds or an intermittent connection. another thing is the way the voice coil is connected to cable. the thin wires from the voice coil are soldered to a little pcboard. the cable wires are soldered to the same pc board. the pcboard isn't very secure, and comes off easily. so if there was a strong tug on the cable, and the hot glue came loose, then the pcboard would come loose, and then it would be the tiny wires from the voice coil that would break. i've read about a few times where this has happened. also i suspect the way the voice coil wires are glued to the diaphram might be the cause of grattle.
post #20 of 44
Quote:
Originally posted by lini
Well, that's what it's all about - simplicity: Good parts don't need correction.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

Less room for errors.....
post #21 of 44
Hmmm, I'm starting to admire Grado Labs more and more. Those guys are smart! They sell a headphoneamp that costs 350 bucks which contains parts that costs peanuts. Secondly they make seven different versions of basiclly the same headphone. Okay some wood here and some OFC cable there, but it's more or less the same design.

Guess Team Grado will crucify me for this one.
post #22 of 44
They also give closer matching drivers to the high-end headphones.

I like Grado's headphones, but frankly their prices are stupid-high. Its the audiophile equivilant of buying one of those crappy Radio Shack stereos because its got 5,000,002 pretty lights.

Grado has something of a monopoly based on quality. There is noplace else to go, so they can charge whatever they want. I think we need some more competition.
post #23 of 44
Sirwar: somewhere ELSE to go? Besides AKG, Sennheiser, Beyerdynamic, Sony, Etymotic, and Koss?
post #24 of 44
Quote:
Sirwar: somewhere ELSE to go? Besides AKG, Sennheiser, Beyerdynamic, Sony, Etymotic, and Koss?
... and Audio-Technica and Stax.
post #25 of 44
Sony sucks, koss is low-end.
Don't know much about Beyerdynamic.
Isn't Ety mainly for their little earbuds?
Sennheiser just doesn't suit my music, sounds lifeless.
AKG, haven't tried them, but I never hear anyone say "Well if you mainly listen to rock, then AKG is the way to go."
Stax = too expensive
Whos Audio-Technica?
post #26 of 44
Quote:
Sony sucks
wow. that's one helluva a blanket statement.
post #27 of 44
Sirwar = Troll
post #28 of 44
First of all, as any of the Grado fans here can tell you, there are *significant* differences in sound as you go up the Grado ladder. I agree that the RS1 and RS2 are overpriced, but they are great headphones. And the rest of the Grado line offer pretty competitive prices. How many headphones can best the SR60 for $69 or the SR80 for $99?



Quote:
Sony sucks, koss is low-end.
Don't know much about Beyerdynamic.
Isn't Ety mainly for their little earbuds?
Sennheiser just doesn't suit my music, sounds lifeless.
AKG, haven't tried them, but I never hear anyone say "Well if you mainly listen to rock, then AKG is the way to go."
Stax = too expensive
Whos Audio-Technica?
Wow, talk about blanket statements.

Sony has a lot of bad stuff, but some GREAT stuff, too.

Beyer makes excellent headphones.

Etys *are* only earbuds... but so what? They're amazing!

I don't even know how to respond to "Sennheiser sounds lifeless"

AKG also makes some great headphones. You might want to try a pair of 401s for rock...

Stax? Not for rock, but wow.

And so on...

Suffice it to say, there is a *lot* of competition in the headphone market, and Grado doesn't have a monopoly by any means.
post #29 of 44
Since I own most of the top end dynamic headphones or have owned them, I'll go ahead and make the statement that Sony basically rules the dynamic headphone world. There's no ifs buts or preferences for a different sound here...they plainly have a single headphone that beats the crud out of the others. I'm pretty confident others would say the same too if they heard THE 'phones.

Sometimes I wonder why I still even own so many headphones.

So no Sony does not suck.
post #30 of 44
Quote:
Sometimes I wonder why I still even own so many headphones.
well, because...

Quote:
Loyal to no single headphone!
Besides, didn't you just typed that you wanted some Stax's again?

Quote:
Loyal to no single headphone!
oh yeah...
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphones (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Grado Gripes?