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Audeze EL-8: The EL-8 is a must-hear at CES 2015 - Page 242

post #3616 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by NZtechfreak View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by cute View Post

So much for proprietary plugs on the EL-8, Audeze mini xlr's would have been much better!

As a general rule proprietary connections suck.

true that. there is a reason that standard connectors are the standards.

post #3617 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by planarmagnetic View Post


The 3.5mm connector needs to be fixed mine is already broken and had to be replaced. It is a simple switch at the factory from soft rubber to ABS. I also expect them to send us the new cables free of charge. And I know Audeze reads these I would like a reply.

Yep, I think for a product of this cost cable replacements for these very early/out of the box failures should not cost the buyer.
post #3618 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by NZtechfreak View Post


Yep, I think for a product of this cost cable replacements for these very early/out of the box failures should not cost the buyer.


My plan is to take the EL8 with me while traveling, now I am gonna be worried all the time about the connectors issue :(

post #3619 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by planarmagnetic View Post


The 3.5mm connector needs to be fixed mine is already broken and had to be replaced. It is a simple switch at the factory from soft rubber to ABS. I also expect them to send us the new cables free of charge. And I know Audeze reads these I would like a reply.


Did you get it replaced under the audeze warranty or from a authorized dealer ? I will be disgusted if they actually tried to fork the cost of the damage on us , considering it is a design or manufacturing issue.
post #3620 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by rs0cal View Post


Did you get it replaced under the audeze warranty or from a authorized dealer ? I will be disgusted if they actually tried to fork the cost of the damage on us , considering it is a design or manufacturing issue.


I just don't understand how this is happening after generations of inventing cables! :confused:


Edited by Dark Ayla - 3/22/15 at 10:59pm
post #3621 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Ayla View Post
 


I just don't understand how this is happening after generations of inventing cables! :confused:

definitely. I've seen way better cabling quality from cheaper headphone companies too, such as Vmoda and Philips with their Fidelio series.

 

I will try to get in touch with either my authorized dealer or Audeze tomorrow. Will update on this process. 

 

I heard Audeze has good quality control on their products, so I really hope this wasn't a rushed job for all the first batch of preorders.


Edited by rs0cal - 3/22/15 at 11:31pm
post #3622 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by money4me247 View Post
 

Not really. They officially state that the differences between the two products is primarily due to improvement in build quality and accessories. They are very transparent about what you are purchasing. Much better than other headphone companies that release the same thing but pretend that they sound drastically different.

 

From Oppo's website:

Official description of PM-1 vs PM-2 (Click to show)

"The OPPO PM-2 Planar Magnetic headphones are characterized by a distillation of the OPPO PM-1’s key acoustic and industrial design features into a more affordable price point. Similar to the OPPO PM-1, the PM-2 is characterized by its natural, dynamic, and engaging sound quality with an emphasis on comfort and reduced weight. The PM-2 uses the same driver as the PM-1, and the same technological breakthroughs are present in the PM-2: the use of a unique 7-layer diaphragm, double-sided spiraling coils, and an FEM-optimized magnet system."

 

"The OPPO PM-1 and OPPO PM-2 share the same primary physical components (including the driver, aluminum frame, removable earpad and cable design, and rotating earcups) but there are a number of changes with regard to the materials used in the construction of the two headphones, as well as with the accessories that each pair of headphones comes with."

 

"Since both headphones utilize the same driver and follow the same acoustic design principles, the PM-2's performance and sound signature are very close to the PM-1, especially when the PM-1 is paired with the alternative earpads. PM-2 owners wanting to experience the PM-1's original sound can purchase the PM-1's original lambskin earpads separately."

 

http://www.oppodigital.com/KnowledgeBase.aspx?KBID=90

 

 

 

What other company in does this exactly? And I mean just the relevant companies at flagship or TOTL level. It's like if the HE-500 and HE-6 or, to a lesser degree, the LCD-2 and LCD-3 sounded the same but you pay twice the price because the build quality and accessories are better. I guess them being transparent about it is fine for those concerned and obviously more people would buy the PM2 because of that but that's a deterrent to their products for me if that's part of their philosophy. I expect at least noticeable improvement in sound if I'm paying double. 

post #3623 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamKing View Post
 

What other company in does this exactly? And I mean just the relevant companies at flagship or TOTL level. It's like if the HE-500 and HE-6 or, to a lesser degree, the LCD-2 and LCD-3 sounded the same but you pay twice the price because the build quality and accessories are better. I guess them being transparent about it is fine for those concerned and obviously more people would buy the PM2 because of that but that's a deterrent to their products for me if that's part of their philosophy. I expect at least noticeable improvement in sound if I'm paying double. 

Well, let me ask it to you this way:

 

Would you rather Oppo intentionally made the PM-2 driver inferior just so there is a bigger sonic gap between the pm-1 and pm-2?? They designed the best sonic entry they could for the flagship-level at $1k+ market niche. Then they made a cheaper alternative taking as few sonic compromises as possible by using cheaper materials. For audiophiles who care most about the sound, that sounds like the best deal to me.

 

personal ramblings - not looking to debate (Click to show)

Is the sonic differences between the Fostex TH600 vs TH900 is really the MSRP difference of $1k? Fostex could have easily used the same drivers in the TH600 as the TH900 and still made mad profit, but they intentionally dumbed down the lower-tier model drivers to give buyers a bigger incentive to purchase the flagship model. AKG routinely repackages the same drivers with slight cosmetic differences and some subtle new tuning and resells their headphones for $400+ price point. (the whole K701/K702/Q701/K712 etc series.) The example of the K7xx massdrop edition of the K702 65th Anniversary edition just shows you how ridiculous it gets. They can make basically the same pair of headphones at the $200 price point for a profit, but they initially release it as a special 65th edition at the $650 MSRP. (I love AKG btw, but I would just never pay full MSRP for any of their stuff). Their $2k K812 flagship can easily be found for $1.5 and I've seen it drop down to $1k. The Beyerdynamic T1 routinely goes down to $750 or less from authorized dealers who are still making profit on these headphones... where did that extra $1.4k price tag come from?

 

The sad fact is that if your headphone is not $1k+, you are not going to be taken seriously as a flagship model nowadays. This is a trend established by Sennheiser and the rest of the companies followed suit. Audeze then went balls to the wall jumping up to the $2k price point. Is the LCD-3 really $1k harder to manufacturer than the LCD-2? They basically use identical build quality materials, so wouldn't the entire $1k+ extra cost is simply for the driver diaphragm, different magnet arrangement, and different tuning? Is actually sonic quality differences between Audeze LCD-X and Audeze LCD-3 really $5k? Honestly, headphone prices are just arbitrary numbers not reflective of manufacturing costs or even sound quality sometimes. Just the point where number sold and profit margins end up being so that the company can make the largest profit. I read a quote stating that most modern headphones can be made and still make profit under the $500 price point.

 

 

Imagine if Audeze released the EL-8 and stated that the EL-8's sound quality was equivalent to the LCD-3, but just uses cheaper materials? They take the most important part: the driver & tuning, and just transplant it into a cheaper shell that is not hand-crafted. How Audeze fans would be jumping outta their chairs with joy out there??? That is the nicest thing a headphone manufacturer can do for you. Take the flagship driver & tuning and swap it out into a cheaper body so that people on a budget can enjoy it as well.

 

I personally think Oppo's straight-forward no b*ll$hit approach is refreshing. They made the best driver they could and didn't swap it out for some sonically dumbed down version to trick you into buying the more expensive model. They don't make any fantastical claims about giant sonic differences between models, and they tried their best to tune their budget model to sound as good as their flagship. They had an ideal sound in mind and they tried to reach it with both their models. Whatever differences in sound between the models there are are simply due to the acoustic differences of the cheaper materials used for cutting costs. Not because they intentionally omitted applying all their driver technology or the best possible tuning in order to have a sonic difference to justify the price difference.

 

For the PM-3, they had to use a different driver design due to smaller form factor and closed nature, but from its performance, I personally feel like they approached the project with the same mentality: best design, best comfort, and best sound we can get for this price point. I get the vibe that they have the mentality that they can make headphones that have it all (good sound, good looks, good comfort, and a competitive price), while other companies act like you need to sacrifice one for the other.

 

Now this doesn't mean that their headphones are without flaws, but I personally really respect their mentality and approach. My experience with Oppo customer service and their head-fi representatives has always been overwhelmingly positive and straight-forward. They don't make claims that they can't back up and they always give you all the information straight up.


Edited by money4me247 - 3/23/15 at 2:04am
post #3624 of 6344
Well said Money, I think the same can be said for their amps as well, the HA-1 and HA-2. They've earned top notch reviews all across the board for both, and I think both could be considered some of the best values in Amp/DAC combo's at their respective price ranges and target markets (home and portable)
post #3625 of 6344
Anyone compared these to T70 or T70p??
@audenze who is doing UK distribution? Thanks
post #3626 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by money4me247 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamKing View Post
 

What other company in does this exactly? And I mean just the relevant companies at flagship or TOTL level. It's like if the HE-500 and HE-6 or, to a lesser degree, the LCD-2 and LCD-3 sounded the same but you pay twice the price because the build quality and accessories are better. I guess them being transparent about it is fine for those concerned and obviously more people would buy the PM2 because of that but that's a deterrent to their products for me if that's part of their philosophy. I expect at least noticeable improvement in sound if I'm paying double. 

Well, let me ask it to you this way:

 

Would you rather Oppo intentionally made the PM-2 driver inferior just so there is a bigger sonic gap between the pm-1 and pm-2?? They designed the best sonic entry they could for the flagship-level at $1k+ market niche. Then they made a cheaper alternative taking as few sonic compromises as possible by using cheaper materials. For audiophiles who care most about the sound, that sounds like the best deal to me.

 

personal ramblings - not looking to debate (Click to show)

Is the sonic differences between the Fostex TH600 vs TH900 is really the MSRP difference of $1k? Fostex could have easily used the same drivers in the TH600 as the TH900 and still made mad profit, but they intentionally dumbed down the lower-tier model drivers to give buyers a bigger incentive to purchase the flagship model. AKG routinely repackages the same drivers with slight cosmetic differences and some subtle new tuning and resells their headphones for $400+ price point. (the whole K701/K702/Q701/K712 etc series.) The example of the K7xx massdrop edition of the K702 65th Anniversary edition just shows you how ridiculous it gets. They can make basically the same pair of headphones at the $200 price point for a profit, but they initially release it as a special 65th edition at the $650 MSRP. (I love AKG btw, but I would just never pay full MSRP for any of their stuff). Their $2k K812 flagship can easily be found for $1.5 and I've seen it drop down to $1k. The Beyerdynamic T1 routinely goes down to $750 or less from authorized dealers who are still making profit on these headphones... where did that extra $1.4k price tag come from?

 

The sad fact is that if your headphone is not $1k+, you are not going to be taken seriously as a flagship model nowadays. This is a trend established by Sennheiser and the rest of the companies followed suit. Audeze then went balls to the wall jumping up to the $2k price point. Is the LCD-3 really $1k harder to manufacturer than the LCD-2? They basically use identical build quality materials, so wouldn't the entire $1k+ extra cost is simply for the driver diaphragm, different magnet arrangement, and different tuning? Is actually sonic quality differences between Audeze LCD-X and Audeze LCD-3 really $5k? Honestly, headphone prices are just arbitrary numbers not reflective of manufacturing costs or even sound quality sometimes. Just the point where number sold and profit margins end up being so that the company can make the largest profit. I read a quote stating that most modern headphones can be made and still make profit under the $500 price point.

 

 

Imagine if Audeze released the EL-8 and stated that the EL-8's sound quality was equivalent to the LCD-3, but just uses cheaper materials? They take the most important part: the driver & tuning, and just transplant it into a cheaper shell that is not hand-crafted. How Audeze fans would be jumping outta their chairs with joy out there??? That is the nicest thing a headphone manufacturer can do for you. Take the flagship driver & tuning and swap it out into a cheaper body so that people on a budget can enjoy it as well.

 

I personally think Oppo's straight-forward no b*ll$hit approach is refreshing. They made the best driver they could and didn't swap it out for some sonically dumbed down version to trick you into buying the more expensive model. They don't make any fantastical claims about giant sonic differences between models, and they tried their best to tune their budget model to sound as good as their flagship. They had an ideal sound in mind and they tried to reach it with both their models. Whatever differences in sound between the models there are are simply due to the acoustic differences of the cheaper materials used for cutting costs. Not because they intentionally omitted applying all their driver technology or the best possible tuning in order to have a sonic difference to justify the price difference.

 

For the PM-3, they had to use a different driver design due to smaller form factor and closed nature, but from its performance, I personally feel like they approached the project with the same mentality: best design, best comfort, and best sound we can get for this price point. I get the vibe that they have the mentality that they can make headphones that have it all (good sound, good looks, good comfort, and a competitive price), while other companies act like you need to sacrifice one for the other.

 

Now this doesn't mean that their headphones are without flaws, but I personally really respect their mentality and approach. My experience with Oppo customer service and their head-fi representatives has always been overwhelmingly positive and straight-forward. They don't make claims that they can't back up and they always give you all the information straight up.

to me i find that everything is at least 100 times overpriced, do you really want me to believe that wether oppo or audeze headphones cost the manufacturer more than 100 USD worth of material, common give me a break, in my opinion if the prize of a headphone is 1000 USD only the real material cost would be 100 USD and 900 USD covers the other expenses and a high profit margin

 

look at the ak240 do u really want to convince me that it costs AK more than 200 USD of material to make this ak240 and then shoot for a 2400 USD price tag what a joke

 

and this applies to almost all gadgets you see in the market, I believe everything is way way way way overpriced

 

look how stinky rich apple is now, Capitalism crap, maybe if we lived in communist world things would be much much cheaper. :)

 

dam this monetary world we live in, rich are getting richer and poor and becoming more poor. :)


Edited by Sound Eq - 3/23/15 at 2:25am
post #3627 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldendarko View Post

Well said Money, I think the same can be said for their amps as well, the HA-1 and HA-2. They've earned top notch reviews all across the board for both, and I think both could be considered some of the best values in Amp/DAC combo's at their respective price ranges and target markets (home and portable)
+1 What he said. Oppo makes great products without fluffing it with honey and other hype.
post #3628 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by hykhleif View Post

to me i find that everything is at least 100 times overpriced, do you really want me to believe that wether oppo or audeze headphones cost the manufacturer more than 100 USD worth of material, common give me a break, in my opinion if the prize of a headphone is 1000 USD only the real material cost would be 100 USD and 900 USD covers the other expenses and a high profit margin

look at the ak240 do u really want to convince me that it costs AK more than 200 USD of material to make this ak240 and then shoot for a 2400 USD price tag what a joke

and this applies to almost all gadgets you see in the market, I believe everything is way way way way overpriced

look how stinky rich apple is now, Capitalism crap, maybe if we lived in communist world things would be much much cheaper. smily_headphones1.gif

dam this monetary world we live in, rich are getting richer and poor and becoming more poor. smily_headphones1.gif

And yet you still want these things. The best way to not feed the rich is to, well, not feed the rich. If no one paid for the product and placed their hard earned cash in the pockets of the corporations then they wouldn't be so bold as to charge for their research and development, materials and overhead. I agree that the AK stuff is over the top, as well as other companies, and they are still in business.

Companies like Oppo Digital and Audeze are fairly small and their profit margins aren't as large as you'd think, though I'm sure they aren't working for free.

Can we get back to the headphones?
post #3629 of 6344
Quote:
Originally Posted by x RELIC x View Post


And yet you still want these things. The best way to not feed the rich is to, well, not feed the rich. If no one paid for the product and placed their hard earned cash in the pockets of the corporations then they wouldn't be so bold as to charge for their research and development, materials and overhead. I agree that the AK stuff is over the top, as well as other companies, and they are still in business.

Companies like Oppo Digital and Audeze are fairly small and their profit margins aren't as large as you'd think, though I'm sure they aren't working for free.

Can we get back to the headphones?

make no mistake, I owned a chord hugo and also I own an audeze, so make no mistake that I am not supporting them.

 

I just wanted to share my opinion about pricing gadgets in general ok so take it easy.

 

Since I have been on head-fi the gear i bought to support such companies exceed 5000 USD 

post #3630 of 6344

anyone using the el8 with ifi micro idsd  amp ?

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