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Mixamp vs. Receiver - Page 2

post #16 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleAngel View Post
 

 

"I'm of the opinion that a lot (most) of A/V receiver do not come with built in realistic headphone surround sound.

But they use word play to make it sound like the A/V receiver does"

 

Could you explain what "realistic headphone surround sound" is?

post #17 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino73 View Post
 

"I'm of the opinion that a lot (most) of A/V receiver do not come with built in realistic headphone surround sound.

But they use word play to make it sound like the A/V receiver does"

 

Could you explain what "realistic headphone surround sound" is?

 

I make no claim to being an "expert" on headphone surround sound.

But to me for realistic headphone surround sound, you need to start off with 5.1 (6-channel) or 7.1 (8-channels) of digital audio.

Those separate audio channel are then processed down to 2 channels of specialized audio, which is sent to the 2-channel stereo headphones.

This 2-channels of specialized audio is designed to make your 2 ears think they are hearing surround sound.

Someone figured out how with only 2 ears, our brain can tell where a sound is coming from and now use the stereo headphones to mimic surround sound.

But you need to start out with a source that has fully 6 (or 8) separate audio channels.

 

An old trick in the past when video recording only had 2-channels of audio (one audio signal per channel), was "Expanded Stereo" (fake surround sound), where 2-channels of audio was expanded up to 5.1 or 7.1 speaker audio, it got people to buy 6 or 8 speakers instead of only 2 speakers. 

I'm guessing "Expanded Stereo" was later modified for headphone use, it's an older (cheaper) technology that companies can add a modern name to.

Harmon/Kardon calls their "Expanded Stereo" of headphones Logic 7.

Expanded stereo is also one of the older features of Dolby Pro Logic.

Dolby Pro Logic has been around for about 20 years (or more) every few years there would be revisions, with new features, latest is Dolby Pro Logic IIz (2009).

 

When a modern A/V receiver is manufactured, the manufacturer has a choice of using older Dolby Pro Logic, which is cheaper,

or using the most modern, like Dolby Pro Logic IIz, but they all get to put on their receivers the title "Dolby Pro Logic".

 

Dolby use to be able to encode 5 audio signals into the 2 audio channels of a VHS tape (older Dolby Pro Logic)

Your later model VCRs use to be able to separate out the 5 signals of audio from the 2 audio channels,

but I doubt you could get the same audio fidelity as you could with modern DVDs and Blu-ray disk,

which come normally with 6 fully (maybe 8) separate (high fidelity) channels of audio already on the disk.

 

Others on Head-Fi believe that the most modern version of Dolby Pro Logic (IIz) is capable of processing realistic headphone surround sound, but I'm still investigating.  


Edited by PurpleAngel - 7/21/14 at 1:28pm
post #18 of 23
Thread Starter 

What if I got an AV receiver with dual HDMI outputs or an audio optical out? The first HDMI going to the TV and the second HDMI (or Optical out) going to a Surround Sound Headphone amp? It's a bit expensive prices but drop over time if the option becomes popular.

post #19 of 23
You can use the optical out on your TV as the sound cancome back through the TV-Receiver hdmi if enabled.

My opinion as stated earlier in the thread; receiver > mixamp.

You could look into true surround headphones too. No idea about them as i've not used them.

Oh and just a heads up, digital input to rca isn't supported by the all the Yamaha models i looked into. 575, 675, 775...
Edited by eskimo - 7/22/14 at 1:22am
post #20 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by eskimo View Post

You can use the optical out on your TV as the sound cancome back through the TV-Receiver hdmi if enabled.

My opinion as stated earlier in the thread; receiver > mixamp.

You could look into true surround headphones too. No idea about them as i've not used them.

Oh and just a heads up, digital input to rca isn't supported by the all the Yamaha models i looked into. 575, 675, 775...

Woah woah woah, slow down there.

 

I worked with many many televisions 2013 and early 2014 models and most only output 2.0 PCM through their optical or coax connections.

Unless your TV specifically says it outputs Dolby Digital/DTS passthrough it will just output Stereo PCM.

 

They do this due to a lot of sound products ony taking in PCM and if you plugged in a Dolby/DTS source into them you will get an extremely loud horrible noise through it.  For that you really want to connect directly to your device (I know it's a huge inconvience to do, but I tested about every TV at the store I worked at and they just about all output stereo, even with HDMI ARC a lot were stereo output, the only things it would send surround are things like Netflix and other apps built in if it's a smart TV.

 

We had many returns because of customers purchasing a home theatre in a box and not getting surround through their system because of the stereo PCM.


Edited by TsukiNick - 7/23/14 at 4:27pm
post #21 of 23
Who'd have thought? I think i've used 3 hdmi and the terrible HP out in the 5+ years i've had it
post #22 of 23
My recommendation is never plug your sources into your TV, just run them through the receiver, Tvs like to downmux to stereo because they are...well stereo. But by all means if your receiver has the ability to show what signal is sent in see if your TV sends Dolby.

Customers would always be pissed when their Blu Ray Home Theatre in a Box or Bose SR1 would be outputting stereo.

And of course I was blamed for the limitation of TVs haha good times.
Edited by TsukiNick - 7/24/14 at 11:47am
post #23 of 23
Sony tvs and I belive Vizio the will pass thru 5.1 via optical. But u are right most, including Samsung only pass thru 2 channel.
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