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~$200 Open Over-Ear HPs For Rock/Metal? - Page 2

post #16 of 51
I have always been on a soapbox about how bad the k701s are for metal. But...........I just purchased a used Asgard 1 by Schiit audio and after listening to a bunch of styles of music I went back a tried to use the k701s.


They are not my first choice for metal by I kept asking myself that if I only had k701s for metal could I live with them? The answer is maybe. The Asgard actually drives them to a point closer than any with metal music.


Strangely I'm using my Zoom G3 as my DAC and it is not a flat frequency response so maybe with the Asgard, that is where the k701 tweek is?
Edited by Redcarmoose - 7/1/14 at 8:05pm
post #17 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post

I have always been on a soapbox about how bad the k701s are for metal. But...........I just purchased a used Asgard 1 by Schiit audio and after listening to a bunch of styles of music I went back a tried to use the k701s.


They are not my first choice for metal by I kept asking myself that if I only had k701s for metal could I live with them? The answer is maybe. The Asgard actually drives them to a point closer than any with metal music.


Strangely I'm using my Zoom G3 as my DAC and it is not a flat frequency response so maybe with the Asgard, that is where the k701 tweek is?

Why was it that you thought the K701s weren't great for metal?

post #18 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRapz View Post
 

Why was it that you thought the K701s weren't great for metal?

Well, I spent a whole year listening to them with metal. They do have pace and detail. But their energy in the treble area can become scathing at loud volume. I prefer a deeper bass. But to my surprise a powerful solid state can add something for them at medium volume. Tube amps make them sound nice and metal like Opeth.Some vinyl sounded great with them. I just don't see the k701s as metal headphones. They do have many special features.

 

Years ago Uncle Eric said the k701s are what Tang is compared to real orange juice. At times with the wrong amp they do sound fake. They need juice. Real juice to wake up their inherent sterility to become the great headphones they have the potential to be.

 

The fake sound is when they are under amped. It is like the low-power amp is not waking them up.

 

Get a pair and see for yourself. In a way they are the reason I made most of my purchases. I own two pair of k701s but don't listen to them as much as I would like. I purchased them first in 07 to go with my Woo3 but found out that it was not the amp for them. This was the start of my learning curve. Next I purchased the Woo5 LE and it did drive them.


Edited by Redcarmoose - 7/1/14 at 8:44pm
post #19 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post
 

Well, I spent a whole year listening to them with metal. They do have pace and detail. But their energy in the treble area can become scathing at loud volume. I prefer a deeper bass. But to my surprise a powerful solid state can add something for them at medium volume. Tube amps make them sound nice and metal like Opeth.Some vinyl sounded great with them. I just don't see the k701s as metal headphones. They do have many special features.

 

Years ago Uncle Eric said the k701s are what Tang is compared to real orange juice. At times with the wrong amp they do sound fake. They need juice. Real juice to wake up their inherent sterility to become the great headphones they have the potential to be.

 

The fake sound is when they are under amped. It is like the low-power amp is not waking them up.

 

Get a pair and see for yourself. In a way they are the reason I made most of my purchases. I own two pair of k701s but don't listen to them as much as I would like. I purchased them first in 07 to go with my Woo3 but found out that it was not the amp for them. This was the start of my learning curve. Next I purchased the Woo5 LE and it did drive them.

From reading reviews, it seems that the Q701 may have a bit more bass (I'm aware that many say the K701 has the same sound) and if paired with a tube amp (for a warmer sound) like the Vali, do you believe the problems you had would be fixed? 

post #20 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRapz View Post

From reading reviews, it seems that the Q701 may have a bit more bass (I'm aware that many say the K701 has the same sound) and if paired with a tube amp (for a warmer sound) like the Vali, do you believe the problems you had would be fixed? 



All I can say is I'm listening to the 701s now with metal and it is just barely there in bass. So marginal that at times I think I can live with it and at times I can't . But this has always been my long love hate marriage with the AKGs.

Never heard the Qs. Don't get me wrong if you listen to jazz or Classical or even IDM you would maybe be OK with them. It is a headphone that a lot of people have purchased. They do have interesting soundstage, pace and detail but with the Asgard One there is still what I feel is a big sector of the frequency response left out.

Even if you read that they offer a completely flat frequency response . They don't, it is more treble. With a weaker amp like Vali ( which I have not heard ) the bass impact will be even less. Read the multiple reviews by the same guy posted minutes ago in the product review section. He compares three lower end Schiit amps and comes to conclusions

I wish i could offer you some other low cost alternatives but I haven't listened to a ton of headphones. I use my AHD Denon. 7000s and call it a day.
Edited by Redcarmoose - 7/1/14 at 9:41pm
post #21 of 51
You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear. There is no way to EQ the issues.

That said I do listen metal with them more that I have the Asgard. But be warned that they are really really hard to amp right.
post #22 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post


All I can say is I'm listening to the 701s now with metal and it is just barely there in bass. Woo marginal that at times I think I can live with it and at times I can't . But this has always been my long love hate marriage with the AKGs.

Never heard the Qs. Don't get me wrong if you listen to jazz or Classical or even IDM you would maybe be OK with them. It is a headphone that a lot of people have purchased. They do have interesting soundstage, pace and detail but with the Asgard One there is still what I feel is a big sector of the frequency response left out.

Even if you read that they offer a completely flat frequency response . They don't, it is more treble. With a weaker amp like Vali ( which I have not heard ) the bass impact will be even less. Read the multiple reviews by the same guy posted minutes ago in the product review section. He compares three lower end Schiit amps and comes to conclusions

I wish i could offer you some other low cost alternatives but I haven't listened to a ton of headphones. I use my AHD Denon. 7000s and call it a day.

I did read those reviews on the Schiit products. I may be able to get a used Asgard 1 used for a good price, which would give the Q701 better bass due to being more powerful than the Vali as you say (I don't need a lot of bass, my SRH440, which many claim to be bass-light, is fine for me). My other choice at the moment is a Modi/Vali and the DT880. Thanks for your time and help.

post #23 of 51
You will be more happy I think to get used to closed back headphones for metal. That is what I have always used most.
post #24 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRapz View Post

I did read those reviews on the Schiit products. I may be able to get a used Asgard 1 used for a good price, which would give the Q701 better bass due to being more powerful than the Vali as you say (I don't need a lot of bass, my SRH440, which many claim to be bass-light, is fine for me). My other choice at the moment is a Modi/Vali and the DT880. Thanks for your time and help.


You may like the sound of the Asgard and k701 combo. Just remember not to be disappointed as the Asgard if new will burn in and sound better as the k701s have a crazy long burn in period recommended. Plus your ears will get used to stuff. If you find a used Asgard 1 for 150 and a used pair of k701s for 150 that is pretty good SQ for 300. Even if is treble based, if you like the sound it is detailed and clear for a value price.
post #25 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRapz View Post

From reading reviews, it seems that the Q701 may have a bit more bass (I'm aware that many say the K701 has the same sound) and if paired with a tube amp (for a warmer sound) like the Vali, do you believe the problems you had would be fixed? 

That's my understanding, too, about the Q701/K701 difference and frequency response charts indicate that there is some difference as well.

I found the Q701s a touch bright for my taste, but I could see why others really like them and I would still recommend them. I ended up with the K612s instead because it's a better fit for my tastes smily_headphones1.gif

Have you tried the Q701 thread? http://www.head-fi.org/t/582276/q701-appreciation-thread
Edited by cel4145 - 7/1/14 at 11:44pm
post #26 of 51

For what it's worth, I'll share my experience.  I listen to about 90% rock/metal (mostly classic rock).  In the past 15 months or so since I got into quality sound with the SRH840, I have briefly owned several pairs of headphones, all of which are fairly highly regarded.  Since the SRH840, I have had the DT880, HD600, and SR325is.  The SRH840, DT880, and HD600 are all fairly good with rock, but none of them ever bring the in-your-face sound, energy, speed, detail, and "soul" of the SR325is.  Also, the Grados make electric guitars sound absolutely phenomenal.  Until recently, I was only looking into over-ears, but I eventually decided to try the SR325is after all the recommendations I have seen here.  Despite its shortcomings (soundstage, sibilance, and sort of comfort), I have only kept the SR325is.  For about $200, I would recommend getting either a new SR225e or a used SR325(i/is/e) (I found mine on ebay for a little under $175 used).

post #27 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbenrfan99 View Post
 

For what it's worth, I'll share my experience.  I listen to about 90% rock/metal (mostly classic rock).  In the past 15 months or so since I got into quality sound with the SRH840, I have briefly owned several pairs of headphones, all of which are fairly highly regarded.  Since the SRH840, I have had the DT880, HD600, and SR325is.  The SRH840, DT880, and HD600 are all fairly good with rock, but none of them ever bring the in-your-face sound, energy, speed, detail, and "soul" of the SR325is.  Also, the Grados make electric guitars sound absolutely phenomenal.  Until recently, I was only looking into over-ears, but I eventually decided to try the SR325is after all the recommendations I have seen here.  Despite its shortcomings (soundstage, sibilance, and sort of comfort), I have only kept the SR325is.  For about $200, I would recommend getting either a new SR225e or a used SR325(i/is/e) (I found mine on ebay for a little under $175 used).

Though they are often claimed as the best for rock and metal, I do listen to other genres (though not as much) and I think I'll I need a bit more comfort. I also hate sibilance. Thanks for your help and suggestions though. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post


That's my understanding, too, about the Q701/K701 difference and frequency response charts indicate that there is some difference as well.

I found the Q701s a touch bright for my taste, but I could see why others really like them and I would still recommend them. I ended up with the K612s instead because it's a better fit for my tastes smily_headphones1.gif

Have you tried the Q701 thread? http://www.head-fi.org/t/582276/q701-appreciation-thread

I have looked through a bit of this thread, which is where I've heard of the sound differences between the K and Q701s. I've also been looking at the amp recommendations there. I also am not a basshead at all, and I may prefer a brighter sound. 

 

 

I think I've decided upon either the Q701 with either a Magni, Vali, or Asgard 1 (I would prefer this for more power, though I'm not sure if I can afford it) or the DT880 Pro 250 Ohm with either the Magni or Vali. I'm leaning towards the Q701 because I've heard it has a larger soundstage and more focus on the mids, and less focus on the bass. Thanks to everyone who responded and/or read for your time and help, hopefully after a little more research I'll decide and purchase some great gear.

post #28 of 51

Two of the great things about recent vintage top flight mid-fi cans (usually former flagships or variations of former flagships) are what great sound you got for the $ spent, and the great variety and differences between and among their sound signatures.  The four that were closest to my heart and both or my ears not so long ago were (and still are--albeit with a bit less head time) the AKG Q 701, D2000, HD 600 and DT 880.

post #29 of 51

If you can find a second hand DT990, that's gonna be a great deal! Go for it!

If you only consider a brand new item, I recommend SR80. Grado's Mid is unique and even for this level it's still special compares to other brands.  

post #30 of 51
Good call. To the OP, I'd let you borrow a pair of SR 80s not getting used right now if you wanted.
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