Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Sound Science › Do audiophile electrical engineers use kilobuck cables?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Do audiophile electrical engineers use kilobuck cables? - Page 4

post #46 of 66
In my opinion, buying audio cables is about getting properly built cable. If it is the right length (not too long for power source), of sufficient gauge, has proper conductor (oxygen-free copper seems to be standard), has proper insulation (and shielding, if necessary), and is gold-plated to protect from corrosion I'm happy.

I think the difference between cables comes from electrical values, like wire gauge, length, and resistance. I'm doubtful that these will ever make a difference that I will hear myself, but that doesn't mean I don't want quality cable. That, also, doesn't mean I'm willing to spend money for better sound from a cable. In my opinion, a cable does it's job right or it doesn't... there is no magic.

Even if I thought cables made a difference, there are bigger bottlenecks to deal with such as drivers, amplification, and digital-to-analog conversion. If I had the best equipment in the world and money to spend, only then would I consider a kilo-buck cable.
post #47 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmoe View Post
 

I would be interested to see any of this specialized data about cables that was so tedious and hard to understand that you gave up trying and started buying expensive cables.

 

Could you explain how you came to the conclusion that one would need much further specialization in order to know the real differences between "hi-end" cables and their standard counterparts?

 

When trying to match what you heard with any objective data, did you also double blind test these cables to make sure you actually heard what you think you heard? 

The tediousness of wave theory had nothing to do with cables at the time. I mentioned it as an aside. The link to cables is that I don't expect "simple" rules to explain the differences. One has to dig much deeper - it may be wave theory, it may be something else. I don't know this for sure - I'm just assuming it, based on simpler LCR type measurements not coming up with the explanation.

 

The only thing I know for sure is that cables must conform to the laws of physics. And that the most relevant law for audiophile cables is the Law of Unintended Consequences.

 

I haven't done a full DBT on any hifi component, although I have occasionally accidentally listened to a different cable than I thought was connected at the time. The reason for not bothering with DBTs is that I already know, from repeated experience, that I'd probably fail even a sighted A/B style test on any neutral component, so no need to go further. No test involving the human mind can be perfect, but I'm willing to take risk that my sighted long term test style is good enough for me. If it's all placebo then fine by me. By a long way I've Iiked the end result more frequently than when I tried to choose things more objectively. 

post #48 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAttorney View Post
 

The tediousness of wave theory had nothing to do with cables at the time. I mentioned it as an aside. The link to cables is that I don't expect "simple" rules to explain the differences. One has to dig much deeper - it may be wave theory, it may be something else. I don't know this for sure - I'm just assuming it, based on simpler LCR type measurements not coming up with the explanation.

 

The only thing I know for sure is that cables must conform to the laws of physics. And that the most relevant law for audiophile cables is the Law of Unintended Consequences.

 

I haven't done a full DBT on any hifi component, although I have occasionally accidentally listened to a different cable than I thought was connected at the time. The reason for not bothering with DBTs is that I already know, from repeated experience, that I'd probably fail even a sighted A/B style test on any neutral component, so no need to go further. No test involving the human mind can be perfect, but I'm willing to take risk that my sighted long term test style is good enough for me. If it's all placebo then fine by me. By a long way I've Iiked the end result more frequently than when I tried to choose things more objectively. 

 

That's an interesting way to view this hobby, to say the least...

post #49 of 66

#my-life #carebear

I tried an A&K dap with 2 cables and, I think it was 1+2 IEMs. the change of sound between default and some 1000+$ cable was very very very obvious and real. the overal volume level changed a good deal. and there was an obvious roll off of the trebles compared to the other cable(or the other cable made the trebles go up, the way you want it).

 

if I knew nothing, I would come here looking for answers to the reason why this happened? I would see all the talks about how cable doesn't change a thing and how it's all in our head. first it would infuriate me, because you're wrong and telling I'm a mad man! something not a lot of people would take well.

and second I would instantly believe that people in sound science know nothing about cables and only talk shiiiiiiiiihiiiiiiiiiiiiiii (hbo the wire<= double combo).

then I would join the merry band of unicorn chasers, forever thinking that science was not good enough for audio and wrongly calling myself a subjectivist. because even then, I would not know enough to understand the difference between refusing to use DBT as a conclusive method, and spitting on science with snake oiled ignorance.

 

 

but I'm me, I've seeked information on impedance a lot, I even bought myself a few jacks with resistors in it to experiment, used a switch etc. so I know what I heard was pure and simple impedance input change on a low impedance multidriver with greatly waving impedance values throughout frequencies.

and I also know that if the dap output impedance had been well under 1ohm as it should for iems, and the damping factor good enough, then what was a great audible change would have been minimal. and if only the IEM had been a good boy with stable impedance values for all frequencies, then the signature changes would have never occured.

in short, the differences heard by switching cables only made obvious what was wrong in the gears and how they shouldn't have been used together in the first place.

 

so instead of telling people that cables don't make a difference, we should spam sentences like "if 2 cables sound different, then something is wrong in your audio system".

for us it's the same thing. for newbies it would have a very different impact.  and might incline them into looking it up and ask why plugging high impedance source into low impedance multidriver isn't the best idea. how a dap might not be the best thing to drive a LCD2 even if it's loud. or simply to start paying attention to damping.

 

then we could make jokes about how a guy paid 1000$ to get 0.8ohm less in the cable when at the same time, he bought a 22ohm dap 20times the price of a 1ohm sansa clip+.

post #50 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by castleofargh View Post

 

so instead of telling people that cables don't make a difference, we should spam sentences like "if 2 cables sound different, then something is wrong in your audio system".

 

 

That's pretty much what most people say, the first followed by the second.

post #51 of 66

I was recording in a beautiful new studio and the head engineer was showing me around. I asked him what sort of cables he used and he opened a cupboard door and brought out a gigantic spool. "I get these at Monoprice cheap. If I need something particular when we're working, I send a runner over to Radio Shack."

post #52 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

I was recording in a beautiful new studio and the head engineer was showing me around. I asked him what sort of cables he used and he opened a cupboard door and brought out a gigantic spool. "I get these at Monoprice cheap. If I need something particular when we're working, I send a runner over to Radio Shack."

Heh, I JUST got back from Radio Shack with a 25 foot coil of RG-6. Was reading the box and was surprised too see "Silicon-filled, gold plated connectors."

Silicon!?!? eek.gif



se
post #53 of 66

I wear protective weather boots in the rain!

post #54 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

I wear protective weather boots in the rain!

They made of silicon or silicone?

se
post #55 of 66

Hopefully it's silicone, otherwise you're going to have quite the surprise when plugging in those cable :D

post #56 of 66

I'm working on my undergrad Computer Engineering degree (you can do EE or CS path, I'm on EE)... I'm keeping an eye out for any opportunities to learn, but so far I've never seen nor heard of any real objective data supporting kilobuck cables. I don't believe in cheap cables, as they often have obvious design flaws, nor in expensive cables... because they are snake oil. Monoprice or simple DIY should be all you'd ever need.

post #57 of 66

This one?

 

RadioShack 25-Ft. Quad-Shielded Coax Cable

Model:

15-1567

 | Catalog #: 15-1567

 

***************************************

Excellent for cable TV or over-the-air TV.

Not so much for a analog audio interconnect.

post #58 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmoe View Post

Hopefully it's silicone, otherwise you're going to have quite the surprise when plugging in those cable biggrin.gif

Quite so.

Poor ol' Radio Shack. They're barely a shadow of their former selves.

se
post #59 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

This one?

RadioShack 25-Ft. Quad-Shielded Coax Cable



Model:

15-1567



 | Catalog #: 15-1567

***************************************
Excellent for cable TV or over-the-air TV.
Not so much for a analog audio interconnect.

That's the one. Needed to replace a cable that was running under the house to the TV in the living room. Wonder who the dummy was who proofed the box printing and didn't know the difference between silicon and silicone. rolleyes.gif

se
post #60 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Eddy View Post


That's the one. Needed to replace a cable that was running under the house to the TV in the living room. Wonder who the dummy was who proofed the box printing and didn't know the difference between silicon and silicone. rolleyes.gif

se


Probably some Chinese fellow.  Once saw some hilarious features on plastic impact resistant safety glasses.  Of the 5 featured items in the description on the box number 2 was "NON-scratch resistant lens".  Number 3 was "High shatter lens".  Have seen some hilarious Frenglish instruction manuals over the years.

 

If want some quick laughs just google Chinglish and click on images for some darn funny signage.  Like the handicapped restroom marked for "Deformed Man exclusive use".

 

Of course I am not sure any of that beats a DVD copy of Monty Python's Holy Grail.  Yes a funny movie, but this version was unauthorized.  Was translated to Japanese, then to Chinese, then somehow translated to English from the already mangled Chinese.  Boy some of the translations are something else. 

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Sound Science
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Sound Science › Do audiophile electrical engineers use kilobuck cables?