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aggressive set-up for HD650!

post #1 of 13
Thread Starter 

i listen to mostly death metal. ive read countless threads here that the HD650's are dark and lack punchy bass.i need a recommendation for a good portable dac/amp combo that will bring the energy for these cans. currently use an ipod video and android for my listening pleasures. ftr, ive never listened to them before. a buddy of mine owes me money and has a brand new set in the box. i'll be getting the headphones this week.

post #2 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargatanas View Post
 

i listen to mostly death metal. ive read countless threads here that the HD650's are dark and lack punchy bass.i need a recommendation for a good portable dac/amp combo that will bring the energy for these cans. currently use an ipod video and android for my listening pleasures. ftr, ive never listened to them before. a buddy of mine owes me money and has a brand new set in the box. i'll be getting the headphones this week.

Budget?  The HD650's aren't particularly easy to drive.  Something like the CEntrance HifiM8 is a powerful, portable DAC/amp that would do well with it, particularly because of the adjustability of it.  There are a couple on the FS forum that are at excellent prices (lower than the preorder).  Only drawback is that there is no analog in.  Just digital (from modern ipod, with some configuration, Android, and of course computer).  

 

Just keep in mind that the HD650s will always be dark and have softer bass.  That is simply their nature.  But driven properly, they are excellent all around headphones.

post #3 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FraGGleR View Post
 

Budget?  The HD650's aren't particularly easy to drive.  Something like the CEntrance HifiM8  is a powerful, portable DAC/amp that would do well with it, particularly because of the adjustability of it.  There are a couple on the FS forum that are at excellent prices (lower than the preorder).  Only drawback is that there is no analog in.  Just digital (from modern ipod, with some configuration, Android, and of course computer).  

 

Just keep in mind that the HD650s will always be dark and have softer bass.  That is simply their nature.  But driven properly, they are excellent all around headphones.

im new to this so i dont want to spend a ridiculous amount of money. im sure the HifiM8 is very nice but it's more than i would want to spend. im thinking $200 is my budget

post #4 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by FraGGleR View Post
 

Budget?  The HD650's aren't particularly easy to drive.  Something like the CEntrance HifiM8 is a powerful, portable DAC/amp that would do well with it, particularly because of the adjustability of it.  There are a couple on the FS forum that are at excellent prices (lower than the preorder).  Only drawback is that there is no analog in.  Just digital (from modern ipod, with some configuration, Android, and of course computer).  

 

Just keep in mind that the HD650s will always be dark and have softer bass.  That is simply their nature.  But driven properly, they are excellent all around headphones.

x2... Amping the 650 helps tremendously but their bass presentation to me is always colored with its own resonant "signature".  It goes beyond boost, output and freq response, its more in the realm of harmonic content, as well as transient response artifacts imposed over the fundamental tones.

 

I once heard DIY M^3 build that was voiced for the HD650... to excite those upper midrange tones.  I think my Millet hybrid was voiced by its builder with the HD580 in mind.  Amps like these are downright shouty/screechy with my K701/Grados... and unfavorably triggers the K701 weird upper midrange plastic-ey / synthetic resonance.  So in a nut-shell amping to color does work... IMHO.  It goes against what many consider to be the "correct" function/role of the amplification stage.

 

My time with the HD650 has been easier than I would have thought to amp-up.  It is a fairly sensitive/efficient headphone.  So as long as the amp circuit has the AC voltage swing to create a clean/undistorted magnetic field in the coil... you're good to go.  Where generally more than sufficient voltage (headroom) is ideal.  Not sure the exact specifics on my cmoy, but its using an OPA2107 at 2x9V... its a surprisingly effective little circuit for the HD650.  Where the HD650 high-ish sensitivity really plays a factor.  For reasons I can't explain, I often times like the sound of this cmoy over my 24V-PPA... which has discrete current buffer, and a 3 channel (left/right/ground) OPA627 configuration.  So its MUCH "more amp", but sometimes I find it less enjoyable of a listen.


Edited by kramer5150 - 4/5/14 at 12:04pm
post #5 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kramer5150 View Post
 

x2... Amping the 650 helps tremendously but their bass presentation to me is always colored with its own resonant "signature".  It goes beyond boost, output and freq response, its more in the realm of harmonic content, as well as transient response artifacts imposed over the fundamental tones.

 

I once heard DIY M^3 build that was voiced for the HD650... to excite those upper midrange tones.  I think my Millet hybrid was voiced by its builder with the HD580 in mind.  Amps like these are downright shouty/screechy with my K701/Grados... and unfavorably triggers the K701 weird upper midrange plastic-ey / synthetic resonance.  So in a nut-shell amping to color does work... IMHO.  It goes against what many consider to be the "correct" function/role of the amplification stage.

 

My time with the HD650 has been easier than I would have thought to amp-up.  It is a fairly sensitive/efficient headphone.  So as long as the amp circuit has the AC voltage swing to create a clean/undistorted magnetic field in the coil... you're good to go.  Where generally more than sufficient voltage (headroom) is ideal.  Not sure the exact specifics on my cmoy, but its using an OPA2107 at 2x9V... its a surprisingly effective little circuit for the HD650.  Where the HD650 high-ish sensitivity really plays a factor.  For reasons I can't explain, I often times like the sound of this cmoy over my 24V-PPA... which has discrete current buffer, and a 3 channel (left/right/ground) OPA627 configuration.  So its MUCH "more amp", but sometimes I find it less enjoyable of a listen.

cmoy looks interesting but i dont like having to change out 9v batteries.

post #6 of 13

Yeah you'll have to weigh all that for yourself.  The one thing batteries have going over 110V AC thats stepped-down & rectified is CLEAN and noise-free DC voltage.  I have had hit and miss noise issues from AC wall power with my various amps.  Don't let that scare you though... just read amp reviews  and impressions carefully, theres always a "honeymoon" period with anything new.  Generally the more $$$ it is, the longer the honeymoon lasts.  Sometimes it takes a while for members to recognize weaknesses in anything new.  Such is human nature...

 

Good Luck!!

post #7 of 13
Thread Starter 

how bout the Magni and Modi combo for home use? that a good mix with the HD650?

post #8 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargatanas View Post
 

how bout the Magni and Modi combo for home use? that a good mix with the HD650?

I have never heard it with the HD650, I only demo'd anothers MM setup briefly with  his  modded T50RP.  The T50RP is generally more on the side of neutral/accurate, and FWIW the MM setup did not sound excessively shouty or bright... paired with that headphone.  Hardly an impression worth noting though in this discussion, because the T50RP is a very night and day different headphone than the HD650.  (closed low impedance ortho versus open dynamic coil)


Edited by kramer5150 - 4/5/14 at 1:23pm
post #9 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargatanas View Post
 

how bout the Magni and Modi combo for home use? that a good mix with the HD650?

That should be a solid combo for the HD650s based on most reports.  Combined, the MM stack is a little bright which could balance out the HD650s nicely for metal.  If you want to maintain some portability, you can look for an O2/ODAC combo that still has its batteries.  Neither stack is the end all be all, but are very solid entry level combos.  You could also look at the Schiit Vali for the HD650s as that is an extremely good amp for the price and pairs very nicely with my HD650s and HD800s, but you can't use IEMs, sensitive, or low impedance headphones with it.

post #10 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FraGGleR View Post
 

That should be a solid combo for the HD650s based on most reports.  Combined, the MM stack is a little bright which could balance out the HD650s nicely for metal.  If you want to maintain some portability, you can look for an O2/ODAC combo that still has its batteries.  Neither stack is the end all be all, but are very solid entry level combos.  You could also look at the Schiit Vali for the HD650s as that is an extremely good amp for the price and pairs very nicely with my HD650s and HD800s, but you can't use IEMs, sensitive, or low impedance headphones with it.

thank you. awesome recommendations. i was looking at jd labs site. i came across the C5+combo. i see it has a thinner build and not as bulky as the 02/ODAC. do you know the differences between the 2? their going for about the same price

post #11 of 13
Thread Starter 

maybe?

post #12 of 13
I haven't heard that combo. I'm sure it is a well made product. Since it is a true portable it won't have as much power as the others, so I'm not sure how well it will match up with the HD650s. You might check the HD650 appreciation thread for any opinions.
post #13 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargatanas View Post
 

im new to this so i dont want to spend a ridiculous amount of money. im sure the HifiM8 is very nice but it's more than i would want to spend. im thinking $200 is my budget

 

For $200 portable amps get a used Ibasso PB1, an iPod dock line out cable (forget about using the Android with it for now if that's your limit), and order the HD600/650 balanced cable from Ibasso. Or check with whoever you might get the PB1 from in case they might have this and see if you can purchase it too.

 

You can post an LF ad in the Classifieds in case there aren't any posted, you might give someone a nudge to upgrade.

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