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~PLEASE HELP buying a DAC.. - Page 2

post #16 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by momos View Post
 

..... i think i will juz buy a dx 50.. since it can support dsd.. cheap.. juz too expensive dsd dac like matrix, Electrocompaniet etc.. 

I own a DX 50 and yes it's able to play DSD files which sounds great but I dun think it does it natively, I am gonna get my HD 650 soon and I am thinking about getting a Aune X1! 

post #17 of 30

Note that if it isn't sampling the DSD file at 284mhz you aren't really listening to DSD hardware, but just that the DSD support basically has a trick in the software to make the DSD file readable to the system but it's getting decoded by PCM hardware, not the 1-bit, 700X+ oversampling rates of DSD, and as such any improvements you hear is more attributable to an audiophile-specific high quality recording done when they made that disc than by using a DSD format.

I'm not sure if they work in exactly the same way, but in the mid to late 2000s Pioneer had entry-level universal (DVD) players equipped with a Burr Brown 24-bit DACs that have the SACD logo stamped on them. However, those 24bit DACs are PCM DACs, so what these players actually do was convert the file to PCM on the fly, then decode it using PCM DACs. I bought a $150 Sony SACD player and for the most part I can hear more detail than the Pioneer universal players, without sacrificing smoothness; however, by now I understand that there's the possibility that the Sony SACD player had a purer analog output circuit than the Pioneer (which may have been artifically adding warmth to the sound, which is all the rage with audiophiles).

post #18 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtegeManiac View Post
 

Note that if it isn't sampling the DSD file at 284mhz you aren't really listening to DSD hardware, but just that the DSD support basically has a trick in the software to make the DSD file readable to the system but it's getting decoded by PCM hardware, not the 1-bit, 700X+ oversampling rates of DSD, and as such any improvements you hear is more attributable to an audiophile-specific high quality recording done when they made that disc than by using a DSD format.

I'm not sure if they work in exactly the same way, but in the mid to late 2000s Pioneer had entry-level universal (DVD) players equipped with a Burr Brown 24-bit DACs that have the SACD logo stamped on them. However, those 24bit DACs are PCM DACs, so what these players actually do was convert the file to PCM on the fly, then decode it using PCM DACs. I bought a $150 Sony SACD player and for the most part I can hear more detail than the Pioneer universal players, without sacrificing smoothness; however, by now I understand that there's the possibility that the Sony SACD player had a purer analog output circuit than the Pioneer (which may have been artifically adding warmth to the sound, which is all the rage with audiophiles).

Yeah I just found out thT my Dx 50 tricked me but I am still cool wiht it. 

 

So does the Aune X1 really play DSD files? or it it gona trick me agn?

post #19 of 30

OP - add to you list the NuForce uDac-3.  No thrills dac/amp - USB powered, small, pretty clean sounding.  Does DSD natively (you just need to download the drivers from NuForce's site).

 

I'll have a review up in a few days.  Suits your price range.  Great with a lap-top.

post #20 of 30
Thread Starter 

150? sony? what model is that? how do i check device that sampling 284mhz?

post #21 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by momos View Post
 

150? sony? what model is that? how do i check device that sampling 284mhz?

 

NuForce uDac-3https://www.nuforce.com/index.php?option=com_k2&view=item&id=687:udac-3&Itemid=2746

post #22 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by momos View Post
 

150? sony? what model is that? how do i check device that sampling 284mhz?

 

It's an old SACD player from 2004/5, I don't think they made a new entry-level SACD player after it. The lens on mine started having trouble reading hybrid SACDs after a while and those were the only ones I had (since I wanted to rip the quality PCM recording), and the local Sony distributor didn't have the lens for it (I suspected it was the universal DVDP lens, but they didn't want to touch my US-only unit), so I ended up selling it as a CDP. Buyer never followed up in the local forums if he was able to get a new laser.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by momos View Post
 

how do i check device that sampling 284mhz?

 

If you're referring to just the Sony, it said so in the specs - even the box says "70X oversampling" (I can't remember the exact number anymore), whereas PCM CDPs just have 4X or 8X oversampling.

 

On the NuForce, the UDAC3 page says: "Native Bit Rate : 32, 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96 kHz, 24-bit"

So very likely it uses PCM DAC hardware and the drivers you'll install will likely just do the same trick as on cheaper universal players.


Edited by ProtegeManiac - 3/30/14 at 8:08pm
post #23 of 30

Portable DSD player in your range is iFi-Audio iDSD.  Plays pretty much any file you can throw at it.  Only issues right now is that if your laptop has USB3.0 ports you might want to wait until the new firmware is ready.

 

Not sure if it is easy to get where you are.

http://www.ifi-audio.com/en/nano_iDSD.html

 

You would have a USB DAC with headphone for your laptop and for walking around you can use an Android or Apple phone as your music source that feeds the iDSD.  Pretty handy device.

post #24 of 30
Thread Starter 

looks good man! idsd.. what chip does it use? is it good?

post #25 of 30

It uses the Burr Brown chips.  I know a lot of people like the Sabre, Wolfson chips but lets not forget the role of implementation.  I really liked the Ciunas DAC which uses a TI PCM5102.  The name of the chip in itself shouldn't be the sole determination of whether the DAC will be good.

 

The iDSD sounds good to my ears.  DACs can be hard to describe unless there is something seriously wrong with them.  The amping and analog sections is where we might hear the biggest differences.  The headphone amp section is not particularly powerful, especially for demanding headphones.  Somewhere around 80 mW per channel.  Same as uDAC-3.  For IEMs and efficient headphones the iDSD amp section is sufficient.  For what it does the iDSD is jam packed with features.  Down the road even if you get another higher end DAC you can still use the iDSD as a USB-to-SPDIF converter.   

 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by momos View Post
 

looks good man! idsd.. what chip does it use? is it good?

post #26 of 30

it's pretty good. that is what I would get if it were my budget.

 

I like ti better than sabre anyways. a cheap sabre dac usually sucks. at that level the sound is really in the op-amps and it is decent. I don't know better for the money.


Edited by music_man - 3/30/14 at 11:27pm
post #27 of 30
Thread Starter 

hi man thanks for replying,, how is the build quality? any bad things about them? i really don wan t to waste my .dsf songs.. nid a good dsd dac.. matrix mini i vs nano idac! lols.. no enough $.. =(

post #28 of 30

build quality is great. sound is good. best you are going to get for the price. I always tell people they must listen but if this is your price I think it is a no brainer. getting dsd at that price is unheard of. you can't do any better for usd$189. unless it is way more by you. then you might have other options.

post #29 of 30
Thread Starter 

is it so hard to find dac in here, thats why i ask u guys.. i have to confirm, SQ and build quality.. THANKS FOR HELPING! cheers!

post #30 of 30

The LHLabs Geek Out 450 could potentially fit your needs. They can be had for around you asking price of $180 used or $200 new. If you buy new it won't be shipping until next month.

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