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= HiFiMAN HE-560 Impressions & Discussion Thread = - Page 381

post #5701 of 8297
I will post my comments on Ember with HE-560 today.
post #5702 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keithpgdrb View Post
 

I agree and disagree here.  the he4 and 6 both had good treble, better then the 400 in most ways with correct amping.  But in comparison to the 500s and the lcd line, the 400 could not be called muffled.  at that time, the orthos on the market sounded like they were all under blankets.  the lcd x finally got some high end.  

 

But we all hear this stuff differently.  what is horrible to me, might be perfect for someone else. 

 

In stock form, the the HE400 has the worst treble in history, after its eq'd 6-10db it becomes listenable.
I actually hear more treble on my LCD3F than I ever did on my HE400, because its clean and not a tizz.
Also, the mids/vocals are so recessed it sounds like I am sitting across the road from the concert in comparison to the 3F.
I loved the HE400 for 2 years due to its bass but it has severe flaws.

 

I think my local store has the 560 for demo now but I don't think I will like it if it sounds more like the HD800.
Maybe I will wait for the 400i to come out and listen to them both at once, think I might like it more.

post #5703 of 8297
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlxx View Post
 

 

In stock form, the the HE400 has the worst treble in history, after its eq'd 6-10db it becomes listenable.
I actually hear more treble on my LCD3F than I ever did on my HE400, because its clean and not a tizz.
Also, the mids/vocals are so recessed it sounds like I am sitting across the road from the concert in comparison to the 3F.
I loved the HE400 for 2 years due to its bass but it has severe flaws.

 

I think my local store has the 560 for demo now but I don't think I will like it if it sounds more like the HD800.
Maybe I will wait for the 400i to come out and listen to them both at once, think I might like it more.

It's nothing like HD800 dude, still a very planar and very Hifiman-house sound, just so happens people draw comparisons to HD800 because lots of people own HD800s and feel that HE560 might be time for them to dip their feet into orthos.

post #5704 of 8297

For the price, the HE400 is a great headphone but I found that the recessed mids got my turning up the volume to hear them, and then the treble cause fatigue quite quickly.  On some albums, I felt I needed to stop and take a break and physically felt a sigh of relief when I did.

 

It wasn't all albums and often I did enjoy them but there were some serious peaks with the pleathers.  After I put on the velours, that tamed it somewhat but then I lost some of the crispness of the pleathers.

 

Maybe the new focus pads would help... but I have the HE560s now..   Can't wait to get in the actual focus pads as I have been with only the Focus-A pads due to the screw up from the factory..

 

 

Yeah,,, from memory, these do not sound like the HD800 much.  More detail than other HiFiMans yes but the HD800 is a sound all it's own.


Edited by SBranson - 7/21/14 at 3:15pm
post #5705 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post
 

It's nothing like HD800 dude, still a very planar and very Hifiman-house sound, just so happens people draw comparisons to HD800 because lots of people own HD800s and feel that HE560 might be time for them to dip their feet into orthos.


While very different, what do you think in terms of musicality, and accurate musical reproduction 560 versus the 800? The planar sound is certainly to my inexperienced planar ears quite different than dynamic cans.

post #5706 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post
 

It's nothing like HD800 dude, still a very planar and very Hifiman-house sound, just so happens people draw comparisons to HD800 because lots of people own HD800s and feel that HE560 might be time for them to dip their feet into orthos.

As an HD800/LCD-2F owner, I am definitely interested in listening to the HE560, but am a bit concerned that it might be a bit too "in the middle" between the two, and ultimately not best either of them at their respective strengths. I am honestly more interested in seeing what HiFiMAN comes up with for an HE-6 successor. Who knows though, maybe I'll be blown away when I finally get a chance to demo them. Impressions have certainly been positive.

post #5707 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by SBranson View Post
 

For the price, the HE400 is a great headphone but I found that the recessed mids got my turning up the volume to hear them, and then the treble cause fatigue quite quickly.  On some albums, I felt I needed to stop and take a break and physically felt a sigh of relief when I did.

 

It wasn't all albums and often I did enjoy them but there were some serious peaks with the pleathers.  After I put on the velours, that tamed it somewhat but then I lost some of the crispness of the pleathers.

 

Maybe the new focus pads would help... but I have the HE560s now..   Can't wait to get in the actual focus pads as I have been with only the Focus-A pads due to the screw up from the factory..

 

 

Yeah,,, from memory, these do not sound like the HD800 much.  More detail than other HiFiMans yes but the HD800 is a sound all it's own.

 

Interesting that you say that the HE-560 'do not sound like the HD800 much'. In my opinion I find the HE-560 sounding the closest to the HD800 of any planar headphone that I've tried. Agreed that they are not the same, which is kind of a shame - if they were the same I could sell one of them. But as you and others have indicated, they are unique and each has music that it is best suited to. I've said it before, but for me the musicality of the HE-560 makes it sound best with rock, pop, electronica, hip-hop - pretty much anything post 1960. As for the HD800, I find them most pleasing with jazz, classical, instrumental and vocal/acoustic performances, mainly because of the neutral but oh-so-wide soundstage.

 

I just received my FocusPad-A's in the mail and will be settling in for some additional listening this evening. Based on what I can tell by looking at the FocusPad-A's, they are definitely going to be a tighter fit around my ears, and contact/rubbing is very likely. That said, I'll try to evaluate them purely from a sonic standpoint and leave comfort out of the equation. More to report later on or tomorrow...

 

Dale

post #5708 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by achristilaw View Post

The problem in discussing any advantages of an ortho, is the great variance of gear used in member playback. The HE-560 has the best treble ever from an ortho, you could recognize this using a Bakoon to Burson, not using a Vali.

Half the members are confused by what they are hearing, the other newbies misconstrue what they are hearing. Just from what's available at plug in.........
I sometimes dont understand why people always consider a phone with great treble or great bass automatically a good phone...its the complete picture that makes a phone great or not..sometimes a phone can sound better if its less detaily..or less bassy or even less on treble..or even sometimes soundstage can be to much..to much makes the sound sound unnatural... Its the mix of all that makes a phone Musical or not...gives it emotion...same thing with amping...and above all..all components have to complement each other...synergy i heard somewhere on a different thread...and it doent need to cost a fortune. a rig out of expensive but badly chosen components can sound worse then a affordable rig out of wellchosen components... IMHO ofcourse...
post #5709 of 8297

Well for a planar magnetic, a great treble is somewhat of an anomaly,while bass and midrange usually comes with an expected excellence, imo of course.  Planars seem to struggle with resonance issues that can plague the treble, and that has been my experience as well.

 

Headphones like HE-400 have far too much treble, Mad Dogs have too little of it and it's too unrefined, LCD2 has both too little of it and a slight hardness around 9khz.  PM-1 has a rough transition from upper midrange to treble.  LCD-X has too much of a spike around 9khz-- an accentuated LCD2 problem imo.  I've not heard the HE-4,HE-500 or HE-6 but I've read from trusted ears that they all have issues with treble as well. 

 

 

HE-560 (with focus a pads) is the first planar I've personally heard that does treble right, the balance at around 10khz is just right, and the transition from upper midrange to lower treble and then upper treble is near flawless, it remains relatively smooth while having enough presence in that region to keep a linear sound.  Other planars have dips or peaks in that critical transition from 4-10khz.

post #5710 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post
 

Well for a planar magnetic, a great treble is somewhat of an anomaly,while bass and midrange usually comes with an expected excellence, imo of course.  Planars seem to struggle with resonance issues that can plague the treble, and that has been my experience as well.

 

Headphones like HE-400 have far too much treble, Mad Dogs have too little of it and it's too unrefined, LCD2 has both too little of it and a slight hardness around 9khz.  PM-1 has a rough transition from upper midrange to treble.  LCD-X has too much of a spike around 9khz-- an accentuated LCD2 problem imo.  I've not heard the HE-4,HE-500 or HE-6 but I've read from trusted ears that they all have issues with treble as well. 

 

 

HE-560 (with focus a pads) is the first planar I've personally heard that does treble right, the balance at around 10khz is just right, and the transition from upper midrange to lower treble and then upper treble is near flawless, it remains relatively smooth while having enough presence in that region to keep a linear sound.  Other planars have dips or peaks in that critical transition from 4-10khz.

 

Ok, so perfect bass, perfect mids, perfect treble... Perfect headphone? ,-)

post #5711 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron12 View Post
 

 

Ok, so perfect bass, perfect mids, perfect treble... Perfect headphone? ,-)

Well, if there was actually a standardized and accepted perfect bass, treble, mids then by definition a headphone that did those perfectly would stand a good chance of sounding, well perfect. I guess the fly in the ointment would be soundstage so does this mythical can have a perfect sound stage as well?

post #5712 of 8297

I didn't say perfect.  I said the bass and midrange from planars is usually excellent, while the treble of the 560 is right.

 

The biggest things Hifiman could improve with the 560 would be a more powerful sounding bass, (not more quantity of bass), and build quality.  The 4-6khz area even on focus pads is still the slightest bit proglematic, while the 2khz dip can lead to a loss of body out of some instruments and vocals (but imo headphones should have a small dip here as opposed to being linear or elevated.)

post #5713 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimanrookie View Post


I sometimes dont understand why people always consider a phone with great treble or great bass automatically a good phone...its the complete picture that makes a phone great or not..sometimes a phone can sound better if its less detaily..or less bassy or even less on treble..or even sometimes soundstage can be to much..to much makes the sound sound unnatural... Its the mix of all that makes a phone Musical or not...gives it emotion...same thing with amping...and above all..all components have to complement each other...synergy i heard somewhere on a different thread...and it doent need to cost a fortune. a rig out of expensive but badly chosen components can sound worse then a affordable rig out of wellchosen components... IMHO ofcourse...

Well said. You don't sound like a rookie at all.

post #5714 of 8297

I think soundstage can still use some improvement IMHO. Imaging is great but soundstage size is just okay [coming off an AKG K612 and Sony MA900, that is].

Still, it does best them in everything else... It's just that I'd wish for slightly more soundstage.

Slight bass kick increase and slight treble attenuation [4khz] will hopefully be achieved with a slightly warm amp. As for soundstage, well, I'll see.

post #5715 of 8297
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimanrookie View Post


I sometimes dont understand why people always consider a phone with great treble or great bass automatically a good phone...its the complete picture that makes a phone great or not..sometimes a phone can sound better if its less detaily..or less bassy or even less on treble..or even sometimes soundstage can be to much..to much makes the sound sound unnatural... Its the mix of all that makes a phone Musical or not...gives it emotion...same thing with amping...and above all..all components have to complement each other...synergy i heard somewhere on a different thread...and it doent need to cost a fortune. a rig out of expensive but badly chosen components can sound worse then a affordable rig out of wellchosen components... IMHO ofcourse...


Everything is quite special about the HE-560. From the top to the very bottom.... the most special property? The focus of the middle is without peer at it's price. Talking about the division of the sound spectrum, talking about highs, middle and lows and the HE-560 is misleading, the intrinsic balance and even power response is what sets this phone apart.

 

You can use an iFi amp and NAD HP-50 and enjoy 90 percent of what I'm talking about...... the search for the last few percentile points isn't for everyone.

 

Synergy, is that is one "component" that manifests and melds two components to reach above their station. The mixing and matching of components is an art unto itself, something with the needs of an ortho? To enjoy an ortho as intended and manifest it's FULL potential? Doesn't come cheap.

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