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iDSD micro Crowd-Designed! Phase 2: iCLUB video announcement (page 127) - Page 78

Poll Results: What % of your listening is Desktop vs Portable? (click on ONE answer please)

Poll expired: Apr 22, 2014  
  • 22% (30)
    Desktop (100%)
  • 36% (49)
    Desktop (75%) & Portable (25%)
  • 18% (25)
    Desktop (50%) & Portable (50%)
  • 17% (24)
    Desktop (25%) & Portable (75%)
  • 5% (7)
    Portable (100%)
135 Total Votes  
post #1156 of 1900
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacomarmor View Post
 

XXHighend software upsamples to 768Khz and it normally works with a filterless dac (Phasure NOS1). iDSD has 3 selectable filters, maybe a 4th option (no filter) could be implemented to be paired with this special type of software (or others like HQplayer, etc...).

Paco.

 

Hi,

 

The iDSD micro includes a mode we call "Bit-Perfect."

 

In this mode no digital filtering is applied.

 

This "no filter" option is active and the only option for sample rates from 352.8KHz upwards.

 

For lower sample rates you can select this option or one of two different digital filters.

 

Just try them all out and see which you like.


Edited by iFi audio - 6/30/14 at 9:14am
post #1157 of 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio View Post


What Accessories are included in the micro iDSD box?"

Here you go (from top to bottom):

1. iFi velvet pouch
2. Silcone sheet with 2 x Silicone bands - situated between Smartphone+micro iDSD with silicone bands to hold firmly together
3. USB 3.0 cable (A male > A female)
4. Purple copper RCA cable
5. USB 2.0 cable (B male 90 degree > A female)
6. Silicone feet (white strip with 4 "feet")
7. Headphone adapter for (3.5mm>6.3mm)
8. Coaxial>Optical converter
9. USB 2.0 cable (B male > A female)
10. Jumper (3.5mm > 3.5mm) for Smartphone headphone out  into 3.5mm in of the micro iDSD
11. USB Adapter (B female > A male)

Previously, we could not disclose the Accessories list until it was final, final and now it here - it pays to be patient cos we are pulling out every stop for you guys.

Think you might want to revisit that list. Think you confused some of your A's and B's.

Think you also confused some of your males and females - that could be embarrassing eek.gif

.
post #1158 of 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio View Post
 

Yesterday, we posted about the iPurifier inside of the micro iDSD.

 

Following-up from your previous concerns that CCK/OTG port may involve the use of an adapter but whilst this is an additional connector in the signal path, we would like to refer you back to the Global Master Timing/Jitterless Lite technology which along with the iPurifier means the micro iDSD has built-in technology that is second to none when it comes to addressing USB transmission issues.

 

We also promised to explain more in detail the thinking behind this port.

 

 

Addendum on the CCK/OTG Port

 

 

We thought long and hard about this feature and internally, this was a keenly-debated feature for micro iDSD.

 

Consider the following global trends:

 

  • More and more people want high-quality sound on the move, just look at the explosion of headphone market, especially IEMs.
  • The undisputed Portable Audio Player (PAP) market leader - Apple iPod, its sales is falling by 50% per year. Apple is downsizing the iPod department and slowing the development.
  • The audiophile type of PAP sales is only stable,

 

How does one reconcile the above facts? Where have all the missing iPod users gone? It doesn’t make any sense, does it?

 

If we look closely, all those iPod users have switched to Smart Phones instead. Using a Smart Phone to replace the PAP makes a lot of sense actually:

 

Excellent user interface

  • By contrast, most PAPs have a UI that feels 10 years behind (except the iPod Touch of course) when pitched against the constantly evolving iOS and Android user interfaces.
  • For PAP, one can’t freely choose his favourite player.  So no iTunes, Onkyo HF Player, Capriccio, Hibiki, USB Audio Player Pro etc.
  • PAPs do not stream, on 3G or wifi

 

Streaming via the mobile network is the future

  • Hugely popular are:, iTunes, Spotify, Pandora, Last.fm, Slacker Radio, Rhapsody; also big plans from the big guns: Sony, Nokia, Microsoft. Further, one can now easily set up a streaming host in his/her own house by using a simple Network Attached Storage (NAS, e.g. Synology Diskstation) and start his/her own streaming services.
  • With 4G mobile networks (actually 3G is more than sufficient for audio streaming) rolling out across the globe and data plans are falling in price drastically, streaming is the future of music on the move and this needs a smart phone.
  • So in a perfect world, iFi would team up with Apple and Samsung, and bring out an iPhone/Galaxy by iFi. We should be so Kylie.

 

If one has to carry an extra item, why not carry the best?

  • For casual listeners, using the Smart Phone for music playback means one less item to carry and sound quality is improving all the time (especially with a better aftermarket headphone).
  • For serious listeners, adding a separate DAC to the smart phone makes much more sense, as quality wise, even the best PAP out there cannot match a hard-core dedicated DAC.  So far, none of the PAP (or those promised for 2015) will support DSD256, at best they will only support DSD128.
  • So making the micro iDSD most portable and mobile-friendly is one of the top design priorities.  The micro iDSD already has a built-in battery and phone charging function. Hence to make it even more mobile-friendly, the inclusion of this USB port which can directly connect to a mobile device using CCK/OTG cable with no additional adapter/cable makes sense.

 

Disadvantages of the direct CCK/OTG connection

Nonetheless, we did foresee the disadvantages of this feature, namely for desktop user:

  • A male to A female “audiophile” USB cable is not common; or
  • Need for an extra USB adapter.

 

The micro iDSD will come with a understated but high-performing USB A-to-A cable (see below).

 

In our opinion, one can spend upwards of US$600 and get but diminishing returns is severe.

 

To add an adapter in the USB signal path is not ideal. However, if you recall, we have provided an overview of the micro iDSD’s technologies.

  1. GMT and ZeroJitter– to cut out jitter from the computer and the USB connection
  2. iPurifier– deals with imperfect (DC offset, Unbalanced, Noise) USB signals coming through the USB cable/adapter

 

Both of these technologies more than compensate for the potential addition of a USB adapter and makes it far less of a compromise.

 

Hence from a sonic perspective, this lent extra weight to why we were happy to go with the CCK/OTG port.

 

Conclusion

So in the end it is was a toss-up between:

 

1. Maximum mobile friendliness but with a perceived slight compromise on the USB connection for desktop use.

2. No compromise on the USB connection for desktop use but mobile-friendliness not as good.

 

It was a tough design decision to make, but since we added GMT/Jitterless and iPurifier to minimise the effect of the USB cable and adaptor, we all agreed to go for maximum mobile-friendliness.

 

You may not agree with our reasoning, but we hope that at least now you understand our logic and justification.

 

Down the road, if you use your micro iDSD on-the-go more and more, we hope you warm to our thinking (if you are not already converted).

 

 

What Accessories are included in the micro iDSD box?"

 

Here you go (from top to bottom):

 

1. iFi velvet pouch

2. Silcone sheet with 2 x Silicone bands - situated between Smartphone+micro iDSD with silicone bands to hold firmly together

3. USB 3.0 cable (A male > A female)

4. Purple copper RCA cable

5. USB 2.0 cable (B male 90 degree > A female)

6. Silicone feet (white strip with 4 "feet")

7. Headphone adapter for (3.5mm>6.3mm)

8. Coaxial>Optical converter

9. USB 2.0 cable (B male > A female)

10. Jumper (3.5mm > 3.5mm) for Smartphone headphone out  into 3.5mm in of the micro iDSD

11. USB Adapter (B female > A male)

 

Previously, we could not disclose the Accessories list until it was final, final and now it here - it pays to be patient cos we are pulling out every stop for you guys.

 

So after all of this, an adapter is not essential. Choices, choices,..have it your way.

 

 

So this confirms my idea that the micro iDSD is focused on portability rather than home hi-fi systems.

The built-in usb charging port was the first hint that made me wide open my eyes, but I was still following the project with great interest. But the CCK/OTG port made me realise that the project was slightly deviating from what I thought it was: it was definitely  going to be a "mobile device". And this addendum confirms it!

My idea was to include the micro iDSD into my home system, connecting my pc and my amp+loudspeakers or straight from pc to my still unpurchased headphones; it would have occasionally come with me around the world (or the city) with my non-OTG phone (so as a simple HP amp).

I am not so sure anymore that this is the device I want/need! Too many compromises for my taste. For sure I won't go for a "blind buy" with it; I would really love to listen to it before buying and maybe even compare it with other similar products, but it seems it's not possible here.

post #1159 of 1900
I had an inkling that it was focused on portability because it has a battery.
post #1160 of 1900

My concern now is this..

 

I own the Gemini cable.  Which is presumably designed to keep RF interference in the actual data channel to a minimum.  Now, if there is an additional adapter added to the chain, I am afraid it will compromise the intended function of the Gemini cable.  

 

Now, I understand that the jitter reduction tech is excellent.  But added noise is never a good thing, in my opinion.  After all, the performance of the jitter reduction system is only as good as its clock.  And any extra noise can cause extra jitter in the master clock itself.  

 

 

Thanks

 

Andrew

post #1161 of 1900
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear View Post


Think you might want to revisit that list. Think you confused some of your A's and B's.

Think you also confused some of your males and females - that could be embarrassing eek.gif

.

 

You are right.

 

Gone back and fixed.

post #1162 of 1900
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kugino View Post

I had an inkling that it was focused on portability because it has a battery.

 

Hi,

 

To summarise:

 

1) nano iDSD: 75:25 portable/home-based.

 

2) micro iDSD: 50:50 portable/home-based.

 

3) mini iDSD: 100% home-based.

 

This is our logic.

 

Like we always say, try it and only if you like it, then buy it.

 

We would never ask a customer to blindly buy anything including AMR/iFi. Not the way we roll.

post #1163 of 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear View Post

Think you might want to revisit that list. Think you confused some of your A's and B's.


Think you also confused some of your males and females - that could be embarrassing eek.gif


.

You are right.

Gone back and fixed.

Good work but I still don't understand this one:

9. USB 2.0 cable (B plug > A socket)

Is this a micro-B plug and OTG cable?

If it's a standard B plug then me no understand. Is it to connect the iDSD to a printer? What new Super-Duper feature is this cable for?


Edit: or is it actually an A plug?
Edited by technobear - 6/30/14 at 10:43am
post #1164 of 1900

if I am allowed to say something about your choise to go with the specific kind of usb connection, I would say, that you if we see the charts above in the debate here, most users will use micro dsd mainly for desktop use...Desktop (75%) & Portable 25%)

 

I believe that most people (vast majority of us) would buy such kind of devices your brand and other brands sells, mainly as an efford to achieve good sound and features, at a reasonable price, and secondly for the its size and the easy of use on the go...

 

to say it in other words, I wouldn't care if the new micro dsd was like a big, ugly "square box" sitting on my desk, if it was capable to offer outstanding quality for the money...ok...if it was "ugly" I would have given it a better thought :bigsmile_face:

 

maybe statistics and numbers say that lot of people are switching to smart phones and portable devices, that are easier to use "on the go" and they stopped using the "clasic devices" for playing back audio, or connecting to the net, or watching movies, etc etc...

 

but still, the majority is continue spending lot of money, to buy higher-end headphones, amplifiers, dacs, speakers etc for home usage...

 

to give an example, a friend of mine just bought a 500 euros smart phone, capable of playing back flac files, with "higher end" 24/192 dac inside etc etc...when I told him to go on and try one of the portable dacs offered (no specific brand), to see if there were any differences in the outcome when playing the same file from his phone wearing headphones, and then connecting the dac to his phone and repeat the test, his answer was : 

 

"I don't care if the music is better when connecting the dac to my phone...I want my phone to be able to support many kind of audio-video files, which until now most of them couldn't, and deliver a decent quallity". I wont spent another 500 euros for dac, no matter the company, just to be able to catch a little better outcome"

 

lot of people, younger people, think that way...they just want their devices to support as many audio-video files they can, with decent quality...and thats it...those people are not willing to spend money for increase in the quality...they will switch easilly to an other brand if they discover their devices can, amongst others, "prepare their dinner for them" :biggrin:

 

it is "us", who spend money in a "better usb cable", or a "high-quality" stand to support our devices, or in a better dac, only to hear small benefits (if we are lucky) in the final outcome...

 

I don't want to be negative here...just arguing about something you said...lot of companies think the way you do...they see people switching to portable devices, and as companies that want to survive in a high competive environment, have to make some decisions...not everyone will be happy of course, but nothing wrong with that...

 

but to tell you the truth, I wish you have chosen the classic A>B usb connection...cause I spend lot of money for my new usb cable and now I think its useless...but as I have already said, not everyone will be happy

 

its ok...

 

edit: I decided to sell my nano idsd and go with the new micro, thats why I am saying about the usb cable

 

 

 

 
 
 

Edited by Gkat - 6/30/14 at 10:59am
post #1165 of 1900

in addendum to previous post, note I am not very concerned, though, about the added noise of the adapter cable.  

 

I trust the guys at iFi know exactly what they are doing.  If they aren't overly concerned, then neither am I.  

 

 

Still, I personally would find it preferable to have no added adapter at all.  Which underscores for me something I have thought all along, that the upcoming iDSD mini, for desktop use only, is the eventual product for me!

post #1166 of 1900
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear View Post


Edit: or is it actually an A plug?

 

Correct and corrected.


Thanks.


Edited by iFi audio - 6/30/14 at 10:51am
post #1167 of 1900
hi ifi, can you please ad the length of the cables, for example the purple rca and the blu Usb cable and make a comment on the rca cable quality, it dont need a 100€. rca cable but i am not using a cheap 5€ cable either, my minimum requirements would be something along the lines of a 25€ Sommer Cable per meter as a decent rca cable
Edited by roamling - 6/30/14 at 11:02am
post #1168 of 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFi audio View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by technobear View Post

Edit: or is it actually an A plug?

Correct and corrected.


Thanks.

Too much Pimms? rolleyes.gif


Seriously you guys are doing a fab job here and I cannot wait to get my hands on the iDSD cool.gif

.
post #1169 of 1900
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gkat View Post

 

but to tell you the truth, I wish you have chosen the classic A>B usb connection...cause I spend lot of money for my new usb cable and now I think its useless...but as I have already said, not everyone will be happy

 

its ok...

 

Hi,

 

Thanks for your thoughts and we really do appreciate the input.

 

Everything today is driven by one word "convenience."

 

Take this for example:

12' LP (1 album) > 5' CD (1 album) > 1TB HDD (2,000 albums).

 

The micro iDSD has been made to be as convenient to use as humanely possible.

 

We have made it powerful and feature-rich for home and on-the-go. (eg 3D for Speakers and Headphones and XBass on both).

 

One minute you can listen to it in your "big rig" and the next minute, you can unplug it and take it on holiday with you.

 

It cant really be pigeon-holed per se.

 

When it is in stores, you will all get to listen to it via a main system or Smartphone or whatever but for us, that is the main point - listen to it your way, on your terms without restriction.

 

Thanks

post #1170 of 1900
Now that all that's out of the way will there be any black units?
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