or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Westone Signature W-series W50 & W60
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Westone Signature W-series W50 & W60 - Page 11

post #151 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicAnthony View Post

That's pretty normal though. I went through that when I upgraded from Westone 3's to jh16. I still don't feel that the jh16 are 4 times better than the Westone 3's.
Yes, and I am feeling I can't afford those new headphones:o
post #152 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Coupe View Post

Seems easy. Stick with the TF10. They would only cost 300 to replace and you love them. Cheers! I have friends that love their Beats by Dre and they are right too. We all have ears and preference. Stick with what you love.

Now, related to the delay. I am willing to bet it has to do with US customs vs. design. Let's speculate while we wait.

That was a backhand if ever I saw one.  :D The TF10 is a great phone - I have a set of customs and a backup pair for down the road - There is an article I think on Headphonia where they talk about the TF10 as having a sweet spot for Rock that other, more detailed, with better graphs, de dum de dum... just don't hit. They aren't the most technically accurate, but they sound good. I think those who love the Beats sound are more easily persuaded about what sounds good than a TF10 diehard - and for good reason.

post #153 of 583
Not backhand at all. My responses on personal preference are consistent in my posts. A funny lesson along the way was when I let a coworker check out my 846s with new tips and my balanced rsa. He had been listening to his beats which he loved out of his iPhone. I did not talk cost with him and his revelation was that they sounded "pretty good" At that point I gave up the idea that we should all like the same thing. If he could not see the difference in those two then I expect the preference factor is even more of player at the level of IEM we are discussing.

Regarding value. Agree improvement rarely follows 1:1 with cost. So while I may be able to buy 2 pairs of 535s with the cost of my 846( which are not twice as good) 2 pairs of 535s won't sound better than 1 846 to my ears. To each his own.
Edited by M Coupe - 4/6/14 at 10:52am
post #154 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Coupe View Post

Not backhand at all. My responses on personal preference are consistent in my posts. 

 

I didn't mean to imply you made the comment on purpose at all - it is a given that we all hear things differently and each has a signature that hits the sweet spot for us. If you take a step back and look at the post in a vacuum, it looks like you lump Beats lovers in with TF10 lovers - I knew it was unintentional, but thought it was humorous - hence the :D

 

Cheers

post #155 of 583

There is a reason for this forum to exist.....

 

After a while, you are expecting to find something better.

 

I know that the law of diminishing returns soaked in snake oil plays an important role as well.

 

Why would you trade your vehicle after 6 years if you are still happy with it?

 

Would you be able to pay 5 times the price of your old vehicle for a new one, even when you have it for a test drive, and it does not even feel better than the car you are trading in?

 

The first time  tried a pair of UE 5 SuperfiPro  it was a revelation to me  !!, then, after 3 years I moved to the TF10s and I could not believe my ears wanting to play all my music through them.

 

I do not think that after 5 years of owing my beloved  TripleFi's,  the IEM technology has not improved enough for us to find a significant difference in sound between old  and new  IEMs.

 

I am not hoping to find an IEM with same signature of the TF10s...., however, I expect them to shine in my ears.

 

I do not really buy the b#&* of:

 

Audiophile  = rolled off treble + zero mid bass.

 

That is why, when I read comments of " balanced treble" or "deep bass" I know that they will not fit my listening profile.

 

Though the years, I have found that I love to listen at moderate volumes, and the main reason of boosting it is when you can not hear the bass or  when the treble is not detailed without being harsh.

 

I do not like any type of EQ, therefore, my only test of the W60 will be out of my Ipod Touch 5, unamped  and no eq, listening to my favorite songs.


Edited by mariowar - 4/6/14 at 11:59am
post #156 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by M Coupe View Post

Not backhand at all. My responses on personal preference are consistent in my posts. A funny lesson along the way was when I let a coworker check out my 846s with new tips and my balanced rsa. He had been listening to his beats which he loved out of his iPhone. I did not talk cost with him and his revelation was that they sounded "pretty good" At that point I gave up the idea that we should all like the same thing. If he could not see the difference in those two then I expect the preference factor is even more of player at the level of IEM we are discussing.

Regarding value. Agree improvement rarely follows 1:1 with cost. So while I may be able to buy 2 pairs of 535s with the cost of my 846( which are not twice as good) 2 pairs of 535s won't sound better than 1 846 to my ears. To each his own.

A suggestion for that colleague who uses Beats and thinks a balanced 846 sounds "pretty good" is to move him to your company's call center to handle customer complaints. Clearly the person is tone deaf so the shrill rantings of upset customers will not bother him in the least.
post #157 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by mariowar View Post
 

 

 

That is why, when I read comments of " balanced treble" or "deep bass" I know that they will not fit my listening profile.

 

 

What was it that you read about the 846 that led you to it? Shure's marketing and most of the talk here was about subwoofer sound or "deep bass"..

post #158 of 583

the co worker might well have not inserted the 846 properly into his ears and created a seal....my first time using IEM's i didnt get a good seal and was underwhelmed,as soon as i corrected it the sound was wonderful

post #159 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckdriver View Post
 

 

What was it that you read about the 846 that led you to it? Shure's marketing and most of the talk here was about subwoofer sound or "deep bass"..

 

I read about every review of the SE846 and the common factor was bassy........In addition to that, because of the subwoofer the deep bass would be obvious.

 

The reality is that they are not bassy, they just can go very deep an rumbling with the right music like electronic call for it and you also will be able to hear low bass in good jazz recordings.

 

I was hoping that detailed mid bass was going to be evident in rock songs that would call for it......

 

Rock and metal sounds weird because of the mids boost, the rolled off treble and limited mid bass. After spending one week with the SE846 I have the feeling that they had to roll the treble off because of due to the accentuated mids presentation they wanted to avoid sibilance.

 

I tried the different filters and I think that the balanced sounds best. The white one increased the low treble around 8khz and made some recordings sound harsh. Bottom line is that these earphones with reference recordings aka Chesky  sounded phenomenal, but with regular good recordings that sound great with other headphones and earphones the results were disappointed to say the least.


Edited by mariowar - 4/6/14 at 2:10pm
post #160 of 583

I think the 846 is the flattest IEM, I've had or heard (with the exception of the sub-bass boost). I agree with you that the 846 does not pair particularly well with my iPod Touch 5G. My reasoning is different from yours. I can't detect any sub-bass (of the type that makes the 846 unique amongst BA earphones and more like a dynamic driver) paired with my Touch 5G

 

I can imagine why the Touch 5G does pair well for you with the TF10 (without EQ). If the things I've read in the past about the TF10 are true, it has a V-shaped sound signature. If you pair V-shaped with “flat” you get a balanced sound for human hearing (at least, my hearing anyway). I need greater decibels in the low and high frequencies because I hear midrange louder. So if I have a “flat” earphone and a “flat” source, the mids are going to stick out.

 

If someone says flat is necessary and the recording itself creates the balance. I counter with, I don't have the same speakers as the recording engineers so I can't hear their intent. I can only create a balance (using EQ) that makes sense for the speakers that I do have. That's why the iPod doesn't work for me. It doesn't even seem to work for fans of the Apple DAPs. The iPod is loud enough on its own with IEMs, yet people add amps for a better balance.

 

BTW, with the 846 (or 535) sibilance (that's not in the recording) is mostly due to an inadequate seal. People often think they have a good seal (and will argue about it), but they don't.


Edited by truckdriver - 4/6/14 at 3:13pm
post #161 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckdriver View Post
 

I think the 846 is the flattest IEM, I've had or heard (with the exception of the sub-bass boost). I agree with you that the 846 does not pair particularly well with my iPod Touch 5G. My reasoning is different from yours. I can't detect any sub-bass (of the type that makes the 846 unique amongst BA earphones and more like a dynamic driver) paired with my Touch 5G

 

I can imagine why the Touch 5G does pair well for you with the TF10 (without EQ). If the things I've read in the past about the TF10 are true, it has a V-shaped sound signature. If you pair V-shaped with “flat” you get a balanced sound for human hearing (at least, my hearing anyway). I need greater decibels in the low and high frequencies because I hear midrange louder. So if I have a “flat” earphone and a “flat” source, the mids are going to stick out.

 

If someone says flat is necessary and the recording itself creates the balance. I counter with, I don't have the same speakers as the recording engineers so I can't hear their intent. I can only create a balance (using EQ) that makes sense for the speakers that I do have. That's why the iPod doesn't work for me. It doesn't even seem to work for fans of the Apple DAPs. The iPod is loud enough on its own with IEMs, yet people add amps for a better balance.

 

BTW, with the 846 (or 535) sibilance (that's not in the recording) is mostly due to an inadequate seal. People often think they have a good seal (and will argue about it), but they don't.


It is very flat in the bass and the treble.... the mids are a little forward and this  is Shure's trademark.

 

So, you agree that the SE846 do not ago along well with the Ipod Touch..... and you heard the lack of mid bass too...... so what is you recommended player or amp for these earphones?  have you experienced mid bass with these ones?

 

It might be an impedance issue.

 

I have a  2 years old Sony mp3  player and the performance is about the same, however, engaging the Clear Bass feature ( 2 notches out of 3) brings the mid bass out of the coffin, 3 is just too much. For rock and metal tracks, I have to get the mid frequencies a little bit down and push the 16Khz one 2 notches up from flat.

 

For jazz,no eq at all, these earphones are magical.

 

You mentioned that sibilance is not on the recording..... well sometimes it is, sometimes is not. However, boosting treble frequencies around 6khz will exacerbate the annoying  zzzzzz on vocals....

In fact, I  have experienced sibilance with full sized headphones as well. Bad seal usually translates on poor low frequencies IMHO.

 

So, you are planning on purchasing the W60s? 


Edited by mariowar - 4/6/14 at 3:52pm
post #162 of 583

What about EQ?  I have an Ipod Classic and while most of the EQ settings are worthless, the "jazz" setting is great.  Just slightly tips up the treble and bass to make things just a tad livelier.  Absolutely swear by it with my W40's.

post #163 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckdriver View Post

I think the 846 is the flattest IEM, I've had or heard (with the exception of the sub-bass boost). I agree with you that the 846 does not pair particularly well with my iPod Touch 5G. My reasoning is different from yours. I can't detect any sub-bass (of the type that makes the 846 unique amongst BA earphones and more like a dynamic driver) paired with my Touch 5G

I can imagine why the Touch 5G does pair well for you with the TF10 (without EQ). If the things I've read in the past about the TF10 are true, it has a V-shaped sound signature. If you pair V-shaped with “flat” you get a balanced sound for human hearing (at least, my hearing anyway). I need greater decibels in the low and high frequencies because I hear midrange louder. So if I have a “flat” earphone and a “flat” source, the mids are going to stick out.

If someone says flat is necessary and the recording itself creates the balance. I counter with, I don't have the same speakers as the recording engineers so I can't hear their intent. I can only create a balance (using EQ) that makes sense for the speakers that I do have. That's why the iPod doesn't work for me. It doesn't even seem to work for fans of the Apple DAPs. The iPod is loud enough on its own with IEMs, yet people add amps for a better balance.

BTW, with the 846 (or 535) sibilance (that's not in the recording) is mostly due to an inadequate seal. People often think they have a good seal (and will argue about it), but they don't.

I've been doing some testing with my SE846 using iPod Classic and AK120 and I totally agree about the lack of sub-bass: it's nonexistent out of the iPod. If I'd bought them without having a good DAP at my disposal they'd have been sent straight back to the shop and written off as a major disappointment. Having said that, I was initially underwhelmed when I first heard them out of the AK120. Like you mentioned, I thought I had a good seal but it turned out that I didn't. Now that I've found the right tip everything has improved. I love the deep impactful bass but what impresses me most about these little earbuds is the detail and imaging. Now that I'm getting used to them I'm not missing full-sized headphones at all.

I have a couple of little amps on the way just to settle my doubts regarding output impedance issues.
post #164 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spyro View Post
 

What about EQ?  I have an Ipod Classic and while most of the EQ settings are worthless, the "jazz" setting is great.  Just slightly tips up the treble and bass to make things just a tad livelier.  Absolutely swear by it with my W40's.


I have my doubts about software or app. based eq, like the one on Ipods, or the third party ones. When engaged, they usually bury the mid frequencies...

 

In addition to that, it is very evident the volume boost and body you get after turning the Ipod's eq. settings off.....

 

The only one that is decent in my opinion is the simplest PowerAmp for Android, however, itis not available for IOS :(

 

Nothing like hardware based eq.....

 

 

You are lucky that you found a setting that matches your W40s and your way of listening.

post #165 of 583
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony1110 View Post


I've been doing some testing with my SE846 using iPod Classic and AK120 and I totally agree about the lack of sub-bass

Did you mean mid bass? didn't you?

 

They do have TONS of sub bass when it is called for. In fact, I had a blast with my Ipod Touch and Youtube, streaming bass and low frequency tests..... I never ever heard even full sized speakers going DOWN and rumbling the way the SE846 do.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Westone Signature W-series W50 & W60