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The Astell & Kern AK240 - Page 28

post #406 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mython View Post
 

What might have been an interesting and innovative direction, for the AK240 to have taken, is if iRiver had instead produced a pure transport-DAP specifically for use with a 3rd-party DAC-Amp.

 

What might have been an interesting and innovative direction, for a Manufacturer to have taken, is if the said Manufacturer had the guts to produce a pure transport-DAP specifically for use with a 3rd-party DAC-Amp.... now that would be something (had to plagiarise your thoughts).


Edited by OK-Guy - 1/7/14 at 5:04pm
post #407 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mython View Post

 

 

What might have been an interesting and innovative direction, for the AK240 to have taken, is if iRiver had instead produced a pure transport-DAP specifically for use with a 3rd-party DAC-Amp.

 

+1000

post #408 of 8541

Actually the price ($2400) is not unreasonable. You can divide the price into three parts:

 

player/dac: $800

storage: $800

amp: $800

 

We are assuming this AK240 can compete with and exceed any 2-piece stack. LO is unnecessary.

post #409 of 8541

Just to elaborate on my thinking about the possibility of a pure transport-DAP

 

My thinking was that the AK240 doesn't really offer much innovation over and above the AK120.

 

They could have produced a pure transport-DAP (which, lacking an amp or DAC, would be substantially slimmer) and (though it disgusts me to say it) sold it alongside the AK120 in their range, for almost the same price.

 

Had they done that, some customers would have jumped at the chance of a slimmer front-end to match with their DAC-amp (or DAC + Amp) of choice, and (though it pains me to say it) would probably have been willing to pay nearly the same price for it as they would otherwise have done for the full-fat AK120.

 

Therefore, less electronics content would equate to a profit margin that would've increased without needing to charge a higher RRP, and it would've provided the market with something not already catered-for, in their range, by the AK120.

 

 

But then, I'm forgetting the fact that the DAP is secondary in iRiver's business equation - they're selling a Brand name and an Idea, with the DAP being entirely secondary to that aim.

 



Edited by Mython - 1/7/14 at 5:35pm
post #410 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMinor View Post
 

Actually the price ($2400) is not unreasonable. You can divide the price into three parts:

 

player/dac: $800

storage: $800

amp: $800

 

We are assuming this AK240 can compete with and exceed any 2-piece stack. LO is unnecessary.

 

 

No, you are assuming that the AK240 can compete with any 2-piece stack. I, and quite a few others, are not assuming that at all.

 

And by the way, $800 for 'storage' is laughable.

post #411 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mython View Post
 

 

 

No, you are assuming that the AK240 can compete with any 2-piece stack. I, and quite a few others, are not assuming that at all.

 

And by the way, $800 for 'storage' is laughable.


+1 to both statements. Laughed so hard on $800 for storage.

post #412 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mython View Post
 

 

 

No, you are assuming that the AK240 can compete with any 2-piece stack. I, and quite a few others, are not assuming that at all.

 

And by the way, $800 for 'storage' is laughable.

 

If the AK240 can't even compete with any 2-piece stack, throw that POS into toilet. :)

 

$800 for storage is not really laughable. Take a look at the cost for a 256GB CF card (Sandisk or Lexar). if you want the best sound, go with the CF card not the micro. Bad news is these hi-end daps don't do CF's, they give you the micros for the price of CF's for profits.

 

To my ears the CF's just sound more dynamic than the micro's.


Edited by DMinor - 1/7/14 at 5:43pm
post #413 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMinor View Post
 

Actually the price ($2400) is not unreasonable. You can divide the price into three parts:

 

player/dac: $800

storage: $800

amp: $800

 

We are assuming this AK240 can compete with and exceed any 2-piece stack. LO is unnecessary.

 

lets base this on the comparable & probable UK Dealer price of say £2700 (includes taxes)

 

ZX1 (includes Source-Transport/DAC/AMP/Storage 120gb+) - £500 (cheaper if you go for another DAP)

Chord Hugo (Reference DAC/Amp) - £1200-1300 (will/could set a new standards in portable-fi)

Total £1800 and this will have full connectivity into a home system via the Hugo or Sony.

 

I now have £1000 left for some headphones.... so I guess it will boil down to what is important to you the end user.

post #414 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmichels View Post
 

 

here comes Vinnie's mods :  Please change this "Fragile-2,5mm plug" for a serious Mini-XLR, add a real line-out, and.... some more RWA black magic ! 

 

 

You want a line out?  To feed to a portable headphone amp?  The AK240 is big enough!  And for $2400, it better have a great amp in there already.  Otherwise, modded AK100 and AK120 

feeding an external amp will probably be better.  I just don't imagine something as good (and powerful) as a RSA R71B is going to be in there.  There isn't enough space for that kind of

circuit.  

 

My guess (just a guess at this point) is that the AK240 will drive IEMs just fine, but won't have much more power compared to the AK120 for pushing something like an LCD-3.  Not even close to the power of something like the SR71B, or the ALO International.   

 

I think the output voltage spec of the AK240 was already posted, and if I remember correctly, was not more than 1V more than the AK120.  

 

Having said all of this, when the AK240 is on the market, I'd like to take a good look at it and see what it can do, and what can be done with it.  All we can

do is speculate at this point about it, how it sounds, how good the interface is, etc.  It could be a game changer, or it could end up being something that

justifies buying the AK120 :wink:

post #415 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinnie R. View Post
 

 

I think the output voltage spec of the AK240 was already posted, and if I remember correctly, was not more than 1V more than the AK120.  

 

 

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/697166/the-astell-kern-ak240/210#post_10138461

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/697166/the-astell-kern-ak240/210#post_10138392

post #416 of 8541
Quote:
Originally Posted by OK-Guy View Post
 

 

lets base this on the comparable & probable UK Dealer price of say £2700 (includes taxes)

 

ZX1 (includes Source-Transport/DAC/AMP/Storage 120gb+) - £500 (cheaper if you go for another DAP)

Chord Hugo (Reference DAC/Amp) - £1200-1300 (will/could set a new standards in portable-fi)

Total £1800 and this will have full connectivity into a home system via the Hugo or Sony.

 

I now have £1000 left for some headphones.... so I guess it will boil down to what is important to you the end user.

 

£2700 for the AK240?  That has to be a mistake.  That's $4400 USD?  

 

[Well, if that is true I'll try to buy a small stock of AK240s and sell them to the UK for you guys much lower (and I'll take care of the customs) - LOL :rolleyes:

But I wouldn't be alone in doing so I'm sure.  No dealer in the UK will want to sell it then because the black market will dominate.]

 

Seriously speaking though - I think Mython has the right idea.  Make a thin, lightweight pure transport DAP with serious storage size, great play time, and

a few digital connectivity options (coax, toslink, usb) and then offer a dac/amp, or let the customer pick the one they want to use.  It would have the potential

to sell more than the current higher end DAPs.  I'd love to use one for home audio and portable use!   Even better, allow for a built-in amp option (you pay for it

if you want all-in-one, or you don't bother).  Modular design is the way to go!  

post #417 of 8541

 

- Output power 1.65Vrms(AK120)----->2.3Vrms AK240

 

haha - 0.65Vrms increase is not much of an increase in output into most headphones.  

For IEMs, I think the AK100/120 output stage has plenty of power as is.  

 

For the cost, I would want it to do a solid job driving Audeze, Senns, AKGs, HifiMan, etc.  But I'm not

much of a fan of IEMs (not because of the sound, but because I can't stand how they feel in my ears.  I'm a little

nutty about that for some reason - and probably many other things, too :bigsmile_face:).

 

 

 

 

post #418 of 8541
Vinnie time for you to design a portable amp for us all, come on biggrin.gif
post #419 of 8541

I think most of the big boys are more into getting a cut from the online music sales to make their business more sustainable. If possible, design the hardware in a way to refrain customers from using other gear rather than modular design so to ensure customers to always go for the next upgrade. The good way of looking at this approach is that the product quality is usually more stable and reliable.

 

I would like a 2.1V line out for use at home if the D/A on this thing is excellent.

post #420 of 8541
AK should've done what Centrance did with the Hifi-M8. Asked the insights of Head-Fiers. I believe that should be the way now.
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