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FiiO X5 preview world tour--tour members, claim your souvenir for the X5 tour! p.123 - Page 62

post #916 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post
 

 

That seems to be a perpetual theme with all the new DAPs coming out lately: How much slack is it reasonable to give them when it comes to bugs and missing features. I think the simplest answer, given everyone's varying tolerances for these things is: Make an article/wiki with the current status of the performance and software showing everything from battery usage time to missing or broken features. "Read the Wiki before asking questions" can then be added to the main thread titles. Then people interested in buying it can decide if any of those are show-stoppers or not before they buy it. That is also the best and most reasonable way to encourage the manufacturer to improve their software without having to rant on about stuff that just annoys people who don't want to read about what they already know for the nth time. :smile:

 

Can't agree more ! 

post #917 of 1895

BTW, we have sold out about 2,000 pcs X5 in China, if you can read Chinese, you can find there are not too many complain about the features and bugs. I think it is impossible to hide the true in 21 century.

post #918 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesFiiO View Post

BTW, we have sold out about 2,000 pcs X5 in China, if you can read Chinese, you can find there are not too many complain about the features and bugs. I think it is impossible to hide the true in 21 century.

Not surprised James and thank god for that! wink.gif
post #919 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kendoji View Post

The two 'glaring' defects you mention have been documented plenty here - there's not much more to say about them right now. And to most people they're minor. To me gapless playback and media library are unimportant (I like to browse by folder anyway). Yes we get that they're important to you. In which case you can wait to see when / if they get improved later on before buying. Or buy another DAP. It doesn't mean that other people's priorities can't be different to yours.

 

I think you, like a lot of other people, are missing my point.    My initial post was not complaining about the problems in the X5 specifically - i was complaining about how the cons get glossed over.    I am sorry, but being able to read ID3 tags reliably and without problems is a very basic functionality - this isnt akin to Maps, but more akin to say, a phone being unable to make calls from the Contact list or something like that.    

 

Currawong's post raises a good point - how much slack do we give the manufacturer?   I dont think we should rip them a new one, but at the same time, we shouldnt bend over backwards and accept all failings, especially major ones.  I get the feeling that we are leaning towards the latter right now.

post #920 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesFiiO View Post
 

 

I can understand what people complained about and we also hope X3, X5 will be perfect, but there are something need to clarify. 

 

1, Unless we have some software like iTune, there will always have problem in the music library updating and music playback, we are not trying to defend us, but we believe that Apple can do better if they don't use iTune to conver all the music files to the standard format and create the data base first.

 

2, Sometimes it is not the fault of X3 or X5 itself,  sometimes it is cause by the format of the micro SD card.

 

3, Why we still sell it before we can fix all the bugs, trust me, it is mission impossible if we can find out and fix all the bugs. maybe it is not a suitable example, but even iPhone have some serious bugs , and they have thousands of engineers but we have only very few engineers.

 

4, We are trying to meet the requirement from our user, but I think we are equal, means you get what you pay and we have not lie to our customers, but it is not a serious issue and we should response to , for example, as a customer, I want a replaceable battery and a micro SD card in iPhone, OK, 

 

    I can buy Galaxy Note III, but if I like the iOS, I have to buy iPhone.

 

OK, at least we are listening and keep working hard to improve the design the build quality and the UI and all the thing. so if you trust us please support us, if not, you will not loss anything.    

 

Hi James -

 

As I said in my earlier post, I am planning to buy an X5 if it meets my needs.    I already own an X3 and an E12, btw.

 

I realize there are going to be bugs.   I am not saying the X5 needs to be completely bug-free.   However, being able to reliably read the files in a SD card and build a library based on ID3 tags - one that goes to 2 levels at the very least ( Artist -> Album) is a very, very basic function.   One of the most essential aspects of a portable player - especially one which is being sold with such a large capacity as yours.

 

My old Creative Zen, the Sansa Clip or any basic Android or W8 phone has no problems recognizing and properly identifying my music when i stick a card in there.   With the X3, i spent 2 months in email exchanges with your staff to no luck - and only after reading here on Head-fi did i then sit down and manually go through each and every album to delete the extra ID3 tags and cleaned up the song titles before the player started to work.   To me, that is a workaround, not a solution.    

 

I was very excited about the sound quality and specs of the X5 - but very disappointed to learn that the same tagging issues still exist.    Given this history, I am a little more skeptical that all this is "easy to fix" in a future firmware upgrade - I am only going to accept it is fixed once i see it.    And I hope you ARE able to fix it soon, b/c the specs on the product sound really good. 

post #921 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post

I think you, like a lot of other people, are missing my point.    My initial post was not complaining about the problems in the X5 specifically - i was complaining about how the cons get glossed over.    I am sorry, but being able to read ID3 tags reliably and without problems is a very basic functionality - this isnt akin to Maps, but more akin to say, a phone being unable to make calls from the Contact list or something like that.    

Currawong's post raises a good point - how much slack do we give the manufacturer?   I dont think we should rip them a new one, but at the same time, we shouldnt bend over backwards and accept all failings, especially major ones.  I get the feeling that we are leaning towards the latter right now.

I don't think it got glossed over, he knows exactly what's wrong with the current version and we all made it clear either through posting or pms that those need to be addressed to make it a world class player. No one is forced to say anything or for that matter to buy anything, if the player is not for you then the best is to move on. If you want to help then by all means buy the unit and comment all you want to make it a better player, there will be additional rounds for the X5 and a chance for you to make a difference.
post #922 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post
 

 

I think you, like a lot of other people, are missing my point.    My initial post was not complaining about the problems in the X5 specifically - i was complaining about how the cons get glossed over.    I am sorry, but being able to read ID3 tags reliably and without problems is a very basic functionality - this isnt akin to Maps, but more akin to say, a phone being unable to make calls from the Contact list or something like that.    

 

Currawong's post raises a good point - how much slack do we give the manufacturer?   I dont think we should rip them a new one, but at the same time, we shouldnt bend over backwards and accept all failings, especially major ones.  I get the feeling that we are leaning towards the latter right now.

 

I think you are missing our point. How else are we supposed to make it any more clear that we're already reporting all issues with the player?  Cons aren't getting glossed over; and thats a bad anology imo.  Does the player play music?  yes.  Does it stop, go to next track, pause, raise and lower volume?  yep.  Those are basic functions.  Reading ID3 tags isn't a necessity. Yeah a lot of us use it, like a lot of people use maps but not everyone does like not everyone uses maps.  

 

Can we navigate to any particular song and play it? yep it can.  Does it do it the way YOU like it to; sadly it doesn't do it well all the time. 

 

Basic functionality works for the X5, if it couldn't play a song or freezes all the time....then thats basic functions not working.

post #923 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post
 

 

I think you, like a lot of other people, are missing my point.    My initial post was not complaining about the problems in the X5 specifically - i was complaining about how the cons get glossed over.    I am sorry, but being able to read ID3 tags reliably and without problems is a very basic functionality - this isnt akin to Maps, but more akin to say, a phone being unable to make calls from the Contact list or something like that.    

 

Currawong's post raises a good point - how much slack do we give the manufacturer?   I dont think we should rip them a new one, but at the same time, we shouldnt bend over backwards and accept all failings, especially major ones.  I get the feeling that we are leaning towards the latter right now.

We get it ! All of the reviewers are lemmings headed for the sea and only you can correct our course and save us from ourselves

post #924 of 1895
With any DAP in this market there are teething problems, it's a natural occurrence. Take a look at DX50 launch where firmware updates wouldn't even install successfully without freezing the unit for some. Or when the volume would get stuck progressing to max at random. No harm meant to IBasso but these are just examples. Patience from the consumers side and time goes a long way in this hobby. FiiO will correct the issues in due time, they probably have 1000 other things to do first.
post #925 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by henwell View Post
 

We get it ! All of the reviewers are lemmings headed for the sea and only you can correct our course and save us from ourselves

 

  :D

 

*

post #926 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicheaven View Post
 

 

  :D

 

*

I love it!

post #927 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by TekeRugburn View Post
 

 

I think you are missing our point. How else are we supposed to make it any more clear that we're already reporting all issues with the player?  Cons aren't getting glossed over; and thats a bad anology imo.  Does the player play music?  yes.  Does it stop, go to next track, pause, raise and lower volume?  yep.  Those are basic functions.  Reading ID3 tags isn't a necessity. Yeah a lot of us use it, like a lot of people use maps but not everyone does like not everyone uses maps.  

 

Can we navigate to any particular song and play it? yep it can.  Does it do it the way YOU like it to; sadly it doesn't do it well all the time. 

 

Basic functionality works for the X5, if it couldn't play a song or freezes all the time....then thats basic functions not working.

I agree! FiiO makes some great products at a price point that makes it affordable for most of us to enjoy good portable music. There are lots of expensive players out there, A&K 120 and the new 240 I doubt that they are perfect and meet everyones needs, you have to find the player that has the features you want and delivers the sound quality you desire. I would pick sound quality over some of the features that are debated here to the point of nausea. I think all of the reviewers while showing excitement for the X5 have been quite objective in their reviews.


Edited by henwell - 2/9/14 at 9:42am
post #928 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post
 

 

I'll repeat my point - everyone is so excited about the player and its pros, that the cons are getting glossed over.   No offense - and no attack on you whatsoever - but if you look at your post above, it epitomizes what i am saying.

 

Let's recap:

1.  Gapless doesnt work properly right now - not for classical and yet everyone is giving them a pass saying it will get fixed soon.  

2.  Artist > Album > Track is not exactly an outlier method of accessing one's library.   It is very basic functionality which it doesnt do properly/reliably, and this is also getting a pass as "it will get fixed soon"

 

Forget what *will* happen and whether it is an easy fix or not.   It doesnt work right now.    

 

For one, if it is that easy a problem, how come they didnt get it right the first time, especially given that this is not their first player?  

 

And second, these arent new problems:  the X3 (and the DX50) have had these problems in the past and they still havent gotten it to work properly - both the DX50 and the X3 require deletion of most ID3 tags in order for the library function to work.     That isnt a fix on the manufacturer's side, that is a workaround on our side.   I now can no longer have Album Artist tags separate from Artist, I lose my Composer tag, I can no longer use a separate field to keep track of the orchestra.   Other people may not care about that, but I do.      So I dont share your confidence that it will get fixed easily unless we start shouting for it.

 And contrary to how i may come across here, i am not hating on the product.   I've just had to spend a LOT of time getting both my DX50 and my X3 to catalog my music properly - and if a DAP cannot do that properly, then it has failed as a DAP.    I really would like to get an X5 - but only if the UI works properly, and I dont have to fight it every time i want to listen to some music.    

 And it is a little frustrating to see how little pressure we, as consumers, are exerting on the manufacturer to Get It Right.

 


Vkalia - whilst I can see your point of view - you're trying to classify myself and the other reviewers by your standards. The thing I don't personally like - is that you've already stated, and keep stating that I'm showing bias, and not reviewing as you would like.

Well I'll encourage you to go back and re-read my review .... and note (because I put this in for a reason):

 

Quote:
WHAT I LOOK FOR IN A DAP
I thought I’d list (before I start with the review) what I really look for in a new DAP.
  • Great (neutral) sounding – but with body (not thin)
  • Good build quality
  • Reasonable battery life
  • Easy to use interface
  • Able to drive both low impedance and (within reason) higher impedance cans without additional amping.

Did I get all of this with the X5? Mostly – yes, and I’m sure what is missing will come with firmware updates. Will I be buying an X5 – likely based on my very short time with it, but this would be dependent on FW upgrades which I will be watching closely. So please pull up a chair, sit for a while, and let me relay my experiences with Fiio’s new flagship.

This is a purely subjective review - my gear, my ears, and my experience. Please take it all with a grain of salt - especially if it does not match your own experience.

 

 


I stated very clearly that this was my subjective thoughts on the X5. I also stated very clearly what my criteria was.

Now let's look at how it measured up:

 

  1. Build = 9.5/10. Wheel could feel a little firmer, and the SD protectors are difficult to remove - but neither is a deal breaker. Everything else is solid.
  2. Accessories = 10/10. Everything I could wish for and more.
  3. UI = 7.5/10, and remember this is for my preferences. I had no issues with scanning at all on both 64gb cards. But - my music is meticulously tagged. Yes the tagged library needs some work - but I use folder browsing anyway, and that is flawless. Yes gapless has about a quarter second delay - but that doesn't really affect my listening preferences.
  4. Sound = 10/10
  5. Power = 10/10 - for the headphones I use, both full sized and IEMs - no issues driving at all.
  6. Battery life = 8/10. Would have liked more, but adequate
  7. Other features = 10/10. Dual slots. can be used as digital transport, and as a DAC (which is outstanding), and has a very clean line out to boot.
  8. Value = 10/10. I'd rate it higher if I could.


Overall score (by me in the review) was 4.5/5 (or 9/10). For MY preferences - how can you critique that?

Now look at what you are asking for ........ (I am guessing)

  • Great Sound
  • Flawless UI - with all the tagging recognised, including tags like composer which the X5 doesn't have
  • Reasonable battery life and power
  • etc etc


The X5 won't do it - nor does it claim to, nor does my review or any of the others claim it. What you are looking for is the AK240 ...... or an iPod + CLAS + amp. But you'll pay for that. What Fiio has brought to the table with the X5 is something which in my eyes is already ideal for my preferences, and with updates could truly be a best in class.

Can I suggest that instead of stating (repeatedly) that our reviews are not living up to your expectations, then write your own. You could start with the X3 maybe. I shall look forward to it.

post #929 of 1895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooko View Post
 

:D

 

No - but do make sure that individual tracks are always prefixed by their order in the album.  EG my Kempff's Beethoven Sonatas has file names:
 

01 - 1. Pathetique - Grave - Allegro di molto e con brio.flac

02 - 2. Pathetique - Adagio cantabile.flac

03 - 3. Pathetique - Rondo (Allegro).flac

04 - 1. Moonlight - Adagio sostenuto.flac

05 - 2. Moonlight - Allegretto.flac

06 - 3. Moonlight - Presto agitato.flac

etc

 

That way they are always in order.


Brooko, this was indeed very clarifying, and I thank you for your very precise description about how I can implement folder view for classical listening. That is a good idea to also have a separate number for each movement in a piece so that you can see which movement of each piece is now playing.

post #930 of 1895

james, i prefer your approach much better....there is an open channel for quick and efficient communication that is responded to much quicker

 

than any of the larger companies: that includes both software and hardware issues...thanks and please don't change!

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