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Numbers,.... Male vs Female HeadFiers? - Page 4

post #46 of 121
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post
 

 

I attribute the difference to varying value systems. Women aren't as obsessive about audio quality because they are more focused on the other things that society so aggressively markets to them. Just think about the percentage of goods and services that are pushed into women's faces on a daily basis. It doesn't even just apply to audio. Look at most hobbies in general. They're occupied by men, and I think it's because we're encouraged as a gender to be more explorative. Women, however are pigeon-holed more or less. Go watch the series Mad Men to understand how attitudes were back then.

 

Us head-fi'ers are also in the minority. Most men out there also don't care about SQ. I had a friend of mine who's a music producer listen to a pair of UE Reference Monitors, and he said he couldn't really differentiate them from my MP 8320 SQ-wise. We been conditioned to value these tiny things as a result of peer influence and personal drive, not because of evolution. An ex-girlfriend of mine is an audiologist. For fun I'd always let her listen to new acquisitions. Of course she heard the differences, but did she care? No. She did love how clear the DT880 was though. It was the only one she actually considered buying for herself.

 

 

Sorry for coming off as combative. I'm just hungry I guess :D


Now that is a good post. You pointed out a very interesting point of view I had not considered. Nothing judgmental about other points of view, just good compelling logic. If the truth be told, I bet the ultimate truth lies within a little of all the points of views expressed. Well done and I bet no feathers were ruffled either!

post #47 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post
 

 

I attribute the difference to varying value systems. Women aren't as obsessive about audio quality because they are more focused on the other things that society so aggressively markets to them. Just think about the percentage of goods and services that are pushed into women's faces on a daily basis. It doesn't even just apply to audio. Look at most hobbies in general. They're occupied by men, and I think it's because we're encouraged as a gender to be more explorative. Women, however are pigeon-holed more or less. Go watch the series Mad Men to understand how attitudes were back then.

 

Us head-fi'ers are also in the minority. Most men out there also don't care about SQ. I had a friend of mine who's a music producer listen to a pair of UE Reference Monitors, and he said he couldn't really differentiate them from my MP 8320 SQ-wise. We been conditioned to value these tiny things as a result of peer influence and personal drive, not because of evolution. An ex-girlfriend of mine is an audiologist. For fun I'd always let her listen to new acquisitions. Of course she heard the differences, but did she care? No. She did love how clear the DT880 was though. It was the only one she actually considered buying for herself.

 

 

Sorry for coming off as combative. I'm just hungry I guess :D

Wow that was a great post honestly. Why are there so many hobbies that women jsut dont participate in? Yea great question. Maybe ur right -- patriarchal discourse is inherently rooted in a drive to explore and find. Thanks for an interesting point of view :). Something to think about definitely! 

post #48 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by proton007 View Post

Before quoting Schopenhauer, it would be worthwhile to mention that he was kind of abandoned by his own mother.
That shaped a lot of his views on women.

 

There were different reasons why he didn't get along with his mother. He accused her that she abandoned her husband who was left alone dying and generally they were very different people who were in disagreement on many things. Though his clear writing style had something to do with his mother being a writer.

 

I don't think that his views on women were shaped by his relationship with his mother. As a character he was extremely demanding on people in general which led him to have some misanthropic traits and caused him to make very aggressive statements about women and humanity. He also ruthlessly trumped his opponent Hegel but he didn't do it because of personal agenda only. Their philosophies didn't get along as well.

 

As for contemporary changing role of women ( equality in treatment) in my opinion it has more to do with political and social changes. Which doesn't nullify biological differences which men and women have. When Schopenhauer in the middle of 19th century wrote that there were nil outstanding painters among women despite their big efforts in that field still in 21 century we don't know a single female painter who is remarkable and genuinely original. I don't know a female writer who is original either. Sure there were some decent female writers but they didn't offer anything new to the table. 

 

My opponents only can criticize me in sexism but their counter arguments are very weak and show lack of quality in their thinking.


Edited by mutabor - 12/12/13 at 1:18am
post #49 of 121
Mutabor, try reading Mary Shelly sometime and then try telling me there were no women writers who were original as authors for their time.

Sexism is a trait of a weak and closed mind my friend. Keep it up and you're going to be the proverbial old man living alone with a 100 cats.
Edited by DigitalFreak - 12/12/13 at 2:42am
post #50 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalFreak View Post

Sexism is a trait of a weak and closed mind my friend. Keep it up and you're going to be the proverbial old man living alone with a 100 cats.

 

Your insults are not even persuasive, only rude.

post #51 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutabor View Post

There were different reasons why he didn't get along with his mother. He accused her that she abandoned her husband who was left alone dying and generally they were very different people who were in disagreement on many things. Though his clear writing style had something to do with his mother being a writer.

I don't think that his views on women were shaped by his relationship with his mother. As a character he was extremely demanding on people in general which led him to have some misanthropic traits and caused him to make very aggressive statements about women and humanity. He also ruthlessly trumped his opponent Hegel but he didn't do it because of personal agenda only. Their philosophies didn't get along as well.

As for contemporary changing role of women ( equality in treatment) in my opinion it has more to do with political and social changes. Which doesn't nullify biological differences which men and women have. When Schopenhauer in the middle of 19th century wrote that there were nil outstanding painters among women despite their big efforts in that field still in 21 century we don't know a single female painter who is remarkable and genuinely original. I don't know a female writer who is original either. Sure there were some decent female writers but they didn't offer anything new to the table. 

My opponents only can criticize me in sexism but their counter arguments are very weak and show lack of quality in their thinking.

Mutabor, there is no lack of female talent in writing. Frida Kahlo for painting. Or Mary Shelly abd even jk Rowling for writing.
The truth is that females have much intrinsic ability -- your argument that they don't is a manifestation of the lack of a desire to appreciate them. Probably a vestige of our patriarchal origins, we look at work from women with no appreciation -- it is our critical view which entrenches your thought in a self fulfilling prophecy. If you keep on believing there are no women who have the talent or skill to compare to man, you will never find a woman who disproves your theory. Truly, it is only in your sexist thought that what you are saying has any credence; and yet when we criticize this you in this you say our arguments are "weak."
post #52 of 121

Extremely well read in three languages ( Russian, English, French) Vladimir Nabokov wrote to Edmund Wilson, who had been making suggestions for his lectures: "I dislike Jane [Austen], and am prejudiced, in fact against all women writers. They are in another class." Although his wife Véra Nabokov worked as his personal translator and secretary, he made publicly known that his ideal translator was a male, and particularly not a "Russian-born female". However, on rereading Mansfield Park he soon changed his mind and taught it in his literature course; he also praised the work of Mary McCarthy.

 

He included Mansfield Park in his lectures because he wanted to make an impression that he abides the course of political correctness. 

 
post #53 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post

Your insults are not even persuasive, only rude.

An sexism isn't rude? Lol, certain types of people are so interesting to observe in how they act, very entertaining.
post #54 of 121

Are men and women different? They're different anatomically, of course, but are they different in any other ways? Do their hormonal differences influence their behaviors and attitudes? Do they process information differently?

Feminists and gay theorists often say "no" to these questions. They maintain that the differences between men and women are mostly the result of socialization in male-dominated societies, and that it is patriarchal oppression that has relegated women to feminine gender roles. Biology is said to have little to do with abilities or sex roles in our society.

 

Sexual Mythology Versus Scientific Facts

Professor Steven Goldberg, Chairman of the Department of Sociology at City College of New York, has written a book with the provocative title, Why Men Rule--A Theory of Male Dominance. In the book, he debunks much of the feminist mythology surrounding the issue of differences between males and females.

Goldberg maintains that although males and females are different in their genetic and hormonally-driven behavior, this does not mean that one sex is superior or inferior to another. Each gender has different strengths and weaknesses. However, he believes the neuro-endocrinological evidence is clear: The high level of testosterone in males drives them toward dominance in the world, while the lack of high levels of this hormone in women creates a natural, biological push in the direction of less dominant and more nurturing roles in society.

Goldberg writes:

 

"There is not, nor has there ever been, any society that even remotely failed to associate authority and leadership in suprafamilial areas with the male. There are no borderline cases." (3)

Feminist theorists maintain that socialization is a primary reason why males have dominated the world's cultures, but Goldberg counters:

 

"...if socialization alone explains why societies are patriarchal, there should be any number of societies in which leadership and authority are associated with women, and one should not have to invoke examples of non-patriarchal societies that exist only in myth and literature." 

 

Biological Differences

To say that men and women are the "same" is to deny physical reality. Child psychologist Dr. James Dobson relates a humorous story about men and women in his best-seller, 

Straight Talk to Men and Their Wives.Several years ago a drug company conducted an experiment with all of the women in a small fishing village in South America. The women were all given an experimental birth control pill. They were given the same pill on the same date, and the prescription was terminated after three weeks to permit menstruation.

"That meant, of course," he says, "that every adult female in the community was experiencing premenstrual tension at the same time. The men couldn't take it. They all headed for their boats each month and remained at sea until the crisis had passed at home. They knew, even if some people didn't, that females are different from males . . . especially every twenty-eight days." (5)

Science makes plain that males and females are different from the moment of conception. As Amram Scheinfeld notes in Your Heredity and Environment, these differences between men and women are evident in the chromosomes which carry inherited traits from the father and mother. Humans have 23 pairs of chromosomes within each cell; twenty-two of these are alike in both males and females. But, says Scheinfeld, "...when we come to the twenty-third pair, the sexes are not the same. . . every woman has in her cells two of what we call the X chromosome. But a man has just one X---its mate being the much smaller Y."

It is the presence of this influential Y chromosome, says Scheinfeld, "that sets the machinery of sex development in motion and results in all the genetic differences that there are between a man and a woman." (6) Right down to the cellular level, males and females are different.

Sex differentiation takes place immediately as the male or female begins to develop within the womb. The sex hormones --primarily estrogen and testosterone--have a significant impact on the behavior of males and females. Why do boys typically like to play with trucks and girls like to play with dolls? Feminists usually claim this is the result of socialization, but there is growing scientific evidence that boys and girls are greatly influenced by their respective hormones.

 

Brain Differences

Males and females are not only markedly different in the hormones that drive them, but they are also different in the way they think. The brains of men and women are actually wired differently.

George Mason University professor Robert Nadeau, the author of S/he Brain: Science, Sexual Politics, and the Feminist Movement, describes significant differences between male and female brains. In an essay on this subject in The World & I, (November 1, 1997), Nadeau observes:

 

"The human brain, like the human body, is sexed, and differences in the sex-specific human brain condition a wide range of behaviors that we typically associate with maleness or femaleness." (8)

Nadeau says that the sex-specific differences in the brain are located both in the primitive regions, and in the neocortex--the higher brain regions. The neocortex contains 70 percent of the neurons in the central nervous system, and it is divided into two hemispheres joined by a 200-million fiber network called the corpus callosum.

The left hemisphere controls language analysis and expression and body movements while the right hemisphere is responsible for spatial relationships, facial expressions, emotional stimuli, and vocal intonations.

Men and women process information differently because of differences in a portion of the brain called the splenium, which is much larger in women than in men, and has more brain-wave activity. (9) Studies have shown that problemsolving tasks in female brains are handled by both hemispheres, while the male brain only uses one hemisphere.

Differences in the ways men and women communicate is also a function of sex-specific areas of the brain. Women seem to have an enhanced awareness of "emotionally relevant details, visual cues, verbal nuances, and hidden meanings," writes Nadeau. Similarly, while male infants are more interested in objects than in people, female infants respond more readily to the human voice than do male infants.

 

Different Brains: Different Abilities

The difference between the male and female brain is not evidence of superiority or inferiority, but of specialization. Michael Levin, writing in Feminism and Freedom, notes that, in general, males have better spatial and math skills than females. While feminists often claim that these differences are due to social expectations--and if girls were encouraged to be mathematicians, they would have the same ability as boys--there is evidence that these differences are inherited and appear in childhood, actually increasing during puberty. On the other hand, girls tend to be more vocal than boys, are better at hearing higher frequencies, and do better than boys in reading and vocabulary tests.

Males have a vastly superior ability to visualize a threedimensional object than do women. This gives the male his often-observed superior abilities in math and geometrical reasoning. In addition, males are better skilled in gross motor movements than are girls. (10)

 

Strength and Endurance

Not only are men and women fundamentally different in the way their brains are wired, they are also vastly different in physical strength and endurance. The differences are rooted within both the genes and the hormones of males and females. Michael Levin notes that women only have 55- 58 percent of the upper body strength of men and on average, are only 80 percent as strong as a man of identical weight. Sex differences also appear by the age of three in the ability of males and females to throw a ball far and accurately. (11)

Feminist leaders naively believe that physical differences between males and females should not be taken into consideration when hiring women to become policemen, firemen, or combat soldiers. Yet as Levin points out, females simply do not have the strength or endurance necessary to be effective combat soldiers. Yet in order to accommodate women who desire to be combat soldiers, the military has designed less stressful physical exercises and standards which would allow them to participate in roles for which they have sought inclusion.

 

Facing Reality

Contrary to the wishful thinking of feminists, bisexuals, and transsexuals, there are profound differences between males and females--and those differences are programmed within the DNA from the moment of conception. The brains of females and males are clearly "sexed," and testosterone and estrogen are the juices that augment maleness and femaleness.

To be sure, gender-distorting prenatal abnormalities do affect some individuals, and may increase the likelihood that such an afflicted person will later self-identify as transgendered or transsexual (and in some cases, homosexual).

But barring such unfortunate developmental errors--- which we should not normalize as if they were not disruptions in normal growth and development--the simple truth remains: maleness and femaleness are innate and integral parts of our human design.

post #55 of 121

Male and female brains wired differently, scans reveal

Maps of neural circuitry show women's brains are suited to social skills and memory, men's perception and co-ordination

Scientists have drawn on nearly 1,000 brain scans to confirm what many had surely concluded long ago: that stark differences exist in the wiring of male and female brains.

Maps of neural circuitry showed that on average women's brains were highly connected across the left and right hemispheres, in contrast to men's brains, where the connections were typically stronger between the front and back regions.

Ragini Verma, a researcher at the University of Pennsylvania, said the greatest surprise was how much the findings supported old stereotypes, with men's brains apparently wired more for perception and co-ordinated actions, and women's for social skills and memory, making them better equipped for multitasking.

"If you look at functional studies, the left of the brain is more for logical thinking, the right of the brain is for more intuitive thinking. So if there's a task that involves doing both of those things, it would seem that women are hardwired to do those better," Verma said. "Women are better at intuitive thinking. Women are better at remembering things. When you talk, women are more emotionally involved – they will listen more."

She added: "I was surprised that it matched a lot of the stereotypes that we think we have in our heads. If I wanted to go to a chef or a hairstylist, they are mainly men."

Verma's team used a technique called diffusion tensor imaging to map neural connections in the brains of 428 males and 521 females aged eight to 22. The neural connections are much like a road system over which the brain's traffic travels.

The scans showed greater connectivity between the left and right sides of the brain in women, while the connections in men were mostly confined to individual hemispheres. The only region where men had more connections between the left and right sides of the brain was in the cerebellum, which plays a vital role in motor control. "If you want to learn how to ski, it's the cerebellum that has to be strong," Verma said. Details of the study are published in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

Male and female brains showed few differences in connectivity up to the age of 13, but became more differentiated in 14- to 17-year-olds.


Edited by mutabor - 12/12/13 at 2:44pm
post #56 of 121

Error


Edited by mutabor - 12/12/13 at 1:51pm
post #57 of 121

Error


Edited by mutabor - 12/12/13 at 1:52pm
post #58 of 121

Great is great, regardless of sex. Occasionally, one finds great female musicians (apart from singers). Among pianists, I have high esteem for Clara Haskil. I'd rank her between 10-20th greatest, and she'd be the only woman in my top 20. Guiomar Novaes stands out, but I wouldn't rank her within the top 25. But that's how it usually is. Women have done better with string instruments; maybe hand-size doesn't matter as much. Still, as rare as vituosity is, it rarer still among women. Research on sex and intelligence suggests that men are both more extremely smart and stupid than women. Maybe that's true of other talents too, such as music.

post #59 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by mutabor View Post
 

 

 

 

 

Dear readers of this thread,

 

I am speaking in my capacity as a real-life scientist, one who just sat through doctorate level courses in Neuropsychology, Endocrinology, and several other difficult sounding classes (:D). Please completely disregard everything that was just posted by mutabor as pseudoscience, the practice of twisting small truths and stretching them to meet a specific agenda.

 

Firstly, the sex hormones are indeed partially responsible for one's behavior. They are also responsible for the formation of reproductive paraphernalia. But to attribute so many things to them is simply wrong.

 

I have female classmates who are far more adept than I am at solving complex biopharmaceutics and drug kinetics problems. When it comes to medicinal chemistry, these female classmates can also easily visualize the chemical structures of large drug molecules and predict what changes will be brought about by their various metabolic enzymes. By mutabor's logic (rather, by the writings he so dearly clings to...it's obvious his ideas have been the result of some sort of cherry-picking material), these women should be butch lesbians who scoff at high heels and lipstick. Instead, they're among the most graceful and feminine women I know.

 

The fact is that, unless one has specific neural disorders like schizophrenia or manic episodes, most behavior is a learned process. It starts extremely early in life, too. Most people have formed the outlines of their personalities before they reach the age of 5. I myself am a more conceptual learner, shying away from tasks like math and chemistry. Am I a gay man with a lisp? No, I'm 6'4", 220 pounds of muscle, and I'm as athletic and manly as they come. 

 

I'm speaking out because I hate generalizations. They don't belong in an civilization that leans on evidence-based science. And as a lover of the scientific process, I hate seeing it distorted.

 

 

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mutabor View Post
 

 

Feminists and gay theorists often say "no" to these questions. 

 

 

This should tell any discerning reader everything they need to know.


Edited by eke2k6 - 12/12/13 at 2:25pm
post #60 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post
 

I'm speaking out because I hate generalizations. They don't belong in an civilization that leans on evidence-based science.

 

"Two newspapers in one" -- James Taranto

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