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The FiiO X1 Discussion and Help and Support Thread |192K/24B|100mW | LO | inline remote - Page 18

post #256 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post

I am thinking that to make X1 easy to implement (and so to keep it less than $100), FiiO could have designed it in similar fashion as C3 and DX50. Basically just remove the hardware volume control and use the DAC internal volume control, then followed by a fixed amp / buffer stage. That should be pretty clean sounding.

That sounds good to me. Really excited about this dap. If I could show all my previous posts about wanting a dap this size with the line out
post #257 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post
 

 

I am thinking that to make X1 easy to implement (and so to keep it less than $100), FiiO could have designed it in similar fashion as C3 and DX50. Basically just remove the hardware volume control and use the DAC internal volume control, then followed by a fixed amp / buffer stage. That should be pretty clean sounding.

Would that make the volume control digital, so that in effect one is hearing fewer bits at less than full volume?  I just checked the WM7840 block diagram and see the PCM Attenuator before the sigma-delta converter, so I'm thinking this would lower dynamic range digitally. 

 

A fixed hardware volume control would not have to limit the device's output impedance, though.  FiiO devices all have ultra-low output impedance, and I'm assuming that the X1 will follow the trend.  Given that the X1 will probably be paired with IEMs often, a low output impedance is an important feature. 

post #258 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzman7 View Post
 

Would that make the volume control digital, so that in effect one is hearing fewer bits at less than full volume?  I just checked the WM7840 block diagram and see the PCM Attenuator before the sigma-delta converter, so I'm thinking this would lower dynamic range digitally.

 

There is always the concern of digital volume control can degrade the sound quality of course. But using a 24bit DAC minimizes the issue when properly implemented.

 

There are three ways to do volume control of a DAP: with SoC, with DAC, or with analog control (*first two are both digital). In general, analog volume control is preferred by audiophiles because of obvious reason - but in a very tight implementation where the analog volume control itself can't be optimized (*in case that it has a relatively high noise floor), you might get better result with digital control. It is basically a choice of the lesser evil.

post #259 of 7658

From FiiO Facebook posting:

 

X1 mockup
- The dimensions will be 88x50mm (as tall as Plan B but wider, close to the width of Plan A. For reference, X3 is 109x55mm)
- The central control group will change from the X5's "X" shape around the scroll wheel to a circle (with the four buttons on the circle still in an X configuration. The buttons' functions (from upper left, clockwise) are as follows: shortcuts key (brings up a quick menu), back, next, previous) (same as on the X5) The centre button will be an "OK/confirm" key.
- The final product will look better. Much better


Edited by Shawn71 - 12/12/13 at 8:14am
post #260 of 7658

so excited about this... i bought the amp to pair with it already!

post #261 of 7658

why in an "x" config.  doesnt make sense

post #262 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by "TekeRugburn" View Post

why in an "x" config.  doesnt make sense

Well this is Unique styling just like the directions NE,NW,SW,SE than the conventional NEWS. And I also think it's kinda message from FiiO that it wants to reach those 4 directions(any direction-global presence!) along with the NEWS directions............:atsmile:

 

Also may be FiiO just wanted to retain that touch (X series-X3 current,upcoming X5 and X1) physically?

post #263 of 7658

I can't believe no one else has requested it yet, but I for one would really like to have a coax digital out on the X1.  How much more could it possibly add to the retail price? $5?  If there's any way for FiiO to implement, I think it would be well worthwhile. 

post #264 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by jj69 View Post
 

I can't believe no one else has requested it yet, but I for one would really like to have a coax digital out on the X1.  How much more could it possibly add to the retail price? $5?  If there's any way for FiiO to implement, I think it would be well worthwhile. 

 

maybe because the the price is estimated to be at 100.  Coax is a a feature not many people even use.  I personally think it'd be a waste of space and cost

post #265 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by TekeRugburn View Post
 

 

maybe because the the price is estimated to be at 100.  Coax is a a feature not many people even use.  I personally think it'd be a waste of space and cost

 

Perhaps, but I have a feeling the X1 may change that.  What happens if the X1 turns out to be an oustanding portable transport, but the sound quality is severely limited by its DAC?  I have the X3 and its midbass boost makes it unlistenable to me through its headphone out or line out.  The only way I can bear to listen to it is through the coax out. 

 

The X1 looks like a better design than the X3, just based on its control button placement and its overall form factor.  Assuming its firmware/operating system live up to its promise (and I have no doubt that it will), it could very easily become unique in the enthusast portable audio marketplace as the only low profile/low cost transport out there. There are already lots of us here on Head-fi using the X3 or iBasso DX50 as a transport.  I'm thinking a lot of them may well prefer the smaller, thinner X1 to reduce the bulk of their "stack."  It would be a shame if the X1 shares the same midbass bump as the X3, with no way to get around it because there is no digital output available. 

 

Let's also not forget the option of connecting the X1 to the DAC in your home system directly via coax.  That's how I use my X3 and DX50 at home. 

 

I think it would be well worth it for FiiO to give it some serious consideration.  If the cost of one more 3.5mm jack and the associated hardware won't affect the target price of the X1 by much, then what's the harm in adding it?  If some people have no use for it, they can just ignore it. 

post #266 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by TekeRugburn View Post
 

 

maybe because the the price is estimated to be at 100.  Coax is a a feature not many people even use.  I personally think it'd be a waste of space and cost


to add, Right now USB-OTG is all what we need and LO, if at all to by-pass the Amp section/make use just wolfson DAC to pair with ext. amp.....

post #267 of 7658

coax out is useful... but if we have to compromise for cost and space, then perhaps we can live without

post #268 of 7658

Come to think of it, if FiiO can't implement a coax out in the X1, maybe they could consider making a "special edition" X1 that is a transport only?  The "X1T," if you will.  Completely remove the internal headphone amp and replace it with a properly clocked, low jitter coax output and two more microSD slots! 

 

How many Head-Fi-ers would line up to buy a reasonably priced, small, thin DAP with well designed stable firmware, excellent ergonomics, a well implemented coax out, and three microSD slots?  :)

post #269 of 7658
Fiio isn't just catering to audiophiles, they are catering more to the masses.

The mid bass boost via line out on the x3? I don't follow the x3 thread but that doesn't sound right. I think it's the amp with the bass boost. The typical fiio house sound but I could be wrong. That's a pretty crappy dac implementation if it has a bass boost via line out.

Coax and usb otg aren't features that's necessary on the x1. Want those features? Get the x3 or dx50. The daps needs to be simple... HO and LO.

I can almost guarantee 90 percent of x3 or dx50 owners don't use the coax out.
post #270 of 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by jj69 View Post
 

Come to think of it, if FiiO can't implement a coax out in the X1, maybe they could consider making a "special edition" X1 that is a transport only?  The "X1T," if you will.  Completely remove the internal headphone amp and replace it with a properly clocked, low jitter coax output and two more microSD slots! 

 

How many Head-Fi-ers would line up to buy a reasonably priced, small, thin DAP with well designed stable firmware, excellent ergonomics, a well implemented coax out, and three microSD slots?  :)


I think the rationale of releasing X1 is to target the general consumers who are not willing to spend a lot of money on DAP. Its success is highly dependent of converging the need of this majority group of people...especially considering a lot of smartphones already have the flac (and even full highres ) support built in without extra charge.

 

Anyway, lets hope X1 will be modder friendly...:D

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