or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Help and Getting Started › Introductions, Help and Recommendations › how come there are more closed back headphones than open back ones?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

how come there are more closed back headphones than open back ones?

post #1 of 17
Thread Starter 

Or at least one for a cheaper price? closed headphones seam to be ideal in studio's(and outdoors) while it would make sense for open ones for home used. but for some reason I can't find a lot open back headphones that are around $100. What makes closed headphones so popular, if they are not portable?  Just asking because I am not knowledgeable of headphones.

post #2 of 17

Hello,

 

There are more closed headphone in sub $100 headphone because most of us purchase a cheaper headphone than our main rig at home for on the go because they isolate better and if we happen to lost it, our heart won't break into many many pieces. As you go higher, [in my opinion] there will be more open headphones, thats because most of us are willing to pay more for better SQ, since it will be used at home, the headphone is free for leaking sound [ and open headphone sound better than closed usually]

 

hope that answer your question

Billson :)

post #3 of 17

That's true on the side of demand. This might be another reason: Closed headphones aren't expected to sound especially good, so suppliers can take advantage of that and produce a lot of subpar closed headphones. Open headphones had better sound good, and suppliers know that too. But they can't make good open headphones without R&D, which would cost them money that they're unwilling to spend.

post #4 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

That's true on the side of demand. This might be another reason: Closed headphones aren't expected to sound especially good, so suppliers can take advantage of that and produce a lot of subpar closed headphones. Open headphones had better sound good, and suppliers know that too. But they can't make good open headphones without R&D, which would cost them money that they're unwilling to spend.

are open headphones are much more expensive than their closed counterparts?

post #5 of 17
No. What Claritas meant: Good headphones are expensive to make, mediocre headphones are cheaper to make. Expectations are higher with open headphones.

Another reason: Most people that use headphones expect some isolation or they would use speakers. So the demand for closed headphones is higher.
post #6 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdsofSteel View Post
 

are open headphones are much more expensive than their closed counterparts?

 

Open headphones aren't necessarily harder to make; on top of @meltie's reply, it can be the reverse. You'd have to make the dampening and chamber size in a closed headphone a lot better than just having a grill at most behind it upon which the soundwaves can bounce off (any driver produces sound on both sides of the diaphragm); in other words, the exact opposite of what makes a Grado inexpensive.

 

The pricing trend all comes down to marketing - if you were a manufacturer hoping to sell a sub-$100 headphone, what are people likely to require from it, or what kind of people are most likely to buy them? Off the top of my head:

1) Portability - most likely someone looking to hook it up to an iPod or other more mainstream players (post-smartphone that's likely to be a tablet also)

-This requires an efficient, closed cup design - with 15mW enough to get it loud, closed to isolate noise and make the most out of that 15mW, earpad-cup size however might be supra-aural to save space at the cost of better isolation

 

2) Cheap and/or rugged construction - goes with portability

- It's either a throw-away, or tough enough (actually and cosmetically resistant to relative abuse)

 

3) "Style" - this is not exclusive to $300, rapper-endorsed headphones; you can't put Hello Kitty's face on a grill, right? But you can on a closed headphone cup, and some kid will ask Mommy to buy a $39 pair because it's cute. Hell, my Mom almost got ME one when it was going for $12 each, because she liked Hello Kitty since it first came out. I had to explain that I'd rather spend my money feeding a real cat than loving a cartoon cat while scolding her then-9yearold son for bringing in a dusty kitten he found in the bushes.
 

 

In both cases you can reach  out to a wider market than just audiophiles, or in the case of cheaper, semi-open monitoring headphones like AKG's K66/77/etc, pros (including amateurs and students - either way it's part of their job now or in the future). In any case, if you don't mind the disadvantages of an open cup design, there's always the SR60 and SR80.  Get one used and tune it to the sound you want, like with different pads, maybe the cups too. I've walked around campus with them after having used the bulkier K66 and a cheap $25 Philips before that, and personally people calling it "retro" (but evoking turntables) feels better than "retro" evoking Ben Stiller jogging.

 

 

 

Or for someone in Asia, at least one Super Sentai series, which is what I got a lot more of.


Edited by ProtegeManiac - 11/21/13 at 8:06am
post #7 of 17
Thread Starter 

thank you for the information guys. I never knew there was much between open and closed headphones and headphones in general.  I have another question though. is it common for open headphones to have velour ear pads? I seen some of them have online though there are some exceptions( one of the sennheisers headphone's for around $30 on amazon has velour while the akg k 240 has leather I believe). why is that?

post #8 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdsofSteel View Post
 

thank you for the information guys. I never knew there was much between open and closed headphones and headphones in general.  I have another question though. is it common for open headphones to have velour ear pads? I seen some of them have online though there are some exceptions( one of the sennheisers headphone's for around $30 on amazon has velour while the akg k 240 has leather I believe). why is that?

 

Earpads - in terms of dimensions and material they're made from - like closed and open headphones each have various advantages and disadvantages on their effect on the sound as well as for comfort and longevity. Some materials are cheap but disintegrate quickly (pleather, some foam) thanks to the acidity of human sweat; others can be more expensive but more comfortable, and if cared for properly, will last long enough (leather and velour).

post #9 of 17

From most longevity to least: good pleather, leather, velour, bad pleather. (http://www.head-fi.org/t/600095/pleather-vs-leather-debunking-the-durability-myth)

 

Roughly, p/leather increases the bass and velour decreases it. I suspect that's why the open models that aspire to neutrality, e.g., the mid-priced Sennheisers, Beyerdynamics, and AKG, tend to use velour. Closed headphones are needed for isolation, and p/leather is more isolating.


Edited by Claritas - 11/22/13 at 7:51pm
post #10 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtegeManiac View Post
 

 

Earpads - in terms of dimensions and material they're made from - like closed and open headphones each have various advantages and disadvantages on their effect on the sound as well as for comfort and longevity. Some materials are cheap but disintegrate quickly (pleather, some foam) thanks to the acidity of human sweat; others can be more expensive but more comfortable, and if cared for properly, will last long enough (leather and velour).

what about ears getting warm? I have a cheap headset and when I use after awhile, my ears get kind of hot. could that be pleather? wasn't too expensive, like maybe $20

post #11 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdsofSteel View Post
 

what about ears getting warm? I have a cheap headset and when I use after awhile, my ears get kind of hot. could that be pleather? wasn't too expensive, like maybe $20

Pleather tend to get hotter than leather but I find velour to be least warm for long term use.. :)

post #12 of 17

I don't use p/leather because it's so warm, particularly on headphones with narrow or shallow cups. (There might be an exception I don't know about with really large pads.)

 

But if you need isolation, you'll probably need p/leather earpads. Some listeners, however, do fine with the velours on Beyerdynamics DT660 & DT770.

post #13 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdsofSteel View Post
 

what about ears getting warm? I have a cheap headset and when I use after awhile, my ears get kind of hot. could that be pleather? wasn't too expensive, like maybe $20

 

That can come from both the material and the size (ie if it wraps around your earlobes as opposed to just sitting on them). I live in a tropical climate and I can't use my HD600s during daylight without an airconditioning system running, so the only times I've actually listened to it in daylight were at meets, which are usually in venues with A/C running the whole time. The annoying bit is, my gaming headset has circumaural pleathers, and it's a real PITA that my brother lives in a different timezone. Our coop games just leave my ears itching.


Edited by ProtegeManiac - 11/23/13 at 9:14am
post #14 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProtegeManiac View Post
 

 

I live in a tropical climate and I can't use my HD600s during daylight without an airconditioning system running, so the only times I've actually listened to it in daylight were at meets, which are usually in venues with A/C running the whole time.

 

Your HD600 are "batphones": they only come out at night.

 

donunus also reported that, "I don't like the feeling of wet pads on my ears and that's what happens with long term use with the hd600s since it is very hot here in the Philippines. With leather or pleather padded headphones, the sweat factor is fine because it only takes one wipe to dry the pads" (http://www.head-fi.org/t/588710/the-notorious-sennheiser-hd280-pro-review/15#post_9628173). Have you tried p/leather pads on HD600?

 

If I moved to the Southern part of the United States, I might try alternating between p/leather and velour based on the season.


Edited by Claritas - 11/23/13 at 11:19am
post #15 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

 

Your HD600 are "batphones": they only come out at night.

 

donunus also reported that, "I don't like the feeling of wet pads on my ears and that's what happens with long term use with the hd600s since it is very hot here in the Philippines. With leather or pleather padded headphones, the sweat factor is fine because it only takes one wipe to dry the pads" (http://www.head-fi.org/t/588710/the-notorious-sennheiser-hd280-pro-review/15#post_9628173). Have you tried p/leather pads on HD600?

 

If I moved to the Southern part of the United States, I might try alternating between p/leather and velour based on the season.

 

There was one store here that sold pleather pads that fit, and I got to borrow an HD650 with those during a local meet. The bass was too boomy for me, although the closer distance between the drivers and ears might have even more to do with that than just the pleather. I don't really mind using them only at night, given there's substantial noise for the open cups outside the house anyway, like my squatter(1) neighbors in the quadplex (not sure if that's an actual term, but it's like two duplex houses together) next door walking around in what Americans call wife beaters(2) screaming at their little daughter to keep her hands the hell away from the "SOB engine"(3). I'm not exaggerating, he's literally screaming at his daughter as I type this while his neighbor in the attached house is arguing with someone over money.

 

I was going to get the K550 for its closed cups, leather(?) pads, and generally flat response to get around all these, but I scored some ASG-1.2's at a price I couldn't resist. And given how these can pass off as hearing aids so long as my phone or other player isn't seen attached to it when I get off the metro train, criminals would likely not be as easily tempted by these.(4)

 

 

 

(1)NOT always literal; it's mostly figurative term that came out of Catholic schools (Leftist students in the government universities would relate that to capitalist oppression and class warfare) used in generally the same sense as "trailer park trash" to describe annoying underclass antics, like screaming their heads off when we're at home on a weekend morning (either hung over or a night bent over a Calculus textbook), or letting their kids out of the house without pants while they roll around on concrete next to their dog's poop. Foreigners typically don't see these things unless they're street photographers who consider the nicer places in the cities boring as photo subjects, kind of like how Marxists hate the bourgeoisie enough to chalk up critique of such child abuse as "class warfare" (that should clarify why I hate Communists, specifically the ones we have here).
(2)We call 'em "sando" over here but I don't know the origin of the term; our underwear traditionally is the white Chinese-style undershirt in long and short sleeves, especially with our national suit made out of thin pineapple fibre.

(3)Translated, colloquial usage is of Spanish cuss words and objects with Tagalog grammar rules applied
(4)If you hear anyone wondering why people in Manila like taking their cars if they have one instead of public tranportaion, THAT'S the real reason (on top of cramming cars vs cramming bodies like sardines during rush hour). Expats typically don't have to worry about these because they usually get a flat near work and won't have to go through certain places on the way to the suburbs or the residential buroughs, so when they wonder about these things, chances are they just don't do the same commute as most other people.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Help and Getting Started › Introductions, Help and Recommendations › how come there are more closed back headphones than open back ones?