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The "non-Grado" Driver Grado Thread - Page 7

post #91 of 448

Happy New Year!

 

I've been "auditioning" some Sennheisers (only for few minutes , each pair) - HD700, HD650, HD600, HD598 and Momentum. I think that the first four were what i would call analitical - every note so perfect, but there was no fun in them. I liked Momentum a lot more, though they weren't as detailed. They are to expensive to take the driver of them, but I've read Tyll opinion on them and he mentioned that they could get better if they were openned. I think they may have bigger driver than 40 mm.


Edited by Rauliki - 1/1/14 at 3:56am
post #92 of 448
Anyone tried these?
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-ce38mb-32-1-1-2-mini-speaker-black-32-ohm--285-131
...could be a budget fix for a busted driver that's out of warranty?
Thoughts?
post #93 of 448

With regards to the Walnut PX100s I posted a few days ago: Wayne's quite right on his original impressions. The Senns are just a better performer almost all the way 'round. 

 

I've been A/Bing the PX100s and my 225s with both L and G cush pads since then.

 

The PX100s:

-Better detail retrieval

-Larger soundstage

-Better bass texture

-More treble (quantity for sure, quality...?)

 

The 225s:

-Smoother treble

-Slightly fuller mids

-Respond better to amping

 

I love my 225s but the PX100s have slowly been changing how I think of the Grado lineup. The PX100 costs less than half of the 225 from Amazon right now and I can't think of anyone who would really prefer the 225i. The PX100s are simply more engaging. 

post #94 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDoe View Post
 

With regards to the Walnut PX100s I posted a few days ago: Wayne's quite right on his original impressions. The Senns are just a better performer almost all the way 'round. 

 

I've been A/Bing the PX100s and my 225s with both L and G cush pads since then.

 

The PX100s:

-Better detail retrieval

-Larger soundstage

-Better bass texture

-More treble (quantity for sure, quality...?)

 

The 225s:

-Smoother treble

-Slightly fuller mids

-Respond better to amping

 

I love my 225s but the PX100s have slowly been changing how I think of the Grado lineup. The PX100 costs less than half of the 225 from Amazon right now and I can't think of anyone who would really prefer the 225i. The PX100s are simply more engaging. 

Do they have the forward grado sound? 

post #95 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by squallkiercosa View Post
 

Do they have the forward grado sound? 

Not as forward but definitely not laid back. To me, the 225 is the least forward of the prestige series and the PX100s are very similar in 'forwardness' to them. 

post #96 of 448
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dba UK View Post

Anyone tried these?
https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-ce38mb-32-1-1-2-mini-speaker-black-32-ohm--285-131
...could be a budget fix for a busted driver that's out of warranty?
Thoughts?

 

I don't believe so.  I did scroll down to check the specs and noted a frequency range of 137 to 20,000 Hz.  I'm not sure if this driver would dig deep enough in the lower bass regions, or if it did, would create issues or distortion.  Then again, the price is right and well worth a try.  I'll have to see if I would need another Parts Express order for other items and it would be worth tossing these in the cart to see.

 

Also, I wanted to add a follow-up from the previous discussion on the thread here between JoeDoe and myself about the upper frequencies when using the PX100 II drivers in wooden cups.  Over the past 2-3 days, I've been trying some various combinations of devices to drive the SennGrads to see where a good "sweet spot" might exist.  The specifics of my little evaluation are listed below.

 

Music player: Foobar

 

Music Genres: Several

 

Amps Used: Schiit Vali, Matrix M-Stage (w/updated power supply), and the Schiit Asgard (v.1).

 

DAC used: oDAC by JDS Labs.

 

Headphones Used:  The SennGrads in wooden cups that I've posted pictures of earlier.  Headphone cable - 6' Canare star quad cable, with a 1/4" Amphenol TRS plug.

 

 

Surprises?  Yes.  While I really loved - I mean loved the Schiit Vali with my Beyerdynamics DT-800 and the T90s, I realized that the Vali didn't play nice with the SennGrads.  Not at all.  The Vali is a hybrid amp with tubes on the "pre" section.  Yet, when most people think of tubes, they think the sound will usually be a bit mellow and controlled.  In the case of the SennGrads, the highs were way too etched.  In fact, I realized I had to apply some EQ adjustments via Foobar to bring the upper frequencies within a range that would be acceptable for longer-term listening sessions.  This really baffled me, especially since the amp was so good with other headphones.

 

More Surprises?  Of course.  I then used the Schiit Asgard (v.1) for a period of time as I switched between the Vali and the Matrix over the period of days to check the sound during various times when I'd have the availability to listen.  The Asgard really performed well with the SennGrads.  In fact, I'd almost call it a match made in heaven.  No EQ adjustments were required at all.  I realized I could really enjoy longer listening sessions with no issues and the sound was just "spot on".  No real issues with upper frequency fatigue were noted.

 

Again, More Surprises!  Sure.  I then utilized the Matrix M-Stage (w/built-in DAC).  I found that when using the Matrix along with the oDAC, the listening experience was similar to that of the Schiit Asgard (v.1).  Yes, that's correct.  No Schiit.  I mean that the Matrix was a very good performer.  Longer sessions were really enjoyed - detailed, good soundstage, good bass, mids, etc. and fatigue-free.  Additionally, I then disconnected the oDAC from the chain and switched over to the DAC built into the Matrix.  I found a sound signature that was awfully similar to that of using the amp section of the Matrix paired with the oDAC.  Just a good, smooth sound that could really be appreciated.

 

Granted, this is just how I perceived the listening sessions based on my ears, level of volume during listening, etc.  I can't believe that the Vali really had that much of reach to really driving up the frequencies with these headphones.  So, like in most situations, the simple snap shot of time can make one garner a first impression that can be lasting.  However, if one is patient and has a few other pieces of gear to work with, the results can sometimes be surprising.  To me, as I had been able to relate to the comments regarding the upper frequencies, I realized that I didn't want to detract any members here in the forum from trying different driver alternatives as we've been discussing or even to have someone get the impression that the Sennheiser PX100 II be avoided as it might have a flaw in this situation.  

 

For me, the SennGrads are staying.  I still am moving ahead with trying to get a few additional pair off the ground since I do have all the supplies available for the purpose.

 

Enjoy ... and Happy New Year !!

 

Edit: I was away from the forum a bit doing some other work.  I wanted to clarify that because in my case the Vali didn't perform as well with the SennGrads, it doesn't reflect in any way that the Vali is an amp that should not be purchased.  The Vali was a very solid performer with many headphones I tried it with.  For the coin, the Vali is an excellent performer.  Truly stunning.  In the case of further stating that the combination of the Vali and the SennGrads didn't work out ideally, but I still think that in this combination, a small bit of EQ adjusting would really make for a good combination.


Edited by wje - 1/1/14 at 8:29pm
post #97 of 448
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeDoe View Post
 

With regards to the Walnut PX100s I posted a few days ago: Wayne's quite right on his original impressions. The Senns are just a better performer almost all the way 'round. 

 

I've been A/Bing the PX100s and my 225s with both L and G cush pads since then.

 

 <snip>

 

Joe, thanks for taking the time to apply additional time for listening to your variations to capture the differences that could be shared with the group here.  Ironically, I had started typing my write-up about 40 minutes ago as I had some additional details to add to the thread.  Since my writing took so long, three posts had been applied here in that time.

post #98 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by wje View Post
 

 

Joe, thanks for taking the time to apply additional time for listening to your variations to capture the differences that could be shared with the group here.  Ironically, I had started typing my write-up about 40 minutes ago as I had some additional details to add to the thread.  Since my writing took so long, three posts had been applied here in that time.

No problemo Master Wayne. I'm still reeling from how much the PX100s are an improvement over the 225s. Seeing your write-up has made me want to do a little source/amp A/Bing of my own. Checking out the LD1+ with cDAC and my Fiio E17 now.

post #99 of 448
Thread Starter 

A bit more experimenting later last evening (or rather about 3:30 a.m.) on Wednesday morning.  More interesting combinations and impressions.

 

1) 2-Channel Yamaha receiver built and make like their retro gear.  As for a DAC, I used my Squeezebox classic, which is built around a Burr-Brown chipset.  The sound was way down in the mud, and I mean really way down.  It actually was a bit thick and not very natural to listen to.  Maybe, some other genres might be a better fit for this combination, but as it was, it just didn't do it for me.  

 

** In the above observation scenario, I didn't use the "pure direct" mode for this receiver which is available for this device.  Pure direct takes in the signal, but sends it through the shortest path possible to pass along to the listener and party of this bypass involves the elimination of any additional sound processing that could take place and result in some attempts to make your music potentially colored and not very true for the recording.  I will go back later and run it with the Pure Direct invoked, though I think the culprit to be the Squeezebox device as the Yamaha normally runs and sounds pretty clean.

 

 

2) I found a "mini" 2-channel integrated amp on Craigslist that I opted for and picked up during my lunch hour.  The cost was only $15.00 and well worth a try.  I had feared that the sound would be too light and too thin due to potential shortfalls in the amp due to cutting back on component quality.  Though, the little device has a bit of weight to it.  For the DAC, I used my JDS Labs oDAC.  The sound was actually real thick.  I mean really thick!  It sounded as though I had been submerged into a mud pit with my headphones on.  I tried some EQ adjustments under Foobar to drop certain points of the lower end frequencies by a large margic.  I was able to get it bass down to a manageable level as I didn't want the SennGrads to sound like a pair of Beats.  

 

3) The third combination for this session of reviewing came in the form of my 2-channel integrated Yamaha amplifier which again like the 2-channel receiver, was made to drive a 2-channel audio system quite well and the amp is of quite good quality as Yamaha paid great attention to this project and make some nice gear.  The DAC was the JDS Labs oDAC.  I ran the amp in "pure direct" mode and was stunned at the performance.  There was a lot of punch on the low end.  I mean a LOT!  But, it wasn't overwhelming or muddy sounding.  The highs were nicely presented.  Detailed, yet not fatiguing in any way.  This is really a "gem" of a listening setup.  I mean really as I'm not sure how much I would have to pay to get this dynamic of performance from a headphone amplifier, and suspect many might not even come close.  This amp is officially my favorite with the SennGrads at this point in time.  A++ on this setup.

post #100 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by stratocaster View Post

If you keep them open-back and are using foam pads, you might really have a completely different FR than mine. Mine were closed-back, damped internally and using leather pads. That of course results in a  FR which is dramatically different from an open-back design. The highs in my setup were really quite tame, the 12k peak/ringing was not really audible. I guess if you have too much high-frequency energy, some sort of acoustic foam in front of the driver might be useful to bring the highs down a bit. 
I was using coffee filter paper behind the driver to get the bass under control. The leather pads did boost the bass enormously and that had to be dealt with.
The Senn drivers do not originally have that 12k peak, as Tyll's measurements show. 

@Stratocaster: I am looking to get the wood turner I work with to make me a fully closed pair of Paduak to make a nice StratoKOSSter build for myself. Are the PX100 a better alternative for a driver? Have you found a way to successfully implement them in a closed design?
post #101 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by fleasbaby View Post


@Stratocaster: I am looking to get the wood turner I work with to make me a fully closed pair of Paduak to make a nice StratoKOSSter build for myself. Are the PX100 a better alternative for a driver? Have you found a way to successfully implement them in a closed design?

 

I would still go KSC-75 with the driver in a closed design with leather pads. Closer to neutral + better highs. 

post #102 of 448
Quote:
Originally Posted by stratocaster View Post
closed design with leather pads.

stratocaster

Could you please give us some directions as to how to make the leather pads.

I think I saw it saw it somewhere on the site but am unable to find it.

 

 

Thanks

post #103 of 448
AFAIK the tutorial was lost for good : (
post #104 of 448
JBDXx4

 I like to plug the Magnum drivers for their improved performance over the standard Grado offering, my view of that scenario has changed.

post #105 of 448
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by c61746961 View Post

AFAIK the tutorial was lost for good : (

 

Yes, I heard the same thing and searched frantically.  Outside of the site here, I searched pretty thoroughly to see if a cached copy existed somewhere, too.  I had a link to the page actually saved as I'd revisit it every now and then.  

 

I'm not sure if the site archives off posts that get to a certain point without being touched.  I can't get enough of the D.I.Y. threads on the forum here ... as well as many of the other threads discussing lots of great products for our music enjoyment.

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