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Oppo PM-1: A New Planar Magnetic Headphone! - Page 114

post #1696 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by OkawaiiO View Post

Um im not sure what big shot is talking about but if u drop 5 db in the 14k + range i can totally hear the difference. Im not saying the song is very different but I can hear a definite cliff at the high frequencies. It also effects ALL IEM(since iems don't normally extend that far) im sure a significant roll off at 12.5k is a very big deal... especially at this price  
It is my understanding that
Bigshot is decribing the range that a headphone should only play, only musical instruments, not a real scenario where all sound comes into play.

When we listen to a live performance, much more than just the instrument is involved. ..
The whole ambient atmosphere of the place is there and that includes from lowest rumble to highest air.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

the last three or four notes in the top octave. There is nothing up there to speak of in recorded music except noise.
You have a natural ability to stir controversy..With info (!) Lol

I would never call anything in or over the "top octave" as noise.
I would call it "air"
tongue.gif
Edited by Maxx134 - 4/23/14 at 9:50pm
post #1697 of 2548
Air sounds nicer, but it isn't as decriptive. If you take a good recording and EQ out everything below 14kHz, you're left with extremely little. Boost the volume on it so you can hear it clearly, and you'll probably call it noise too.
post #1698 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post

If there's a discrepancy between what listeners are hearing and the measurements, it's worthy of discussion.

If there's a discrepancy between measurements and sound, I'd really like to hear about it.

Give me three headphones, all with completely different sound. Give me the frequency response curve on each one. I bet five bucks I can put the right curve with the right headphones.
post #1699 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

If there's a discrepancy between measurements and sound, I'd really like to hear about it.

Give me three headphones, all with completely different sound. Give me the frequency response curve on each one. I bet five bucks I can put the right curve with the right headphones.

I certainly hope so because that's pretty easy.

I think some were wondering about how flat these really are given the measurements. I don't have an opinion either way, nor am I deeply interested. Regardless, measurements should be allowed to stay on the table as a topic for discussion and not simply be written off.
post #1700 of 2548
Well, I've spend months and months calibrating my speaker rig to audibly flat. When I got a set of these Oppo headphones, I was excited because I could hear immediatly that they were very close to my flat speakers. I checked them out and found that they were within 4dB of audibly flat. Pretty doggone good. The graphs I've seen on them look perfectly in line with the sound of them. Flat flat flat.
Edited by bigshot - 4/24/14 at 12:01am
post #1701 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

Well, I've spend months and months calibrating my speaker rig to audibly flat. When I got a set of these Oppo headphones, I was excited because I could hear immediatly that they were very close to my flat speakers. I checked them out and found that they were within 4dB of audibly flat. Pretty doggone good. The graphs I've seen on them look perfectly in line with the sound of them. Flat flat flat.

It might actually sound flat flat flat, but do you think that the chart looks flat flat flat? Maybe that's what people were wondering about.
post #1702 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

Air sounds nicer, but it isn't as decriptive. If you take a good recording and EQ out everything below 14kHz, you're left with extremely little. Boost the volume on it so you can hear it clearly, and you'll probably call it noise too.

 

I dont have an opinion on your statement above, but it seems to me that your testing methodology is inherently flawed, b/c it involves evaluating the effect of frequencies that affect timbre, attack and decay as if they were primary notes.

 

Has there been any perceptual mapping on how those frequencies shape perception of sounds in lower primary frequencies?    Or how those frequencies affect perception of timbre?   A better option might be to ramp up the EQ to compensate for the PM-1s frequency roll-off and see if that affects its tonal palette.

post #1703 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post

  A better option might be to ramp up the EQ to compensate for the PM-1s frequency roll-off and see if that affects its tonal palette.
I am waiting for this, as I do not know the outcome yet.
Yet it has been done and will be commented upon later today. .
post #1704 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkalia View Post

I dont have an opinion on your statement above, but it seems to me that your testing methodology is inherently flawed, b/c it involves evaluating the effect of frequencies that affect timbre, attack and decay as if they were primary notes.

No. By 12-14kHz, there isn't much in the way of overtones or harmonics left either. That last octave falls off fast.
Edited by bigshot - 4/24/14 at 9:39am
post #1705 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post

It might actually sound flat flat flat, but do you think that the chart looks flat flat flat? Maybe that's what people were wondering about.

Add the Fletcher Munson curve and I bet it would.
post #1706 of 2548

Are you guys still talkin' 'bout stretchin' monkeys?

post #1707 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

No. By 12-14kHz, there isn't much in the way of overtones or harmonics left either. That last octave falls off fast.
It is my belief that musical perception extends to the limits of the human ear...
Not no stupid 12 -14k.

No headphone manufacturer is that naive to make a can stop that low, so why would you believe that there is nothing after that amount?
Some charts?

So how do we explain the intangibles. ..
How do you explain the ability of a can to differentiate the music into palpable entities so you can "see" the drummer's stick hitting the hi-hat or cymbal,
As opposed to just hearing some mesh of an obscure treble sound..

That is where we separate the big boy cans from the lack luster wanna bee cans.

Spacial cues exist in all frequencies from subbass to highest trebles.

Time will tell if the oppo is competitive in it's price category.
frown.gif

I believe it should have forgone the extravagant box and sold well below the $1K threshold,
where it has to fight with the other heavyweight champions of headphones. .

My two cents. .
Edited by Maxx134 - 4/24/14 at 8:44pm
post #1708 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxx134 View Post   (snip-snip)

Time will tell if the oppo is competitive in it's price category.
frown.gif

I believe it should have forgone the extravagant box and sold well below the $1K threshold,
where it has to fight with the other heavyweight champions of headphones. .

 

And the Oppo PM-2 is coming to do battle in the upper-sub-$1000 part of the market. We're probably doomed to have all of every bit of this discussion all over again. Like Groundhog Day the Movie, just without Bill Murray.

post #1709 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxx134 View Post

It is my belief that musical perception extends to the limits of the human ear...

Why would the last five percent of the range of human hearing be that important? Particularly when at the very top, human hearing is fading away anyway.

It helps to actually know what 12.5 to 14 kHz actually sounds like. Then you have an idea of how unimportant it is.
post #1710 of 2548
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

It helps to actually know what 12.5 to 14 kHz actually sounds like. Then you have an idea of how unimportant it is.
I guess your right and I am wrong. .



I guess I won't need this anymore. .

tongue.gif ha



This opinion of treble non-importance above 12-14k is not the dominant one, but seems to coincide with the the oppo final signature of the PM1. frown.gif

Your fault! Lol
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