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NEW Vali Schiit AMP!!! - Page 222

post #3316 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybeast View Post
 

I had two amps that had 2watts and none of them drove the he500 effortlessly but decently. The asgard isnt considered to drive the he500 effortlessly but barely satisfactorily. 

 

Really :basshead: what amps? 

post #3317 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybeast View Post
 

dont really feel like getting into this but its not always about volume... and I firmly disagree. That is why you never hear the asgard 2 as a recommendation for the he500. 

 

Don't get me wrong here, have a Lyr with good tubes + HE-500 myself, and no longer have an A2.

 

but see my query here:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/685162/new-vali-schiit-amp/1380#post_10028264

 

I've yet to see one person reply and EXPLAIN why the Lyr *power levels* are the reason delivering increased HE-500 sound quality.

(with respect to the HE-500s 38ohm, 89 SPL dB/mW)

 

I can barely listen to music over 10 on the volume pot, and all that Lyr head room/energy just "sits there" magically making it sound better by "tapping into" some electrical request automagically?

seriously would like to understand this more beyond a generalized "great synergy".

thanks for the education,

post #3318 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwappo99 View Post

 

Audio-GD NFB 12
Audio-GD NFB 11.32

 

both 1800mW/50 ohm They got loud enough and maybe me saying barely satisfactorily was an exaggeration in hindsight:redface: and I apologize but I never felt like it opened up with them. I will humble myself to that error on my part. Those did decently.

 

 I always wanted to try it with the emotiva I had but never had them at the same time. From that it is hard to imagine 1w being enough to do it effortlessly. Maybe loud enough but not effortlessly so let me put it better.. I will quote someone with more experience here and I would agree. 

 

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/623645/anyone-have-experience-with-the-schiit-asgard-and-the-he-500#post_8628644

from malveaux

 

Heya,

 

"I have that pair (as well as Lyr & Bifrost). I've tested my HE-500 out of a lot of setups. It does need power. The Asgard outputs about 1 watt to the HE-500's 38ohms. So it just meets it's bare minimum requirement of 1 watt. It actually sounds pretty good too. I find the Lyr outputs more warmth and the HE-500 seems to come alive more and has better sub-bass presence with the Lyr compared to the Asgard. But the Asgard can run the HE-500 enough to enjoy it until you can get something with more omph. I've found that basically you need about 2 watts for the HE-500 to spread it's wings. After that it seems to stop changing from just power alone, at least in my experience. It definitely doesn't need 6 watts for example, but it just seems to need a touch more than 1 watt. A good option for you could be to potentially change the Asgard up for a NFB 12.1 for something that does 2+ watts into 38ohms for an HE-500. Sound wise, I find the Asgard to be pretty clean, but maybe a touch bright (compared to the Lyr which just seems more warm). It's a good match for the HE-500 because it's pretty neutral/warm, not really bright like it's big cousin. I find most headphones match well with Schiit amps in general, they're pretty nice and are not overly bright nor warm. I've run everything in my inventory from the Asgard without issue. It's a solid performance amp."

 

My gripe is basically using the word effortlessly when saying that the asgard 2 is a good match for the he500. I would say slightly sufficient but would choose another option. That being said I definitely believe it would be under powered with the Vali. 


Edited by grizzlybeast - 2/4/14 at 12:00pm
post #3319 of 4963

Thanks, I've seen similar comments and

Just to clarify a few (malveaux) points in the above:

 

1.  assuming the reference is to Asgard2 and NOT (original) Asgard.

 

2.  Asgard 2 does 1W per channel.

 

3.  "(HE-500) it just seems to need a touch more than 1 watt".

again, per channel I assume.

 

 

so the recommendation makes sense vis a vis Asgard 2 only delivering 1W per channel

and

HE-500 benefitting from something that does 2+w per channel.

 

yet based on volume (dB) at the 38ohm, 89 SPL dB/mW

getting up to deafening 115dB listening levels (398mW by math) or 120dB (1259mW by math)

shouldn't require that 2+W unless you "always" listen at those dBs?

 

hence my confusion at what all that Lyr power is "helping" if my volume knob sits at 9a-11am on the dial...

maybe I just listen too  q u i e t l y?

:wink_face: 

 

and indeed, the Vali does something between 650mw-550mw per channel, less than the A2.

 

yet my HiFi M8 on max gain drives the HE-500 to loud volumes (well), and at mid volumes sounds very close to my ConceroHD+ Lyr set up.   Jude has said the M8 provides "enough power" for the HE-500s.

alas, don't know the mW output of the M8 at max gain switch tho.... (awaiting CEntrance reply)


Edited by jexby - 2/4/14 at 12:17pm
post #3320 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by jexby View Post
 

Thanks, I've seen similar comments and

Just to clarify a few (malveaux) points in the above:

 

1.  assuming the reference is to Asgard2 and NOT (original) Asgard.

 

2.  Asgard 2 does 1W per channel.

 

3.  "(HE-500) it just seems to need a touch more than 1 watt".

again, per channel I assume.

 

 

so the recommendation makes sense vis a vis Asgard 2 only delivering 1W per channel

and

HE-500 benefitting from something that does 2+w per channel.

 

yet based on volume (dB) at the 38ohm, 89 SPL dB/mW

getting up to deafening 115dB listening levels (398mW by math) or 120dB (1259mW by math)

shouldn't require that 2+W unless you "always" listen at those dBs?

 

hence my confusion at what all that Lyr power is "helping" if my volume knob sits at 9a-11am on the dial...

maybe I just listen too  q u i e t l y?

:wink_face: 

 

and indeed, the Vali does something between 650mw-550mw per channel, less than the A2.

 

yet my HiFi M8 on max gain drives the HE-500 to loud volumes (well), and at mid volumes sounds very close to my ConceroHD+ Lyr set up.   Jude has said the M8 provides "enough power" for the HE-500s.

alas, don't know the mW output of the M8 at max gain switch tho.... (awaiting CEntrance reply)

in the end bro if you are satisfied that is all that matters. The thing about the vali that is awesome despite its power is its quality. amps that are more powerful wont touch its quality. I do not understand they myth either. But from my experience I feel that it never opened up or spread its wings enough and had a low ceiling with the power I had available. 

post #3321 of 4963

I have a Vali on the way, as well as a Modi and a set of DT 880s. I've heard this combo has some nice synergy, so I can't wait to try it out! I'll deliver my "impressions from an audio noob" by the end of the week, hopefully (unless this snow storm seriously screws up my delivery dates).

post #3322 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Really. 2 Watts will drive the HE-500's above the threshold of pain. 1 Watt will just barely reach the threshold of pain. Nobody listens anywhere near those figures without getting hearing impaired. I can listen quite loudly, not experience any distortion and the sound is excellent.

Were you referring to the old Asgard?

The Asgard 2 is an excellent design where it's low distortion doesn't come from gobs of negative feedback but from a careful design using discrete components, not opamps. This is not the easy way to design a headphone amp.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybeast View Post
 

dont really feel like getting into this but its not always about volume... and I firmly disagree. That is why you never hear the asgard 2 as a recommendation for the he500. 

I emailed with Schitt and they specifically recommended it for the HE-500's. I have both items and the sound is superb. Yes it is not all about volume, this amp has very low distortion without relying on negative feedback. The FR is flat. Since these cans are Orthos, damping factor and impedance curves are not problems. And IMO it sounds great.

post #3323 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Really. 2 Watts will drive the HE-500's above the threshold of pain. 1 Watt will just barely reach the threshold of pain. Nobody listens anywhere near those figures without getting hearing impaired. I can listen quite loudly, not experience any distortion and the sound is excellent.

Were you referring to the old Asgard?

The Asgard 2 is an excellent design where it's low distortion doesn't come from gobs of negative feedback but from a careful design using discrete components, not opamps. This is not the easy way to design a headphone amp.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybeast View Post
 

dont really feel like getting into this but its not always about volume... and I firmly disagree. That is why you never hear the asgard 2 as a recommendation for the he500. 

I emailed with Schitt and they specifically recommended it for the HE-500's. I have both items and the sound is superb. Yes it is not all about volume, this amp has very low distortion without relying on negative feedback. The FR is flat. Since these cans are Orthos, damping factor and impedance curves are not problems. And IMO it sounds great.


Schiit recommends what for the he500? Asgard 2? Vali?

Currently have the modi and magni with the he500 and I think it's good enough. I want to get another amp and DAC setup and I'm considering the vali and another magni or an asgard 2 with a bifrost.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
post #3324 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by antikryst View Post


Schiit recommends what for the he500? Asgard 2? Vali?

Currently have the modi and magni with the he500 and I think it's good enough. I want to get another amp and DAC setup and I'm considering the vali and another magni or an asgard 2 with a bifrost.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

They recommended the Asgard 2. I asked what they thought of the Vali and they said, see below:

 
Q: Can the Vali adequately drive the Hifiman HE-500s, powerwise?
A: In our opinion, yes, but it is definitely at the limit of what it can do. If you really want to get to head banging levels, you’ll need more power.
post #3325 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

They recommended the Asgard 2. I asked what they thought of the Vali and they said, see below:

 
Q: Can the Vali adequately drive the Hifiman HE-500s, powerwise?
A: In our opinion, yes, but it is definitely at the limit of what it can do. If you really want to get to head banging levels, you’ll need more power.

okay but did you even ask about the schiit lyr?

if you asked what would be better for the he500 the lyr or asgard they would probably say the lyr.

post #3326 of 4963

Are my tubes too sensitive? Clapping and even talking too loudly will cause some ringing even about 3 feet away.

post #3327 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

They recommended the Asgard 2. I asked what they thought of the Vali and they said, see below:

 
Q: Can the Vali adequately drive the Hifiman HE-500s, powerwise?
A: In our opinion, yes, but it is definitely at the limit of what it can do. If you really want to get to head banging levels, you’ll need more power.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by grizzlybeast View Post
 

okay but did you even ask about the schiit lyr?

if you asked what would be better for the he500 the lyr or asgard they would probably say the lyr.

We're talking about an HE-500 not an HE-6. Exceeding the threshold of pain is overkill. I own the pair, turning up the volume all the way or anywhere near it is asking for damaged hearing. I listen on the loud side and there is so much more to go. The sound quality is superb. The bass is clean and tight. The treble is wonderful, the sound of cymbals and high-hats are correct when that metallic clink and clanks are spot on. You can hear details in all their glory There is nothing more to ask for or to be unhappy about.

post #3328 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by roflaly View Post
 

Are my tubes too sensitive? Clapping and even talking too loudly will cause some ringing even about 3 feet away.

Sounds like you need to call for service, that is not normal.

post #3329 of 4963

I just plugged my headphone into the Vali, and the music was only coming out on the left side of my headphone.  I wiggled the headphone jack and the sound came out in both.  I wiggled it again and only one side again.

Wiggled some more and sound came out on both.  The connections must not be good. 

post #3330 of 4963
Quote:
Originally Posted by roflaly View Post
 

Are my tubes too sensitive? Clapping and even talking too loudly will cause some ringing even about 3 feet away.


Mine's like that.  I was a little surprised the first time I opened a canned soft drink, holding it in my hands about two feet from the amp.  It rang quite clearly through the music I was listening to.  God forbid I should sneeze while I'm listening.

 

Still, I'm terrible about sending things back and I can't get into my amp without damaging the case because the factory stripped one of the screws when assembling it.  As a result, I've learned to live with it.  I don't actually sneeze, open drinks, or clap my hands while listening very often so I discount those problems.

 

The only out-of-control ringing problem I have is when I forget and leave my headphones sitting on top of the amp which causes a little ringing to come through the headphones, which vibrates the case, which causes louder ringing, which vibrates the case worse, etc., until the ringing is audible when I enter the room.  In that case, the ringing simply doesn't stop on its own even after I separate the amp and headphones.  I actually have to give the amp a gentle tap with something metal to make it momentarily ring even louder and then settle down.

 

Now, don't anybody get their knickers in a twist; this is a super-positive post.  Think about it - I like the sound so much, I don't want to take it off my desk long enough to send it back to Schitt.  I'd call that high praise.

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