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Holy Schiit! Add DSD to any DAC for $149. Meet Loki... - Page 3

post #31 of 116

Dangin...Jason beat me to it...but on the bright side, I was right!  w00t!

post #32 of 116
Very cool product, Jason. I ordered one. Total no brainer at that price. I have a bunch of DSD files that are rips of my SACDs, will be good to be able to play those.
post #33 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Stoddard View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuco1965 View Post
 

Actually I thought it was a stand alone DSD dac and could be used by itself.  I believe it has a pass through for a regular dac.

 

Yep, you can use it by itself.

 

You can:

 

1. Use it integrated with your current DAC, and run the RCA outputs of your current DAC through Loki for easier switching. Loki does nothing to your current DAC's output. 

2. Use it side-by-side with your current DAC, running the output of your DAC and Loki separately through a switcher or preamp.

3. Use it by itself, and convert all of your PCM material to DSD via software, or listen only to DSD.

 

If you have an integrated DAC/Amp with a line in, you can certainly use Loki with it. If it only has a digital input, then yeah, you're kind of out of luck there.

 

Hope this clear things up!

Still can't un
post #34 of 116

I think the marketing-speak on this is confusing.

 

It is a DSD-only DAC .   Just like Modi, except for DSD instead of PCM.

 

And it also has, in the box, a Rat-Shack-Like manual switch to switch between two pairs of RCA inputs to one pair of RCA outputs.   This is for convenience, if you have a small amp that has only one input (like - coincidentally ;) - the Schiit amps).

 

(The marketing-speak gives you the impression that it will switch automatically or something like that, but it is manual.   Hey, you'll get more exercise.)

 

===

 

So, the Q of "why not put DSD in Bitfrost and their other DACs ?".  Their answers:

 

1 - They think that DSD is likely a passing fad, like DVD-Audio.  Almost all pros think 24-192 is the most practical high-res format.   So, it would raise the price of their DACs and make them less competitive, for no real value.

 

2 - Their engineering shows that adding DSD to their existing DACs would have a negative effect on the PCM circuits.  So, it makes more sense from that perspective to make it separate as well.

post #35 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Stoddard View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuco1965 View Post
 

Actually I thought it was a stand alone DSD dac and could be used by itself.  I believe it has a pass through for a regular dac.

 

Yep, you can use it by itself.

 

You can:

 

1. Use it integrated with your current DAC, and run the RCA outputs of your current DAC through Loki for easier switching. Loki does nothing to your current DAC's output. 

2. Use it side-by-side with your current DAC, running the output of your DAC and Loki separately through a switcher or preamp.

3. Use it by itself, and convert all of your PCM material to DSD via software, or listen only to DSD.

 

If you have an integrated DAC/Amp with a line in, you can certainly use Loki with it. If it only has a digital input, then yeah, you're kind of out of luck there.

 

Hope this clear things up!

Still can't understand why you didn't add DSD support to existing DACs such as Bifrost and only later create a product you currently trying to sell for $149 ?
Now you your customers have 2 separate boxes DSD DAC plus Bifrost while instead you should offer an upgrade to existing Bifrost users for less money so that they can either do upgrade themselves or ship it to you and have it installed by you as it happened with Uber upgrade
post #36 of 116

Makes perfect sense to me.  Why offer dsd on their current dacs if unsure of the staying power of the format? Why not try to appeal to owners of other dacs? The only downside I would see is if the internals may be a sonic compromise compared to something better that can do dsd.  At this stage in the game however that list is going to be quite small.  I do agree it is a little confusing of a product but for their intended audience it should fit right in.

 

And in all honesty I would not see myself using one myself though it is an awesome idea.  No dsd files really but several scads that I just listen to on my player.  No motivation to rip or purchase dsd files at the moment!


Edited by Mr.Sneis - 9/9/13 at 7:13pm
post #37 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post


Still can't understand why you didn't add DSD support to existing DACs such as Bifrost and only later create a product you currently trying to sell for $149 ?
Now you your customers have 2 separate boxes DSD DAC plus Bifrost while instead you should offer an upgrade to existing Bifrost users for less money so that they can either do upgrade themselves or ship it to you and have it installed by you as it happened with Uber upgrade


I see this product as a survey. You want to play DSD files and think it is ready to go on the bigger scale? Vote with your money, buy the Loki and enjoy playing your DSD files for 150$. Dont' give a schiit about DSD? Then don't buy it.

They are testing the water. If they sell a ton, they might create a more seamless solution, AKA upgrades. If they don't, (which is my guess, imo), they will simply abandon the whole idea, discontinue Loki and move on without having to deal with all of their other DACs having DSD residues.

That's my take on it.

post #38 of 116
I wouldn't buy this if it were a full DAC. I have a high end DAC I like already. So this is a cool way to add JUST DSD. I wouldn't spend a ton to add DSD since the amount of music I have that can take advantage of it is somewhat limited.
post #39 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skylab View Post

I wouldn't buy this if it were a full DAC. I have a high end DAC I like already. So this is a cool way to add JUST DSD. I wouldn't spend a ton to add DSD since the amount of music I have that can take advantage of it is somewhat limited.

 

Wait, but just to clarify; one can't use this in tandem with another DAC, correct?

post #40 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by hojomojo96 View Post
 

 

Wait, but just to clarify; one can't use this in tandem with another DAC, correct?

 

It's a stand-alone dac. You either use the Loki OR your other DAC, that's it. The thing that seems to confuse people is the pass-through, which is self-explanatory. Your setup would look like this:

Computer --USB1--------------->Loki [DSD] ----> Amp ------> (...)
                  --USB2-->DAC(PCM)---î


If you want to use PCM, Loki take the output of your PCM dac as an input and output the same thing to your amp without doing anything to the signal (see it as a switch).


Edited by Rem0o - 9/9/13 at 7:50pm
post #41 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rem0o View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by hojomojo96 View Post
 

 

Wait, but just to clarify; one can't use this in tandem with another DAC, correct?

 

It's a stand-alone dac. You either use the Loki OR your other DAC, that's it. The thing that seems to confuse people is the pass-through, which is self-explanatory. Your setup would look like this:

Computer --USB1


>Loki [DSD] ----> Amp
> (...)
                  --USB2-->DAC(PCM)---î


If you want to use PCM, Loki take the output of your PCM dac as an input and output the same thing to your amp without doing anything to the signal (see it as a switch).
The problem is that you can't use it with all in one combo such as WA7 for example
post #42 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post


The problem is that you can't use it with all in one combo such as WA7 for example

 

Sure you can, the WA7 does have analog inputs, just plug it into those. Sure you wouldn't be able to use the Loki with it's built in switching, but it would still work just fine.

post #43 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rem0o View Post
 

 

It's a stand-alone dac. You either use the Loki OR your other DAC, that's it. The thing that seems to confuse people is the pass-through, which is self-explanatory. Your setup would look like this:

Computer --USB1--------------->Loki [DSD] ----> Amp ------> (...)
                  --USB2-->DAC(PCM)---î


If you want to use PCM, Loki take the output of your PCM dac as an input and output the same thing to your amp without doing anything to the signal (see it as a switch).

 

sounds to me like you aren't quite correct.  as per Schiit:

 

Just connect the output of your current DAC to Loki, connect Loki via USB to your computer, and you’ve added DSD to your system—seamlessly.

 

so you'd be computer-->Loki-->DAC AND Amp.  same as normal just one more in the chain. the switching is a passthrough so when disabled it passes the audio in from your other DAC.  at least...if you have a DAC with RCA output.  otherwise you just plug it in your way...so maybe you are correct depending on the DAC

 

LOL


Edited by ferday - 9/9/13 at 8:42pm
post #44 of 116
He is correct. You can't plug the Loki into your dac cause it doesn't have a pass through built in. That's the point of the Loki. To provide a pass through for your other dac when you want to use pcm
post #45 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva View Post

He is correct. You can't plug the Loki into your dac cause it doesn't have a pass through built in. That's the point of the Loki. To provide a pass through for your other dac when you want to use pcm

 

you and Rem0o are correct, sorry

 

it's a semi passthrough i guess LOL.  your PCM DAC will still be plugged into the computer to receive input, that's the part i wasn't getting, but you can "pass" the DAC output signal through the Loki to get access to the push button thing rather than using software to switch, which is the part that confounded me.  i guess it makes sense for those of us that have one input on our amps.

 

my bad, in fairness it's a confusing little box.... ;)

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