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Do audiophiles "like" music? - Page 21  

post #301 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmoe View Post
 

As for reviews and the vocabulary used, that isn't my main problem. My main problem is the limited recordings used in those reviews, and the even more limited number of reviews that take them into account first and foremost. I personally am more interested in reading about how a specific recording sounds paired up with X or Y piece of gear rather than a general "soundstage is really wide, the highs glitter like gold in starry night skies" or "this silver cable really makes the music go faster", etc. Keep in mind though that this isn't true for every review out there, but a lot of them don't even mention the music at all.

 

Funny, I dislike it when a review singles out recordings because it's never any music I listen to. I understand your reasoning but to me that part of the review is all "blah blah" that I have to skip.

post #302 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

 

Funny, I dislike it when a review singles out recordings because it's never any music I listen to. I understand your reasoning but to me that part of the review is all "blah blah" that I have to skip.

 

Sure but it is music you can usually easily obtain and listen to, and see for yourself what the reviewer meant. I'm sure if more reviewers used material you do listen to, you'd pay more attention to what they have to say about their sound rather than the general comments that seem to encompass everything.

post #303 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmoe View Post
 

 

Sure but it is music you can usually easily obtain and listen to, and see for yourself what the reviewer meant. I'm sure if more reviewers used material you do listen to, you'd pay more attention to what they have to say about their sound rather than the general comments that seem to encompass everything.

 

You're absolutely right: if they started writing about good music, I'd read about it. But I'm not going to damage my brain listening to their ersatz music simply to understand their reviews.

post #304 of 345

An interesting related question is: Why don't audiophiles (or anyone else) talk about music more?

It's meant to be the love of our lives, but we don't talk about it that much. The Music sub-form is often critised for its lack of diversity.

 

For me, the analogy is the local book club. This is where book lovers all read the same book of the month and then meet and discuss it. I would find that rather embarassing. I can see how it can help each person gain further insight, but really, I'd rather just read the book. In music terms, I often read reviews to find new artists etc, but I don't need to discuss them much - just a few minutes of listening to samples is all I need to know.

 

PS. elmo, the BHSE is, by specific design intent, and by many comments of myself and others, meant to be an extremely neutral amp. What makes you think it isn't?

post #305 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAttorney View Post
PS. elmo, the BHSE is, by specific design intent, and by many comments of myself and others, meant to be an extremely neutral amp. What makes you think it isn't?

Maybe it's the tubes?

post #306 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

 

You're absolutely right: if they started writing about good music, I'd read about it. But I'm not going to damage my brain listening to their ersatz music simply to understand their reviews.


Go back to post #236 of this thread and read some of my comments on audiophile approved music and audiophile reviewers use of terrible music for testing equipment.

 

In a way it kind of makes sense for these reviewers to use such miserable and obscure music because then one of two things takes place. First, if the reader actually owns a copy of the music used by the reviewer then the reviewer can be fairly certain that the reader is true audiophile and will swallow the reviewer's BS (i.e. windows being opened, veils being lifted, etc.) without question. Second, if the reader does not own a copy of the music used by the reviewer then the reviewer can be fairly certain that the reader will not have a way to double check on the reviewer's BS and once again the reviewer is safe from criticism.

 

I find that the best way to enjoy audiophile publications is to consider them humor and/or science fiction magazines. Some months I just read through these magazines and I am simply amazed that anyone can possibly believe any the nonsense being written.

 

Now excuse me but I have to go and listen to the "Il nonsenso" aria from the opera "Aprire La Finestra" by Luigi Amorta - it sounds incredible on my system.

post #307 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline View Post
 

Maybe it's the tubes?

 

Precisely, any notion of neutrality when speaking about a tube "anything" is just ridiculous. The whole point of tubes is to color the sound. If you think your tube amp sounds neutral, then I truly feel sorry for the amount of money you invested in it...

 

As for discussing artists, I couldn't care less. The point is to compare how a recording sounds from one piece of gear to another, not to discuss the satanic messages when playing Stairway To Heaven backwards :rolleyes: 


Edited by elmoe - 2/28/14 at 7:42am
post #308 of 345

Re-reading your post, I remember it because of the imagery: "Since the first time some primitive man banged two sticks together music has been part of the human experience and music will always be part of the that experience." I didn't want to mention choice of music in my post because I wanted to avoid offending anyone. As you know, I find those reviews hopeless. Even an otherwise helpful review can't seem not to reference records I'll never hear. For example, Tyll just reviewed K812 and pointed out a problem at certain points in the treble. But he used his references to find those points and they're nothing I'm familiar with. So is there a problem with the treble? Who would know.

 

I don't participate in the jazz thread because I no longer listen to jazz as much. But I enjoy the classical thread and think you have an opportunity to educate readers in the jazz thread.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline View Post

 

Now excuse me but I have to go and listen to the "Il nonsenso" aria from the opera "Aprire La Finestra" by Luigi Amorta - it sounds incredible on my system.

 

:D

post #309 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

 

:D


Does that mean that you enjoy ""Aprire La Finestra" as well?

post #310 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by ralphp@optonline View Post
 

Does that mean that you enjoy ""Aprire La Finestra" as well?

 

I could hear it coming through the window. Spettacolare!! If only someone could persuade Andreas Scholl to make a crossover record . . . 

post #311 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmoe View Post
 

Precisely, any notion of neutrality when speaking about a tube "anything" is just ridiculous. The whole point of tubes is to color the sound.

The whole point of the BHSE hybrid design is that the tubes specifically do NOT colour the sound. I don't know enough about amp design to explain why, but that's what some amp designers have claimed.

Having said that, I have noticed that different tubes do affect the BHSE's sound - but  not from the cliched "tube warmth" point of view.

 

Anyway, the notion that tube amps inevitably colour the sound is somewhat outdated. Some old classic designs did have enhanced "warmth" etc, but I've heard a number of modern tube and transister designs where their respective strengths and weaknesses could not be described in such broad colouration terms.

 

FWIW, my personal recipe for long term musical satisfaction from variable quality recordings is to have a system that is overall ever so slightly the warm side of neutral.

post #312 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAttorney View Post
 

The whole point of the BHSE hybrid design is that the tubes specifically do NOT colour the sound. I don't know enough about amp design to explain why, but that's what some amp designers have claimed.

Having said that, I have noticed that different tubes do affect the BHSE's sound - but  not from the cliched "tube warmth" point of view.

 

Anyway, the notion that tube amps inevitably colour the sound is somewhat outdated. Some old classic designs did have enhanced "warmth" etc, but I've heard a number of modern tube and transister designs where their respective strengths and weaknesses could not be described in such broad colouration terms.

 

FWIW, my personal recipe for long term musical satisfaction from variable quality recordings is to have a system that is overall ever so slightly the warm side of neutral.

 

I would very much like to see any technical information showing how tubes specifically do not color the sound. (hint: they do not exist ;))

post #313 of 345

Try this link. It describes the original Blue Hawaii - basically a DIY project at that point . I understand the BHSE has much the same design, just improved details and much improved and looks.

 

http://headwize.com/?page_id=751

 

 

 

post #314 of 345

I'm no expert but there is nothing there to show that the tubes will not color the sound...

post #315 of 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAttorney View Post
 

Try this link. It describes the original Blue Hawaii - basically a DIY project at that point . I understand the BHSE has much the same design, just improved details and much improved and looks.

 

http://headwize.com/?page_id=751

 

I looked at it. Thanks. But what's the tl;dr version?

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