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Shure SE846 Impressions Thread - Page 50

post #736 of 5689

Yeah, Spook, I have the same DAPs as before with the old 846 (namely, the Galaxy S1, S2, and Note 3). I still have the Clip+, iAudio 9, and my old Touch 3G. Now, I have the Touch 5G and FiiO X3. I may break down eventually and try one of the "uber-DAPs" (HM901, AK120, or the upcoming ones like the X5 or something). The UI of the X3 has me thinking more about a DAC/amp thingy that connects to an existing familiar device. 

 

I'm not disappointed with the bass of my new 846. It is still good. Plus, nowadays, I don't need louder punchy bass like before because I drive a quieter 2014 model truck.

 

What I remember most about "burn in" (of the old 846) was improved mids and highs just a few days prior to earpiece failure.

post #737 of 5689
Truck,

My two cents is maybe look at an amplifier. Use your current set up just add a portable amp. Less expensive than an uber DAP/amp and to my ears the amp is the key.

My brother used to be a sound engineer for a regional band and what he used to do was keep the source lower and boost the amp to get greater soundstage and clarity. This requires a great amp to avoid clipping and/or distortion. Following his advice, I use my iPod Touch 5th at 75% power (or lower) and let my amp (RSA Lightning) carry the load. It really opens up the soundstage and overall frequency response (the bass punches greater than straight out of the iPod).
post #738 of 5689

I wonder if anyone find this colour matched version less confusing...

 

post #739 of 5689

The black filter measurement is borked.  The other two match the expected results but the black was either not assembled correctly or not sealed during the plot.

post #740 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by spook76 View Post

Truck,

My two cents is maybe look at an amplifier. Use your current set up just add a portable amp. Less expensive than an uber DAP/amp and to my ears the amp is the key.

My brother used to be a sound engineer for a regional band and what he used to do was keep the source lower and boost the amp to get greater soundstage and clarity. This requires a great amp to avoid clipping and/or distortion. Following his advice, I use my iPod Touch 5th at 75% power (or lower) and let my amp (RSA Lightning) carry the load. It really opens up the soundstage and overall frequency response (the bass punches greater than straight out of the iPod).

 

Spook, I really appreciate the advice. I guess my problem is I'm articulating what sounds like an issue but is really not. The first time around, I was comparing the 846 with the 535 and the bass difference seem dramatic. Now, I'm trying to compare the new 846 with the memory of the old 846. I can't really get back that “newness”, however. I'm accustom to the sound now. That may be the bulk of the difference I'm experiencing.

 

I'm new to the iPod Touch 5G lightning connector. I know there's no analog line-out but is there a digital line-out or must you use the headphone out?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post
 

The black filter measurement is borked.  The other two match the expected results but the black was either not assembled correctly or not sealed during the plot.

I don't know what borked means, but I think Tyll's measurements at Innerfidelity is more representative (the data sheet downloads—under resources). It is similar to the Headroom measurements in the bass region but on his graph the mids and highs are higher with the black filter. That is what I remember hearing when I switched to the black filter (with my old 846 back in December). I haven't changed filters on the new one yet. The blue filter sounds good right now. I like to save some reserve for when (or if) I get bored.

 

The graph doesn't tell you how a speaker is going to sound. A 6-inch woofer may be more responsive (to a low input signal) than a 12-inch woofer but it is not likely to bring the thunder like a 12-inch woofer. The 846 is not a 12 woofer, but I wouldn't look at that graph and compare the 846 with some other IEM that has a higher line in that region (like my IE8).

post #741 of 5689

Black is the warm, bassy filter, that plot would make it the bright and thin.

post #742 of 5689
Truck to my knowledge you have three ways to pull out an audio signal with an iPod, iPad or iPhone with the new lighting connector.

One, you can use a standard 30 pin LOD and a lightning to 30 pin adapter. This makes the iPod simply a digital storage device and the digital conversion is handled by the Wolfson DAC in the lighting to 30 pin adapter.

Two, ever since iOS 7, you can use the camera kit adapter to pull a true digital signal out of the iPod. This will require a stand alone DAC or DAC/amp (like the RSA Intruder). iRiver's AK-10 is similar option to pull out a digital signal and the AK-10 has a built in amp as well. I have not heard the AK-10 so I cannot pass judgment upon it. The camera kit option to me defeats the purpose of truly portable as you have a lot of cumbersome wires and connections. Also, as Apple updates the software there is no guarantee that iOS 7.1 or later versions might eliminate this function.

Three, use a 3.5mm to 3.5mm interconnect from the headphone out to the amp. I find this the best for a number of reasons. I like the Cirrus Logic DAC in the iPod better than the Wolfson DAC in the lighting to 30 pin adapter. The Cirrus DAC is more musical and I found the Wolfson dark and muddy especially at the low end. Also, using the line out gives you no control of the iPod volume so that you cannot turn up the amp too loud (unless you want to go deaf) and allow the amp to open up your soundstage. Yes, I know this is double amping the sound but to my ears this is the best form and function option.
post #743 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post
 

Black is the warm, bassy filter, that plot would make it the bright and thin.

 

The black filter does provide a warmer (slightly thicker) note thru the mids and highs with a little less emphasis in the bass region. I called it the 535 filter back when I installed it on my previous 846.That doesn't mean you can't turn the bass back up from your source.

 

I wrote in my last post that you couldn't compare the 846 with the IE8. That was a bad example on my part. However, in order to get to the sub-bass rumble out of the IE8 I have to slide the bass control knobs on the device itself up to highest level and use EQ to tone down the punchy part of the bass (and it will kinda do the rumble thing).

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by spook76 View Post

Truck to my knowledge you have three ways to pull out an audio signal with an iPod, iPad or iPhone with the new lighting connector.

One, you can use a standard 30 pin LOD and a lightning to 30 pin adapter. This makes the iPod simply a digital storage device and the digital conversion is handled by the Wolfson DAC in the lighting to 30 pin adapter.

Two, ever since iOS 7, you can use the camera kit adapter to pull a true digital signal out of the iPod. This will require a stand alone DAC or DAC/amp (like the RSA Intruder). iRiver's AK-10 is similar option to pull out a digital signal and the AK-10 has a built in amp as well. I have not heard the AK-10 so I cannot pass judgment upon it. The camera kit option to me defeats the purpose of truly portable as you have a lot of cumbersome wires and connections. Also, as Apple updates the software there is no guarantee that iOS 7.1 or later versions might eliminate this function.

Three, use a 3.5mm to 3.5mm interconnect from the headphone out to the amp. I find this the best for a number of reasons. I like the Cirrus Logic DAC in the iPod better than the Wolfson DAC in the lighting to 30 pin adapter. The Cirrus DAC is more musical and I found the Wolfson dark and muddy especially at the low end. Also, using the line out gives you no control of the iPod volume so that you cannot turn up the amp too loud (unless you want to go deaf) and allow the amp to open up your soundstage. Yes, I know this is double amping the sound but to my ears this is the best form and function option.

 

Thanks again, Spook. I really appreciate the detailed explanation. It saves me a lot of time searching for the answers.

 

Apple and their ways, eh?

 

It sounds like you feel the same about the Cirrus DAC as I do about that Yamaha DAC in the Galaxy S2 (that most around here hate). I've never had the noise issue (perhaps the T-Mobile version is different).

 

I just listened to the X3/ IE8 combo and thought it was alright until I compared it to the S2/535. Then I played the same song on the Note 3/846 and everything went up another notch. Yeah, I think I'm good for now.:) 

post #744 of 5689

I finally received the FiiO E18 (revB) and I must say it pairs pretty well with the SE846 but then again I am comparatively a newbie in headfiers term, what I noticed immediately is the dynamic range is dramatically improved over the Touch 5G and the soundstage also benefits a lot. Bass are more detailed and feel like they are more powerful. I didn't notice that much improvement detail wise but everything is more articulate.

 

I like the sound better than the Audioquest DragonFly and his colder / analytical sound. I don't know why but everything sound more "intimate", the sound is fuller and draws you in much more. I revisited the SE846 filters again, the E18 pairs fairly well with the bright filter while I would say the warm filter suits the DragonFly or Touch 5G more.

 

I only have 10h or so on this combo, and people tell me DAC / amps do burn-in too so maybe to early to be definitive but so far so good, given the price!

One thing is sure, as I have read in this thread those IEMs scale well, and it's only the beginning as I might end up going the balanced road for an @home setup :)


Edited by davidmolliere - 1/13/14 at 10:56am
post #745 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmolliere View Post
 

I finally received the FiiO E18 (revB) and I must say it pairs pretty well with the SE846 but then again I am comparatively a newbie in headfiers term, what I noticed immediately is the dynamic range is dramatically improved over the Touch 5G and the soundstage also benefits a lot. Bass are more detailed and feel like they are more powerful. I didn't notice that much improvement detail wise but everything is more articulate.

 

I like the sound better than the Audioquest DragonFly and his colder / analytical sound. I don't know why but everything sound more "intimate", the sound is fuller and draws you in much more. I revisited the SE846 filters again, the E18 pairs fairly well with the bright filter while I would say the warm filter suits the DragonFly or Touch 5G more.

 

I only have 10h or so on this combo, and people tell me DAC / amps do burn-in too so maybe to early to be definitive but so far so good, given the price!

One thing is sure, as I have read in this thread those IEMs scale well, and it's only the beginning as I might end up going the balanced road for an @home setup :)

 

Try running the dragonfly as line out and use your E18 as an amp.  I find the amp section of my dragonfly not quite as good as when using it as a line out to an external amp.  Just a thought.

post #746 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by revolutionz View Post

 

Try running the dragonfly as line out and use your E18 as an amp.  I find the amp section of my dragonfly not quite as good as when using it as a line out to an external amp.  Just a thought.

 

Hmmm, not sure what would be the point here, using DragonFly as DAC and E18 as amp ?

Right now E18 is connected directly through USB so that it's acting as a DAC and an amp. I like the E18 SQ way better.

post #747 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmolliere View Post
 

 

Hmmm, not sure what would be the point here, using DragonFly as DAC and E18 as amp ?

Right now E18 is connected directly through USB so that it's acting as a DAC and an amp. I like the E18 SQ way better.

 

I was just suggesting that to see if the sound quality changed for you.  I don't own a DAC/Amp, so out of my dragonfly I use either my shadow or hornet when I'm not at home.  For me running the dragonfly to an external amp made a large difference.  It's good that you like the E18.  I liked my E11 for the few months I used it.

post #748 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by revolutionz View Post

 

I was just suggesting that to see if the sound quality changed for you.  I don't own a DAC/Amp, so out of my dragonfly I use either my shadow or hornet when I'm not at home.  For me running the dragonfly to an external amp made a large difference.  It's good that you like the E18.  I liked my E11 for the few months I used it.

 

Ok I see, more than the E18 I love the SE846 and I think with better sources I am getting deeper into what it's capable of :)

post #749 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidmolliere View Post
 

 

Ok I see, more than the E18 I love the SE846 and I think with better sources I am getting deeper into what it's capable of :)


I hear you.  I've been re-converting my entire music collection to flac now, and getting into Hi Res files.  I just had some custom molded ear tips made for my 846's, and with the increased isolation it was unbelievable.  I have since sent in the molds to have a custom sleeve made for them so they have a proper size sound tube and so I could remove them (the tips only weren't very removal friendly).  I love the sound of the 846 so much, but now I am curious about customs.  I have a feeling I am going to end up with another set of 'phones in the near future.

post #750 of 5689
Quote:
Originally Posted by revolutionz View Post


I hear you.  I've been re-converting my entire music collection to flac now, and getting into Hi Res files.  I just had some custom molded ear tips made for my 846's, and with the increased isolation it was unbelievable.  I have since sent in the molds to have a custom sleeve made for them so they have a proper size sound tube and so I could remove them (the tips only weren't very removal friendly).  I love the sound of the 846 so much, but now I am curious about customs.  I have a feeling I am going to end up with another set of 'phones in the near future.

 

I think at least to me, those IEMs are going to lasts for a long while, I don't plan to go custom those are heaven as it is.

What I'll definitely do is up the source with a better amp / DAC and also source files (those FLACs MFSL masters are... just bliss).

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