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FiiO E12DIY Limited Edition Version---DIY your own sound ! - Page 44

Poll Results: which combo is the best sound for you ?

This is a multiple choice poll
  • 12% (1)
    AD8620+BUF634
  • 12% (1)
    AD797+BUF634
  • 25% (2)
    OPA1611+BUF634
  • 0% (0)
    OPA604+BUF634
  • 0% (0)
    AD8620+LME49600
  • 12% (1)
    AD797+LME49600
  • 50% (4)
    OPA1611+LME49600
  • 0% (0)
    OPA604+LME49600
  • 0% (0)
    AD8620+LMH6321
  • 0% (0)
    AD797+LMH6321
  • 0% (0)
    OPA1611+LMH6321
  • 0% (0)
    OPA604+LMH6321
8 Total Votes  
post #646 of 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post
 

Picked up my DIY today and initial impressions are really good.

 

I'm wondering if anyone can confirm something for me in relation to the provided buffers. So far I like the OPA1611 as the op-amp, but I'm torn between the LM49600 and LMH6321 as the buffer. It sounds like the LMH6321 is better on my T1s, but the LM49600 is better on low impedance IEMs. The specs would suggest that this is the case, too. Does anyone know if the LMH49600 will be a problem if used with low impedance IEMs (i.e. 15.9 ohms)?

 

Also, has anyone found a buffer that's great with a wide range of impedances?

 

I've been using LME49600 with some low impedance headphones and IEM, so far no problem.  From the 3 buffers come with Fiio E12DIY, LME49600 is my favorite so far.  BUF634 is actually very2 close with LME49600.

LMH6321 has very poor dynamic and detail with low impedance, sounds very lazy.

post #647 of 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by earfonia View Post

I've been using LME49600 with some low impedance headphones and IEM, so far no problem.  From the 3 buffers come with Fiio E12DIY, LME49600 is my favorite so far.  BUF634 is actually very2 close with LME49600.
LMH6321 has very poor dynamic and detail with low impedance, sounds very lazy.

Cool. Thanks! I just realised I wrote LMH49600 instead of LMH6321. What you hear with LMH6321 confirms my suspicion that it performs well with high impedance, but poorly with low impedance.
post #648 of 1000
I've just been comparing the DIY with the Tralucent T1 and the T1 still wins in terms of bass weight and layering of details.

Unfortunately the T1's op-amps have all been obscured. I'm wondering if they're OPA627s based on the slightly warm, but detailed sound. Any ideas? I'd love to recreate the soothing, but detailed signature in the DIY.
post #649 of 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post

I've just been comparing the DIY with the Tralucent T1 and the T1 still wins in terms of bass weight and layering of details.

Unfortunately the T1's op-amps have all been obscured. I'm wondering if they're OPA627s based on the slightly warm, but detailed sound. Any ideas? I'd love to recreate the soothing, but detailed signature in the DIY.

 

AD8599

post #650 of 1000
I'm intrigued as to how you found that out!

Thank you!
post #651 of 1000

Who has tried the AD 8397?

 

Leaving the case open, it would be interesting to try my one pair or 1984 very rare NE5534 S that are bypassed. These are old op amps but the pins are a copper base and somehow they did things internally that surpasses any other 5534. 


Edited by jamato8 - 1/15/14 at 1:32pm
post #652 of 1000

I have the AD8397 but haven't tried it on E12DIY yet. Would be a waste for its high current output and I learn from experience that it is a hard-to-please opamp when it comes to circuit optimization, so I have been skipping it so far and save it for later listening.

post #653 of 1000

Well you don't know how it sounds in this circuit until tried. I would use it and bypass the buffers. 

post #654 of 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post
 

Well you don't know how it sounds in this circuit until tried. I would use it and bypass the buffers. 

 

True, But I have listened to 4~5 implements of AD8397 and only one of them gets it right, so my level of expectation isn't really that high, especially since E12DIY isn't optimized for it in the first place. Of course it might turn out to be great as well, I'll give it a listen tonight.

 

Bypassing is a good idea. It probably is fine, but I'll check with FiiO about it just to be extra safe.

post #655 of 1000
Can anyone tell me how the provided capacitors and resistors (for bandwidth) would affect the sound (ie how it would sound different)?
post #656 of 1000

Okay, my BrownDog order finally came in this morning.

 

HA5002-1.jpg

From left: BrownDog SOIC-to-DIP, HA-5002 adapter x2, eBay adapter and DIP8 chip for reference.

 

Did you see the problem? Yes, the HA-5002 is way too tall. It is designed for two HA-5002 parallel soldered on both sides (to double the output, if wanted), so it is 50% taller than a regular BrownDog.

 

 

HA5002-2.jpg

Even without the IC soldered on it, the HA-5002 adapter itself is already as tall as a DIP8. With the HA-5002 soldered on the top side, it will never fit inside the E12DIY.

 

 

HA5002-3.jpg

So what is the solution? Well, solder the IC on the back side of course, since it is parallel to the top side it won't cause any issue. The pins also need a little trimming, around 0.5mm to 1mm. See the trimmed pin on the empty adapter as reference.

 

 

HA5002-4.jpg 

All and all, the mod should leave you just enough room for the HA-5002 to fit in. Do note that you need to put some insulating tape over the top side of the adapter to avoid shorting the adapter if it ever comes into contact with the case.

 

After all the work, my impression on the HA-5002 is actually pretty mixed. It is clean for sure, but almost too clean and in fact a bit lean. It makes even the very well textured MUSES01 sounds lean, which isn't a good thing. It also has a little bit too much DC offset with OPA627, but it is fine with a few other opamps I tried. So it isn't really a drop-and-forget kind of buffer. You need to measure the DC offset to be sure it is behaving well with the particular opamp you are using. But not everything is bad on the HA-5002. On some occasion I thought it sounds quite good with AD8620, so it isn't a complete lost. Anyway, it is a bit too troublesome to find the right pairing for it so my advise is, avoid it unless you are the adventurous type. It is just too much work without guaranteed reward.

 

Also tried the AD8397 - not bad actually. It didn't wow me but it didn't fail me either. Overall a decent all arounder.

post #657 of 1000

Let the 5002 burn in some. Just like any circuit, it needs time to settle. Have used it on and off for years with no problems on offset. 

post #658 of 1000

I believe in headphone burn in, but not so much on solid state burn-in, unless it is thermo stability or degradation related. I will keep experimenting with them of course. No point to have but not use them, but it will take some major change to convince me, I think.

 

Forgot to mention two other things: HA-5002 does get a bit hot when used with low impedance load, similar to that of LMH6321. Like LHM6321, I'll advice against using it with very low impedance load just to be safe. Also observed heat issue with AD8397. Given the +/-11V supply is pretty close to AD8397 recommended +/-12V limit, I guess it is expectable.

post #659 of 1000

The 5002 runs hotter than the buf634. Never found it to be a problem. Yes, we all can agree to disagree on burn-in. I remember back in the early 90's when I worked with Cary Audio on some products that Dennis said he always heard burn in and expected a 100 to 200 hours burn in period and mentioned 100 hours always on his gear but didn't care to debate it with people. Audio Note UK also but they go for longer periods. 

post #660 of 1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post
 

I believe in headphone burn in, but not so much on solid state burn-in, unless it is thermo stability or degradation related. I will keep experimenting with them of course. No point to have but not use them, but it will take some major change to convince me, I think.

 

Forgot to mention two other things: HA-5002 does get a bit hot when used with low impedance load, similar to that of LMH6321. Like LHM6321, I'll advice against using it with very low impedance load just to be safe. Also observed heat issue with AD8397. Given the +/-11V supply is pretty close to AD8397 recommended +/-12V limit, I guess it is expectable.

 

Wow excellent job indeed on the HA-5002!  Thanks for sharing the impression of HA-5002!

Just wondering, why you choose the SOIC-8 type for the HA-5002 and not the DIP-8 ?

 

As for burn-in, being DIY enthusiast myself, I'm not a fan of burn-in... and I generally believe we don't need burn-in for solid state.

But I just would to share my experience with Fiio X3.  Out of the box, I was a bit disappointed as I found the treble was a bit harsh and too bright to my liking.  Playing Susan Wong albums, I had to reduced the treble by 3 stops.

Not really satisfied with the sound, I decided to try with burn-in the player.

After around 24 hours burn-in, I no longer need to reduce the treble, 0 adjustment on treble just sounds right with the same songs and album.. same IEM.

Now after using X3 for a few months, I feel it sounds rather dark.... 

Well, that's just my experience with X3, not necessary applicable with other equipment :)

I still prefer equipment to sound good out of the box, burn-in to me is just troublesome process and a waste of time... but sometime necessary... :(


Edited by earfonia - 1/16/14 at 10:35pm
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