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FiiO E12DIY Limited Edition Version---DIY your own sound ! - Page 69

post #1021 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by vayz View Post
 


Yes, it's the buffer and op amp combination, wishing to hear a guidance to create a best synergy with my eqs, if it's still the OPA1611+LME49600 than think i'll take the regular E12 without DIY since the price is 80$ difference. but since my local agent has the stock with old price ($200) i think i'll consider and learn to tinker(i'm such a newbie for this) for the SQ that match my rigs

Hi, I have tried the supplied combinations and the OPA1611 + LME49600 was my clear preference. However swapping the 1611 for TI LME49990's is a significantly better and more enjoyable sound to me on all the headphones I have tried. There is a moderate hit on battery life but the result is well worth it. They are not expensive chips and the resulting sound has had three of my audiophile friends track down E12DIY's to replicate that combination. Two of them already had far more expensive amps. Do you know if your local agent has any gold units left? I am looking for a second one for my daughter and would prefer a different colour to the silver I already have.

post #1022 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiiorless View Post
 

Hi, I have tried the supplied combinations and the OPA1611 + LME49600 was my clear preference. However swapping the 1611 for TI LME49990's is a significantly better and more enjoyable sound to me on all the headphones I have tried. There is a moderate hit on battery life but the result is well worth it. They are not expensive chips and the resulting sound has had three of my audiophile friends track down E12DIY's to replicate that combination. Two of them already had far more expensive amps. Do you know if your local agent has any gold units left? I am looking for a second one for my daughter and would prefer a different colour to the silver I already have.

 

How would you describe the difference between 1611s and 49990s?

post #1023 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post
 

 

How would you describe the difference between 1611s and 49990s?

I expected it to be subtle but it is not, there is more detail, the bass is better controlled, especially on low impedance headphones and it becomes possible to listen to less than perfect tracks more enjoyably for me anyway because the problems while still there no longer mask the music. On enclosed dynamic headphones with the 49990's cymbals especially sound like the real thing instead of sounding a bit like they have a comb filter applied . I was very surprised at the difference, there is some sort of synergy between the 49990 and the 49600 that works really well. It's a cheap option and well worth trying if you are looking for an uncoloured analytical sound. I master tracks professionally and may be listening a little differently because of that but using this combination lets me clearly hear the difference between different up sampling settings in Izotope Rx 3 for the first time. 

post #1024 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiiorless View Post
 

I expected it to be subtle but it is not, there is more detail, the bass is better controlled, especially on low impedance headphones and it becomes possible to listen to less than perfect tracks more enjoyably for me anyway because the problems while still there no longer mask the music. On enclosed dynamic headphones with the 49990's cymbals especially sound like the real thing instead of sounding a bit like they have a comb filter applied . I was very surprised at the difference, there is some sort of synergy between the 49990 and the 49600 that works really well. It's a cheap option and well worth trying if you are looking for an uncoloured analytical sound. I master tracks professionally and may be listening a little differently because of that but using this combination lets me clearly hear the difference between different up sampling settings in Izotope Rx 3 for the first time. 

 

You mention analytical sound. Does that mean it's a bit cooler with less bass than OPA1611 or is it just more controlled do you think?

post #1025 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post
 

 

You mention analytical sound. Does that mean it's a bit cooler with less bass than OPA1611 or is it just more controlled do you think?

If anything slightly more bass but a lot better controlled. It's not so much cooler as clearer, the various layers of crud that mask the sound don't go away but it's easier to hear through them because they are more separated from the music. Some Beatles tracks from the 60's have a clear bass line for the first time in my listening and I can follow what Paul was doing. I think we hear what we train ourselves to listen for so others experiences may vary but I can say in AB testing my daughter who plays orchestral and electric bass greatly preferred the 49990's to the 1611's when paired with the LME 49600's. 

post #1026 of 1601

I have a question about the E12DIY and hope this is the right place to ask it.   Seems the favorite combo is the OPA1611+LME49600 and this is exactly how the much cheaper E12 Mont Blanc is configured.

 

​Is there a difference between the DIY and the Mont Blanc (other than the fact you get different opamps to try).  If I got a DIY and my favorite combo was the OPA1611+LME49600 would I be just as well off to order the Mont Blanc?

post #1027 of 1601

I should say that in my experience the performance of an op amp like the LME49990 is very dependent on the circuit in which it is used, especially the layout and power supply. What works well in the E12DIY may not in a standard E12 and it's hard to predict, you would really have to try it out. All the E12DIY's that I have put LME49990 LME49600 combinations in have sounded identical to me but that does not mean it is a magic combination for other designs of headphone amplifier.

post #1028 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deterministic NL View Post
 

I have a question about the E12DIY and hope this is the right place to ask it.   Seems the favorite combo is the OPA1611+LME49600 and this is exactly how the much cheaper E12 Mont Blanc is configured.

 

​Is there a difference between the DIY and the Mont Blanc (other than the fact you get different opamps to try).  If I got a DIY and my favorite combo was the OPA1611+LME49600 would I be just as well off to order the Mont Blanc?

I think there may be no more E12DIY's available for reasonable money in a day or so, the number for sale is dwindling very quickly. The E12 is a different circuit and layout to the E12DIY and according to fiio the E12DIY is a simpler layout they designed to sound better.  Many people have commented that the as delivered spec E12DIY sounds better than the E12 Mont Blanc and looking at the differences in circuit design that is not surprising.

If you have the means I would consider ordering the DIY while you still can.

post #1029 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiiorless View Post
 

I think there may be no more E12DIY's available for reasonable money in a day or so, the number for sale is dwindling very quickly. The E12 is a different circuit and layout to the E12DIY and according to fiio the E12DIY is a simpler layout they designed to sound better.  Many people have commented that the as delivered spec E12DIY sounds better than the E12 Mont Blanc and looking at the differences in circuit design that is not surprising.

If you have the means I would consider ordering the DIY while you still can.

Thank you.  Exactly the answer i was looking for.  I thought it was possible they were exactly the same and you sure answered that question.

 

I'm intrigued with this Fiio gear.  I bought a Fiio E17 and just got it yesterday.  Blown away with it for the cost. 

post #1030 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deterministic NL View Post

 

I'm intrigued with this Fiio gear.  I bought a Fiio E17 and just got it yesterday.  Blown away with it for the cost. 

The E17 is great value, I have one here (and an embarrassing number of other DAC's) and have no hesitation in saying it sounds a lot better through the E12DIY. One thing worth trying if you haven't already is using it with software like Audirvana Plus on Mac or a good PC equivalent at 96k. The E17 performs very well at 96K even on up sampled material.

post #1031 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiiorless View Post
 

The E17 is great value, I have one here (and an embarrassing number of other DAC's) and have no hesitation in saying it sounds a lot better through the E12DIY. One thing worth trying if you haven't already is using it with software like Audirvana Plus on Mac or a good PC equivalent at 96k. The E17 performs very well at 96K even on up sampled material.

Ditto on the "embarrassing number of other DAC's" on this end. I have the EO9K coming.  I might look at picking up an E12DIY as well.  Why I have no idea as I have more audio kits than room for them.  I literally don't have room for one more yet for some reason I have a Schiit Modi and Magni in the mail right now.

 

Thanks for the input!  Greatly appreciated.

post #1032 of 1601

Can anyone help me to understand how to select potential buffer alternatives? Are they just op amps, but used differently?

 

I've read that the combo of OPA827 and LT1364 is excellent (used in another setup), but I can't tell if either of these would suit the buffer role in the E12DIY.

post #1033 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post
 

Can anyone help me to understand how to select potential buffer alternatives? Are they just op amps, but used differently?

 

I've read that the combo of OPA827 and LT1364 is excellent (used in another setup), but I can't tell if either of these would suit the buffer role in the E12DIY.

 

Opamp can be implemented as buffer with the right circuit, but not all of them has the right parameter to be used as buffer. In thie case, I don't find OPA827 or LT1364 being suitable. OPA827 open-loop Zo is a bit on the high side, and not that great on output current. LT1364 is dual channel, which means you need specially made adapter so it can be used on the single channel socket inside E12DIY.

post #1034 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loquah View Post
 

Can anyone help me to understand how to select potential buffer alternatives? Are they just op amps, but used differently?

 

I've read that the combo of OPA827 and LT1364 is excellent (used in another setup), but I can't tell if either of these would suit the buffer role in the E12DIY.

It depends a bit on the impedance of the headphones you want to drive. some op amps can supply 20-60 milliamps and suit efficient 600 ohm drivers but are not always able to drive low impedance lower efficiency drivers. A higher current buffer like the LME49600 can supply several hundred milliamps and by virtue of a considerably lower output resistance control lower impedance headphones more tightly. The buffer in an E12DIY can be an op amp or a purpose designed buffer. It really is down to personal preference as the combination of headphones, op amps and listeners vary enormously such that there is no best or perfect combination. If you want the lowest measurable distortion + noise and highest current supply and damping factor the 1611 + 49600 combination is the choice of the options supplied. Depending on source material, headphones, hearing and listening preferences other combination may be more enjoyable. It's what makes the listener happy that counts, sometimes technically the "best" headphone, DAC whatever is not the one that is most comfortable or least fatiguing. If we chase the best possible result it can be down a rabbit hole that involve a great deal of money to listen to your system rather than enjoy your music. Try combinations of op amps and buffers others enjoy and use what makes the music work for you personally.

post #1035 of 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by MistahBungle View Post


I bought the JDS C5 (on the basis of price/relative SQ) after auditioning a couple of portable amps including the E12DIY, though the possibilities with component swapping on the latter really appealed to me & was playing on my mind after (almost as soon as I left the store).

End result was I bought the E12DIY as well a few days later, and haven't regretted it one little bit ;-)

Honestly, if you like tinkering, get it ;-) The supplied components will keep you busy for a while so far as combinations are concerned, and with the supplied adapters, you have almost endless possibilities with what opamps/buffers you can put in it.

 

Darn you got me now, i've ordered it for now lol, thanks for your input and hope so for your next teacher-noob guidance

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fiiorless View Post
 

Hi, I have tried the supplied combinations and the OPA1611 + LME49600 was my clear preference. However swapping the 1611 for TI LME49990's is a significantly better and more enjoyable sound to me on all the headphones I have tried. There is a moderate hit on battery life but the result is well worth it. They are not expensive chips and the resulting sound has had three of my audiophile friends track down E12DIY's to replicate that combination. Two of them already had far more expensive amps. Do you know if your local agent has any gold units left? I am looking for a second one for my daughter and would prefer a different colour to the silver I already have.

 Hello, thanks for your advice. yes i've ordered the E12 DIY for now and still in process of ordering LME49990 from other seller. Just to make sure we only need 1 LME49990 op amp and didn't need to solder for this LME49990 rite? (i mean it's swapable like the stock op-amp?) I'll love to hear your guidance as your experience is one of the reason i choose this amp for now :)

 

Oh, and about the golden E12DIY i've asked my local agent, yes he does have it but i dunno about overseas fee. Here's the link http://www.dontblameyourears.com/277-fiio-12-diy-headphone-amplifier-silver.html, you can contact him via messenger/ym or maybe email them for overseas delivery., The price is 2.450.000 IDR which is equivalent to a little over 200 $

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