or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphone Amps (full-size) › Schiit Lyr Tube Rollers
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Schiit Lyr Tube Rollers - Page 448

post #6706 of 10948

Hey guys I'm looking to sell my 

  • Reflektor '74 6N23P SWGP Silver Shields sold
  • Amperex Orange Globes 1967 6DJ8 

since they aren't getting any play time against the HG's pm me if interested.


Edited by Rayoki - 5/10/15 at 3:51pm
post #6707 of 10948

A few weeks ago I bought a Lyr 2. With my LCD-2 it's dead silent and sounds fantastic. Today I plugged in my custom IEMs, UE 18 pros, for the first time. Low gain. They also sound great, except there's a slight hiss in the left channel only. Could this be a tube issue?

post #6708 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayoki View Post
 

Hey guys I'm looking to sell my 

  • Reflektor '74 6N23P SWGP Silver Shields
  • Amperex Orange Globes 1967 6DJ8 

since they aren't getting any play time against the HG's pm me if interested.

How do '74 SWGP silvers compare to '75s? Do '75s have larger soundstage?

post #6709 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by openuser View Post

How do '74 SWGP silvers compare to '75s? Do '75s have larger soundstage?
Rb2013 has a detailed review. Go to the front page of the site and scroll down
post #6710 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exacoustatowner View Post

Rb2013 has a detailed review. Go to the front page of the site and scroll down
I actually went a bit "crazy" and bought some of the tubes from Rb's review.
post #6711 of 10948


the russian tube guy rb2013 wrote http://www.head-fi.org/t/761078/6922-tube-review-17-top-6922-6n23p-e88cc-cca-7308-e188cc-tubes 


 

I found that they sounded very similar but the HG's appeared to be "better" honestly could be the hype but I'm not sure. either way it's a phenomenal step up from the OG's or something similar.

post #6712 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThurstonX View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikoss View Post
 

Pretty sure I see a G above that in the batch code above as well, so I'm pretty sure it's '73... at least they're made in Heerlen and not Tungsrams... So many auctions lately with chrome pins and pointy nipples:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-new-tubes-E88CC-6922-Valvo-411015-vintage-chrome-pins-/131362298415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e95cd9a2f

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Valvo-E88CC-CCa-Grey-Shield-6DJ8-6922-CV2492-CV2493-CV5358-CV5472-/171776674750?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27feb00bbe

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-new-tubes-Valvo-E88CC-6922-503018-matched-pair-/381203745203?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58c18389b3

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-new-tubes-Valvo-E88CC-6922-503020-matched-pair-/381196758546?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58c118ee12

at least this one mentions that they could be Tungsram tubes:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Valvo-E88CC-matched-PAIR-6922-audio-tubes-new-in-box-NOS-/281679169225?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41956306c9

 

For my pairs, I try to match batch and date codes. Not sure how much it really matters... I can also audition each tube separately on the DAC buffer and see if they sound similar first.

 

That's what I figured, esp. with that yellow etching/staining.

 

I have no idea if the change codes (can that be considered a "batch" code? If so, some batches spanned years!) represent actual internal changes, changes in the manufacturing equipment and/or process, or something else.  Assuming that said codes actually represent something significant enough to require a new code, I'd say matching change codes is more important than date code matching.

 

So, if you have a pair of 7L5s that were made in Feb. and Aug. 1964, that's better than a pair like the aforementioned 7LE / 7LG.  While an absolute date code match seems like a very good thing, testing may reveal one tube is stronger than the other.  At least there are a few trustworthy eBay sellers to make it less of a crap shoot.

 


Nice catch on all those Tungsram tubes.  That should prove educational for a lot of Lyr rollers :beerchug:

 

As far as I know for most of the Philips and derivatives tubes the batch code and change code are synonymous. The "old" system, prior to 1955/56, used a different coding system for batches vs. the "new" system post that year.  Under the old system there were typically 15 batches manufactured in a year with one odd "batch 20" on some year. The new system accommodates up to 35 batches and uses one character (0 - 9, A-Z, d,f, m, r, or T) .

post #6713 of 10948
Well folks, my tube rolling journey has come to an end. I've been fortunate to have listened to some of the best tubes on the market , and I've finally found my HOLY GRAIL ,of sound. I'm absolutely done! I want to personally thank my friend Larry(lekoross) , for loaning me a lot of his collection for this journey. I'll also add. If you see him posting tubes for sale on here. He's as legit as Brent Jesse, when it comes to quality of product! He'll never post schiit tubes!....PERIOD


My end game?  


2 words: VALVO CCA!

(Yellow print)


From the beginning:

Over the last two months, I've been blessed in having the luxury of rolling some fine tubes. The list as follows. 


63 & 65 , Siemens CCa(grey plate/shield)

75&74 Reflektor , silver SWPG (HG)

58 Amperex Holland Heerlen 6922 PW's

65 Amperex Holland Heerlen 7308/E188CC (Dumont re-label)

65 Philips Miniwatt PQ Heerlen 7308(white label)

64 Mullard Blackburn E88CC (steel pin)

69 Mullard Blackburn 6922 (gold pin, GE re-label)

And last but not least, Valvo CCa ?, yellow print. (*there's a story behind these. Will elaborate later in this post.)


My approach to this post , isn't about ranking them , as to which I prefer in order, but to give my impression on what they have to offer sound wise. Only the individual can decide what's best to their ears. 


First up: Siemens CCa (greys)  I've listened to two different sets of these fine tubes. 1965 & 1963.


 Soundstage, Soundstage, Soundstage! 

These tubes are breathtaking! I'm sure everyone by now, has read the description of these tubes , on tubemusem.org. These tubes , have ONE of the biggest, deepest , holographic , presentations, of any tubes I've heard to date. The imaging of these tubes, is stunning! The placement and separation of sound is absolutely lifelike. Treble is finely detailed and delicately, presented. I hear absolutely no sibilance , or harshness. Bass is accurate, deep , with a fullness and slam that captivates you! My only quibble with them is the midrange. To my ears, the midrange seems a little recessed, when comparing these to the very best Holland , tubes. Sometimes things seem dry in the middle with certain songs which removes the emotional factor. Don't get me wrong. These are very engaging tubes. For most , these would be end game glass. 


74 & 75HG , SWPG Silver Reflector:


First , I'd like to thank Bob , for his dedication to these awesome tubes. The time and effort he's put in to helping people who start this journey , is astounding!  Can't thank him enough! 


To me. The 74 & 75 are very similar. The key differences that I've noticed are soundstage , and bass. The 74's , seem to have more impact in the bass region, and the 75 HG's, have a bigger , more holographic soundstage. Both offer an organic , liquid presentation. Pretty balanced throughout the entire spectrum. Soundstage is of decent size. Not as big or deep as the Siemens CCa, nor the Valvo CCa. To my ears , these tubes have a more forward presentation. Treble , is pretty incisive, and detailed. Bass has good impact but not as deep as most of the other tubes , mentioned. Female vocals are spooky good with these tubes. Kind of reminds me of the Mullards. 


58 Amperex Holland Heerlen pinched waist:


I won't sugar coat my feelings with these tubes. These tubes are very holographic , very detailed , and a smooth and delicate presentation. To my ears they lacked engagement. The midrange was dismal. To me the music had no authority, no impact , and vocals sounded lifeless. The bass was deep , and accurate. But lacking. The attack and decay of notes seemed too fast , and didn't have that linger of depth. I  tried with these tubes, but they just didn't cut it. They just weren't my cup of tea. YMMV. 


65 Amperex Holland (Dumont) 7308 & 65 Philips miniwatt SQ 7308:


I'm lumping these two together. They're very similar, with the Dumonts , presenting things a little bigger, and more bass. These tubes , are midrange kings! These are very musical tubes, warm, full bodied,  with precise impact. Both sets gave you a speaker like presentation. They're a very forward tube. Soundstage is average. They're not as holographic , as the above mentioned(on par with the HG's), nor the Valvo CCa , coming up later. Trebel on these can be hot at times. Bass is deep , and full. They're very fun tubes. I wouldn't recommend them with headphones, like Grados. 


64 Mullard Blackburn E88CC(steel pin) & 69 Mullard Blackburn(GE re-label) 6922(gold pin):


These tubes , are at the top of my list. They are very warm and engaging, sweet buttery tone. Very rich notes , very lifelike , organic presentation. Vocals are absolutely spooky and realistic. Bass is perfect. It's deep, wide, and full. Trebel and midrange, are silky smooth. Surprisingly, the gold pins, more so than the steels, do soundstage very well. Sound portrays itself below you with a sense of being lifted by the music. The steels seemed a little more forward than the golds. These tubes , imo , could be the absolute perfect match for a headphone like Grados. With the HD-650's , it could be way too much warmth. 


Valvo CCa? E88CC? Yellow print, From Heerlen, with delta codes. (Tube1: 1969, Tube2: 1972):


So....... Let's begin with the story behind these tubes. 

My good friend Larry (lekoross), purchased these tubes , from eBay. These tubes were considered to be counterfeit, reprinted , E88CC. A while back it was reported that there were fake tubes being sold on eBay, by a German seller. The transaction with the seller was very sketchy. Took forever for the seller to ship them. So Larry kinda dismissed them and put them on the back burner in his collection. 

I always had some curiosity of those tubes. A month ago,  I offered to buy a pair of the quad he received and we never made an agreement. Larry being the awesome guy he is, more than likely didn't want to distribute tubes of "lower" quality, and possibly fake. 

So me being an eBay hawk , looking for steals , and deals, had seen an auction ,with yellow print Valvo CCa's being offered at an insanely low starting bid. So I scoped it out , and it was Larrys auction. He openly put it out there in the description that he believed they were fake tubes, and was offering them at a bargain. 

So I put them in my watch list and waited until the end, and won the auction. He thought it was pretty hilarious , that it was me. 

So he offered to send them with his 63 Siemens CCa's, and his Mullard Blackburn 6922 (gold pins, and in exchange I sent my Dumonts to him so he could have a listen as well, possibly doing an even trade for the Valvos. 


Now to the Valvos:

 

Let me start by saying this.  Regardless of how fake , mismatched the dates are on these tubes, my quest for the ultimate sound has ended here! I'll call these the "FrankenValvos" , I can't confirm if they truly are Valvo CCa's visually, but sound wise?


 LORD HAVE MERCY!!!!!!!!!


Folk's. Take every tube above mentioned. Roll them in a tube burrito, give it to God for a blessing. Then stick that burrito in your rig. You are now listening to the FrankenValvos. 


LORD HAVE MERCY! Lol


From tubemusem.org: 


Quote: E88CC or CCa VALVO Heerlen Holland 1960's "Real sonic holography, best-musicallity sounding, compellingly realistic, extremely incredible detail, warmth, and clarity - all at the same time, rated up there with the Siemens CCa, classified audiophile-extreme rarity, almost never seen or available in real NOS, especially in the most desirable YELLOW print.


Their description of these tubes , is dead on! 

Take the soundstage , holography, and bass of the Siemens, toss in the awesome midrange and impact of the Amperex , and then add the sweet sweet butter , of the Mullard Blackburns , then age all that like fine wine, then inject it with steroids before mind consumption. Lol


Folk's , I'm so done rolling tubes. Everything I've put in my lyr , previous to these FrankenValvos , is a distant second to my ears! They are the most holographic, full 3D, realistic , organic tubes I've ever heard. The imaging , is Godly! The soundstage , and holography, are endless. Notes appear out of nowhere, full and life sized,  with authority, and fade back into a total blackness.  The sound from these tubes is paralyzing. I'm in complete AWE, with my chin hanging, drooling, with every song that goes by. END GAME FOLKS......END GAME! 


Larry,  I want to openly thank you for your generosity, in sending all of your collection to me , for the listening experience! You are a truly good , and honest guy! I can't thank you enough bro! 


I also want to thank Bill, for answering all my nagging questions in PM, regarding my Holland quest of tubes. You nailed it Billy! You nailed it! 


My conclusion , to all this tube madness is. Folks, don't judge a book by its cover. I was always anal , about matching codes, specific dates, and believed that it was uber important for the best possible sound. With the FrankenValvos, that has all gone out the window! 

I know you'll be reading this Larry. I know that you have the other set of these. I hope that you hear what I'm hearing my friend. If not, you have my address. Lol. Thanks again for everything my friend! I owe you big time!

I also want to thank all the tube vets, for helping me with all their vast knowledge, and patience with a noob , like myself. 


"MAMA , I'M COMING HOME!"


Happy rolling my friends


Over and Out

Sam aka guidostrunk 
beerchug.gif
Edited by Guidostrunk - 5/10/15 at 7:10pm
post #6714 of 10948
I'll be posting an in depth, detailed review of the FrankenValvos themselves, in the next couple of days. I'm currently working on it , with drawings , to explain the madness.
post #6715 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guidostrunk View Post

I'll be posting an in depth, detailed review of the FrankenValvos themselves, in the next couple of days. I'm currently working on it , with drawings , to explain the madness.

 

Congrats! (again), and I can't wait to see some drawings.  Sam, charting out his mad trip down the Rabbit Hole which led him to the Yellow Kings.  We may have to start calling you "Alice" ;)

post #6716 of 10948
Hahahahahahahaha , thanks bro. I have to draw the charts man. I want to be as descriptive as possible , in explaining how BIG and full the sound is projected. It's unreal!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThurstonX View Post

Congrats! (again), and I can't wait to see some drawings.  Sam, charting out his mad trip down the Rabbit Hole which led him to the Yellow Kings.  We may have to start calling you "Alice" wink.gif
post #6717 of 10948

Great review Sam !!!  Now if you could only generate a little PASSION about your music !!!!!

Glad you found your "Holland" of choice.  I think when you become of age, you should retire to Heerlen.

post #6718 of 10948
Funny, I also found the "fake" Telefunken CCa's to sound wonderful. I just don't know how that seller has tubes in apparently such pristine condition.

So, my question to you Sam is, do you believe the Valvo CCa's are legit?

Also, I'm sure Bill could loan you his pinched waist Valvo CCa's, and you might find a holy, holy grail. Haha just kidding.

Just waiting to get home Wednesday to hear my Holland 6922 PW's from Brent Jesse. For now, swapping between Miniwatt E188CC's and Siemens CCa's. Love both, but different signatures, as you note.
post #6719 of 10948
From a listening , perspective, I'd have to say without a doubt, they're legit! They're from the same seller. It does seem really odd , like you said, his tubes look almost to good to be true. I'm sold. Lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikoss View Post

Funny, I also found the "fake" Telefunken CCa's to sound wonderful. I just don't know how that seller has tubes in apparently such pristine condition.

So, my question to you Sam is, do you believe the Valvo CCa's are legit?

Also, I'm sure Bill could loan you his pinched waist Valvo CCa's, and you might find a holy, holy grail. Haha just kidding.

Just waiting to get home Wednesday to hear my Holland 6922 PW's from Brent Jesse. For now, swapping between Miniwatt E188CC's and Siemens CCa's. Love both, but different signatures, as you note.
post #6720 of 10948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guidostrunk View Post

Well folks, my tube rolling journey has come to an end. I've been fortunate to have listened to some of the best tubes on the market , and I've finally found my HOLY GRAIL ,of sound. I'm absolutely done! I want to personally thank my friend Larry(lekoross) , for loaning me a lot of his collection for this journey. I'll also add. If you see him posting tubes for sale on here. He's as legit as Brent Jesse, when it comes to quality of product! He'll never post schiit tubes!....PERIOD


My end game?  


2 words: VALVO CCA!

(Yellow print)


From the beginning:

Over the last two months, I've been blessed in having the luxury of rolling some fine tubes. The list as follows. 


63 & 65 , Siemens CCa(grey plate/shield)

75&74 Reflektor , silver SWPG (HG)

58 Amperex Holland Heerlen 6922 PW's

65 Amperex Holland Heerlen 7308/E188CC (Dumont re-label)

65 Philips Miniwatt PQ Heerlen 7308(white label)

64 Mullard Blackburn E88CC (steel pin)

65 Mullard Blackburn 6922 (gold pin, GE re-label)

And last but not least, Valvo CCa ?, yellow print. (*there's a story behind these. Will elaborate later in this post.)


My approach to this post , isn't about ranking them , as to which I prefer in order, but to give my impression on what they have to offer sound wise. Only the individual can decide what's best to their ears. 


First up: Siemens CCa (greys)  I've listened to two different sets of these fine tubes. 1965 & 1963.


 Soundstage, Soundstage, Soundstage! 

These tubes are breathtaking! I'm sure everyone by now, has read the description of these tubes , on tubemusem.org. These tubes , have ONE of the biggest, deepest , holographic , presentations, of any tubes I've heard to date. The imaging of these tubes, is stunning! The placement and separation of sound is absolutely lifelike. Treble is finely detailed and delicately, presented. I hear absolutely no sibilance , or harshness. Bass is accurate, deep , with a fullness and slam that captivates you! My only quibble with them is the midrange. To my ears, the midrange seems a little recessed, when comparing these to the very best Holland , tubes. Sometimes things seem dry in the middle with certain songs which removes the emotional factor. Don't get me wrong. These are very engaging tubes. For most , these would be end game glass. 


74 & 75HG , SWPG Silver Reflector:


First , I'd like to thank Bob , for his dedication to these awesome tubes. The time and effort he's put in to helping people who start this journey , is astounding!  Can't thank him enough! 


To me. The 74 & 75 are very similar. The key differences that I've noticed are soundstage , and bass. The 74's , seem to have more impact in the bass region, and the 75 HG's, have a bigger , more holographic soundstage. Both offer an organic , liquid presentation. Pretty balanced throughout the entire spectrum. Soundstage is of decent size. Not as big or deep as the Siemens CCa, nor the Valvo CCa. To my ears , these tubes have a more forward presentation. Treble , is pretty incisive, and detailed. Bass has good impact but not as deep as most of the other tubes , mentioned. Female vocals are spooky good with these tubes. Kind of reminds me of the Mullards. 


58 Amperex Holland Heerlen pinched waist:


I won't sugar coat my feelings with these tubes. These tubes are very holographic , very detailed , and a smooth and delicate presentation. To my ears they lacked engagement. The midrange was dismal. To me the music had no authority, no impact , and vocals sounded lifeless. The bass was deep , and accurate. But lacking. The attack and decay of notes seemed too fast , and didn't have that linger of depth. I  tried with these tubes, but they just didn't cut it. They just weren't my cup of tea. YMMV. 


65 Amperex Holland (Dumont) 7308 & 65 Philips miniwatt SQ 7308:


I'm lumping these two together. They're very similar, with the Dumonts , presenting things a little bigger, and more bass. These tubes , are midrange kings! These are very musical tubes, warm, full bodied,  with precise impact. Both sets gave you a speaker like presentation. They're a very forward tube. Soundstage is average. They're not as holographic , as the above mentioned(on par with the HG's), nor the Valvo CCa , coming up later. Trebel on these can be hot at times. Bass is deep , and full. They're very fun tubes. I wouldn't recommend them with headphones, like Grados. 


64 Mullard Blackburn E88CC(steel pin) & 65 Mullard Blackburn(GE re-label) 6922(gold pin):


These tubes , are at the top of my list. They are very warm and engaging, sweet buttery tone. Very rich notes , very lifelike , organic presentation. Vocals are absolutely spooky and realistic. Bass is perfect. It's deep, wide, and full. Trebel and midrange, are silky smooth. Surprisingly, the gold pins, more so than the steels, do soundstage very well. Sound portrays itself below you with a sense of being lifted by the music. The steels seemed a little more forward than the golds. These tubes , imo , could be the absolute perfect match for a headphone like Grados. With the HD-650's , it could be way too much warmth. 


Valvo CCa? E88CC? Yellow print, From Heerlen, with delta codes. (Tube1: 1969, Tube2: 1972):


So....... Let's begin with the story behind these tubes. 

My good friend Larry (lekoross), purchased these tubes , from eBay. These tubes were considered to be counterfeit, reprinted , E88CC. A while back it was reported that there were fake tubes being sold on eBay, by a German seller. The transaction with the seller was very sketchy. Took forever for the seller to ship them. So Larry kinda dismissed them and put them on the back burner in his collection. 

I always had some curiosity of those tubes. A month ago,  I offered to buy a pair of the quad he received and we never made an agreement. Larry being the awesome guy he is, more than likely didn't want to distribute tubes of "lower" quality, and possibly fake. 

So me being an eBay hawk , looking for steals , and deals, had seen an auction ,with yellow print Valvo CCa's being offered at an insanely low starting bid. So I scoped it out , and it was Larrys auction. He openly put it out there in the description that he believed they were fake tubes, and was offering them at a bargain. 

So I put them in my watch list and waited until the end, and won the auction. He thought it was pretty hilarious , that it was me. 

So he offered to send them with his 63 Siemens CCa's, and his Mullard Blackburn 6922 (gold pins, and in exchange I sent my Dumonts to him so he could have a listen as well, possibly doing an even trade for the Valvos. 


Now to the Valvos:

 

Let me start by saying this.  Regardless of how fake , mismatched the dates are on these tubes, my quest for the ultimate sound has ended here! I'll call these the "FrankenValvos" , I can't confirm if they truly are Valvo CCa's visually, but sound wise?


 LORD HAVE MERCY!!!!!!!!!


Folk's. Take every tube above mentioned. Roll them in a tube burrito, give it to God for a blessing. Then stick that burrito in your rig. You are now listening to the FrankenValvos. 


LORD HAVE MERCY! Lol


From tubemusem.org: 


Quote: E88CC or CCa VALVO Heerlen Holland 1960's "Real sonic holography, best-musicallity sounding, compellingly realistic, extremely incredible detail, warmth, and clarity - all at the same time, rated up there with the Siemens CCa, classified audiophile-extreme rarity, almost never seen or available in real NOS, especially in the most desirable YELLOW print.


Their description of these tubes , is dead on! 

Take the soundstage , holography, and bass of the Siemens, toss in the awesome midrange and impact of the Amperex , and then add the sweet sweet butter , of the Mullard Blackburns , then age all that like fine wine, then inject it with steroids before mind consumption. Lol


Folk's , I'm so done rolling tubes. Everything I've put in my lyr , previous to these FrankenValvos , is a distant second to my ears! They are the most holographic, full 3D, realistic , organic tubes I've ever heard. The imaging , is Godly! The soundstage , and holography, are endless. Notes appear out of nowhere, full and life sized,  with authority, and fade back into a total blackness.  The sound from these tubes is paralyzing. I'm in complete AWE, with my chin hanging, drooling, with every song that goes by. END GAME FOLKS......END GAME! 


Larry,  I want to openly thank you for your generosity, in sending all of your collection to me , for the listening experience! You are a truly good , and honest guy! I can't thank you enough bro! 


I also want to thank Bill, for answering all my nagging questions in PM, regarding my Holland quest of tubes. You nailed it Billy! You nailed it! 


My conclusion , to all this tube madness is. Folks, don't judge a book by its cover. I was always anal , about matching codes, specific dates, and believed that it was uber important for the best possible sound. With the FrankenValvos, that has all gone out the window! 

I know you'll be reading this Larry. I know that you have the other set of these. I hope that you hear what I'm hearing my friend. If not, you have my address. Lol. Thanks again for everything my friend! I owe you big time!

I also want to thank all the tube vets, for helping me with all their vast knowledge, and patience with a noob , like myself. 


"MAMA , I'M COMING HOME!"


Happy rolling my friends


Over and Out

Sam aka guidostrunk 
beerchug.gif


+1.....Fantastic insights buddy. Congrats on your end game....that must be a load off your shoulders :)

 

With these deep impressions I always find myself wanting to take time to digest the words, after writing a few myself, I know how much effort and thought it takes to translate emotion to words. So I will come back to you with questions when I digest your post in detail.

 

Once again, great job and thank you for taking the time to write this.

 

Cheers

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphone Amps (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphone Amps (full-size) › Schiit Lyr Tube Rollers