Schiit Lyr Tube Rollers
Sep 21, 2014 at 8:03 PM Post #3,136 of 23,492
 
   
Assuming you were commenting on the Rescue Dog tubes, good eye.  Very sloppy stuff on my part.  Apologies to all.  It's moot, since the tube that really was from 1962 died within the first four hours, if not sooner (I was out of the room).
 
But boy do these '75 grey shield Rockets sound good!! 
biggrin.gif

 
Yep, sorry, that's what I was referring to... that's what I get for replying and not paying attention while I'm watching football. :)

-Mike

 
Small price to pay.  I wasted two perfectly good SMC connectors trying to solder while watching football.  That's when I remembered the pause button.
 
Sep 21, 2014 at 10:22 PM Post #3,137 of 23,492
My 75 6N1P's are OTK stamped, different lettering than the 74s. 74s no OTK, but the interior construction appears the same to me. Both test the same on my TC-154. I read somewhere the OTK stamps are sometimes "faked" on later, do you have an opinion RE OTK?  The Miniwatts were EBay, tested on a Funke 19s, which I know is a suspect tester, however the sellers feedback and pedigree of tubes sold appears excellent and I will run them through the Sencore and go from there. 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ECC88-D-Getter-Philips-Miniwatt-Matched-Matched-Pair-E88CC-6DJ8-6922-Cca-valve-/251642587630?
My '75s 6n1p‘s are OTK2 stamped. The '74s have no OTK stamp. The 2 mica '66s OTK2 stamps.

The OTK was the military inspection stamp. Never heard a difference in sound or longevity with the stamp.
 
Sep 21, 2014 at 10:44 PM Post #3,138 of 23,492
Yes, very similar.  Maybe some slight differences up top...?  Tough to say.  Are there differences in their specs?
Some strange things I noticed tonight on these supposed 6n1p-e triple mica tubes. They are supposedly NOS, from a 'master pack'. But are so grimmy I had to clean them to see inside. I use a little rubbing alcohol on a cottonball, works like a charm. But on these the black stamped XI 66 rubbed off! All Russian tubes I've had (and that's a heck of alot) have stenciled dates and shield, they are impervious to alcohol. 2nd, very rarely have I seen black colored stamps, they're always silver or gray. 3rd the date on his ad's 'master' pack label is I 67, these don't match. There's no Voskhod Rocket logo at all on these, unlike all the other Voskhods I've seen, including the 6n5p's he sold me. The shield is wierd looking too, no CCCP or star. HIs only picture of the tube is conviently turned so you can't really see this black printing. 4th they are identical to the 6n5p '68 he also sells.

Now the 2 mica VIII 66 6n1p's have little spring clips on the bottom pins, these have none like the 6n5p's

Are these ultra rare 6n1p-e box anode, black plates restamped 6n5p's? :mad:

PS Of course these are made in another factory, so wouldn't have the Rocket logo. But the Novo shield on the 6n5p is stenciled gray, not black. And does not easily rub off. Same for date and the tube designations.
 
Sep 21, 2014 at 11:40 PM Post #3,139 of 23,492
Some strange things I noticed tonight on these supposed 6n1p-e triple mica tubes. They are supposedly NOS, from a 'master pack'. But are so grimmy I had to clean them to see inside. I use a little rubbing alcohol on a cottonball, works like a charm. But on these the black stamped XI 66 rubbed off! All Russian tubes I've had (and that's a heck of alot) have stenciled dates and shield, they are impervious to alcohol. 2nd, very rarely have I seen black colored stamps, they're always silver or gray. 3rd the date on his ad's 'master' pack label is I 67, these don't match. There's no Voskhod Rocket logo at all on these, unlike all the other Voskhods I've seen, including the 6n5p's he sold me. The shield is wierd looking too, no CCCP or star. HIs only picture of the tube is conviently turned so you can't really see this black printing. 4th they are identical to the 6n5p '68 he also sells.

Now the 2 mica VIII 66 6n1p's have little spring clips on the bottom pins, these have none like the 6n5p's

Are these ultra rare 6n1p-e box anode, black plates restamped 6n5p's?
mad.gif

 
I know what you mean about the "real" stamps on Russian tubes not rubbing off.  I think the same applies to Heerlen stamps.  I couldn't rub off the ones on the now-defunct ECC88s (labeled and sold as 6ES8s/ECC189s).  So that's certainly a flag for suspicion.  Can we be surprised by the shady ways of "NOS" tubes?  Disappointed, certainly, but not surprised.
 
I'll have to examine the two (or is it three???) pairs of Russian tubes coming in.  I'd better be more attentive than I was with those Arcturus 'dogs' 
wink.gif
  Hope yours sound good, at least, and don't die on you!
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 12:13 AM Post #3,140 of 23,492
I have two XI-66 6N1P-E and two 6N5P, IV-63 and XII-68. All these tubes were manufactured in the NEVZ factory in Novosibirsk, Russia.
 
Given that the 6N1P and 6N5P are very similar tubes, both manufactured in the same factory, they appear to share some of the same internals. The plates, micas and getter holders appear to be identical. The only visible difference I see is some kind of spring tensioning device which is located between the 6N1P-E's top two micas which functions to hold the cathode rigidly against the mica. There is no such structure in my 6N5P's. That said, the major differences between the 6N1P and 6N5P are the elements you can't see, primarily the grid and cathode and their relative spacing. Anyway, given the tubes I received, the 6N1P-E does not appear to be a relabeled 6N5P.
 
But again, being manufactured in the same factory, at about the same time, to similar design specifications, it is not surprising to me, at least, that the end result is very similar tubes.
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 1:00 AM Post #3,141 of 23,492
I have two XI-66 6N1P-E and two 6N5P, IV-63 and XII-68. All these tubes were manufactured in the NEVZ factory in Novosibirsk, Russia.

Given that the 6N1P and 6N5P are very similar tubes, both manufactured in the same factory, they appear to share some of the same internals. The plates, micas and getter holders appear to be identical. The only visible difference I see is some kind of spring tensioning device which is located between the 6N1P-E's top two micas which functions to hold the cathode rigidly against the mica. There is no such structure in my 6N5P's. That said, the major differences between the 6N1P and 6N5P are the elements you can't see, primarily the grid and cathode and their relative spacing. Anyway, given the tubes I received, the 6N1P-E does not appear to be a relabeled 6N5P.

But again, being manufactured in the same factory, at about the same time, to similar design specifications, it is not surprising to me, at least, that the end result is very similar tubes.
Do your 6n1p-e tubes have the black print as well? I guess one way to tell if they're really 6n1p's or relabeled 6n5p's is the gain you mentioned. Especially since we have other 6n1p's and 6n5p's to measure against. :rolleyes:
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 1:28 AM Post #3,142 of 23,492
My 6N1P-E's have black print. My 1963 6N5P has white print. And my 1968 6N5P has the silvery-gray print like we see on Voshkods and Reflektors.
 
And again, all these 1960's era tubes were manufactured in the NEVZ factory. However, my VII-74 6N1P were manufactured in the Voskhod factory. So it appears that sometime between 1966 and 1974, production of 6N1P's was shifted to Voskhod, while production of the 6N5P remained at NEVZ. And looking at eBay listings for 6N5P's, I see some with black lettering and some with silvery-gray lettering....
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 2:15 AM Post #3,143 of 23,492
Hi!
Im seller this F*n black plates 6N1P-E and 6N5P .
All tubes new, tested, original and NOT rebranded !
Many old russian tubes marked paint
6N1P and 6N5P have little different parameters and CANT be rebranded and mixed!
6N1P have higher S (4-5,4 mA/V)and lower Ia (6-9 mA ) with anode 250 volt
6N5P have lower S (3,5-4,9 mA/V) and higher Ia (8-10 mA ) with anode 200 volt - like i tested on L3-3 with personal card for each tube type
You cant mix this tube if you can measure them.
6N1P-E from "master pack" have little oiled, i think for better preservation.
Please feel free contact with me, if you can understand my worst english contact my Skype .
I can make more detailed photo any tube.
To rb2013 : Please revise negative feedback on the Ebay !
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 7:00 AM Post #3,144 of 23,492
just curious, have any of you guys ever tried blind listening of tubes? like having someone else switching tubes and seeing if you could correctly ID which is which?
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 10:18 AM Post #3,145 of 23,492
Hi!

Im seller this F*n black plates 6N1P-E and 6N5P .

All tubes new, tested, original and NOT rebranded !

Many old russian tubes marked paint

6N1P and 6N5P have little different parameters and CANT be rebranded and mixed!

6N1P have higher S (4-5,4 mA/V)and lower Ia (6-9 mA ) with anode 250 volt

6N5P have lower S (3,5-4,9 mA/V) and higher Ia (8-10 mA ) with anode 200 volt - like i tested on L3-3 with personal card for each tube type

You cant mix this tube if you can measure them.

6N1P-E from "master pack" have little oiled, i think for better preservation.

Please feel free contact with me, if you can understand my worst english contact my Skype .

I can make more detailed photo any tube.
To rb2013 : Please revise negative feedback on the Ebay !
Thank you for responding nicely here, not calling me a 'madman' as in your ebay message. I have dealt with almost all Russian tube dealers, buying more Russian tubes then I can count, I have been ripped off so many times (most times). Mostly due to, 'NOS' tubes failing testing, as they were worn out used sold as new. I do have a tester, unlike most buyers (including folks who post here). I have never seen black print that just wipes off on all the Russian tubes I've bought over last 5 yrs. They are stenciled on, and although sometimes faint, do not rub off.

I have seen 6n23p's with the stenciling removed, and black stamped 6dj8 or E88CC. Obvious fakes. I have some 6n23p's restamped over the stenciling.

If these were factory painted, it would be the first I've seen of it. Then I offer my apologies. :wink:

But, I noticed some other discrepancies in your ad, that aroused my suspicions. The date on the 'master pack' you promently show next to the tube, shows a different date. I - 67, the tubes you sent have a different date. IX 66. And the one photo of the actual tube, has it turned so the date is unreadable. Why did you post that master pack documentation from a different tube then you sell? Do you have the master pack documentation for these tubes? So even if these are truly black printed 6n1p-e, your ebay ad is misleading and inaccurate, whether intentional or not - I can't say. :mad:

Oiled the tubes to preserve them! First I've heard of that! I will post pictures of what I recieved to
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 10:47 AM Post #3,146 of 23,492
My 6N1P-E's have black print. My 1963 6N5P has white print. And my 1968 6N5P has the silvery-gray print like we see on Voshkods and Reflektors.

And again, all these 1960's era tubes were manufactured in the NEVZ factory. However, my VII-74 6N1P were manufactured in the Voskhod factory. So it appears that sometime between 1966 and 1974, production of 6N1P's was shifted to Voskhod, while production of the 6N5P remained at NEVZ. And looking at eBay listings for 6N5P's, I see some with black lettering and some with silvery-gray lettering....
Well all the 6n1p-e's on ebay are from the same seller, of course with black print. Just a variety of different ads from same seller. So that doesn't mean much.

Just looked through all the ebay ads for 6n5p's, about two dozen. Didn't see any with '6N5P' in black print, same for the date. NEVZ factory or not, same for the variety of dates. Everyone had silver gray stenciled markings. Could you point me to the ones you found with black print? :xf_eek:
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 1:03 PM Post #3,147 of 23,492
Taking a second look, I think the lighting in the photo makes the lettering look darker than it really is.....
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/6N5P-Vintage-Audiophile-Triode-NEW-NOS-1971-Lot-of-1pcs-/171447516301?
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 1:41 PM Post #3,148 of 23,492
Taking a second look, I think the lighting in the photo makes the lettering look darker than it really is.....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/6N5P-Vintage-Audiophile-Triode-NEW-NOS-1971-Lot-of-1pcs-/171447516301?
I did see one with CCCP stamped in black over the gray stenciled 6n5p. Well the dealer has strenuously denied these are restamped, and provided a picture of a 6c40, and 663n stamped in black print. So I do feel better about these. I'll post some pictures tonight, including his.

I'll also try and do a gain test on these in the Lyr.

Maybe I'm a bit paranoid about dealing with these overseas ebay dealers of Russian tubes, but it's because of many bad experiences in the past. :wink:
 
Sep 22, 2014 at 1:50 PM Post #3,149 of 23,492
Update on the Arcturus 'dogs' ... I messaged the seller last night about the dead tube.  It was my second message to him; first was explaining that they're not really 6ES8s/ECC189s, so he realized I knew a little something.  I told him that a refund would seem to be in order, and that I could ship both tubes back to him.  Woke up this morning to a very pleasant email.  He'd refunded the entire transaction, including shipping, no questions asked, and told me to keep the tubes.  Outstanding!  Guess he buys huge lots for next to nothing, so it was no great loss to him.  So I have my odd little museum pieces as keepsakes.  Fun stuff.
 
On the 6N5P front, I'll pick mine up today after the post office re-opens and report back.  If anyone wants a few pix posted, let me know.  I'm burning in the '75 Rockets for the next few days, so won't get to listen to 6N5Ps immediately.
 
Bob, you are not helping US/Russian relations!  Putin will have his revenge  
wink.gif

 
Sep 22, 2014 at 2:31 PM Post #3,150 of 23,492
To those of you with tube testers....
 
The seller makes a very good point, I think. The 6N1P and 6N5P should test and measure differently:
 
> 6N1P have higher S (4-5,4 mA/V)and lower Ia (6-9 mA ) with anode 250 volt
> 6N5P have lower S (3,5-4,9 mA/V) and higher Ia (8-10 mA ) with anode 200 volt - like i tested on L3-3 with personal card for each tube type
> You cant mix this tube if you can measure them.
 
Are any of you able to test these tubes in this way?
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top