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Skeptico Saloon: An Objectivist Joint - Page 43

post #631 of 820
I haven't tried those... but I did use the auto equalization process built into my Yamaha AV receiver. It identified an overlap in the crossover from mains to sub, but it royally messed up the rest. It even dialed down my sub so it wasn't even putting out sound any more.

My sound mixer friend has had experience with a bunch of pro auto equalization devices for live sound PA systems. He says they don't work very well. He goes back with tones afterwards and finds obvious imbalances that the microphone based system missed. He thinks it's something to do with trying to balance everything at once with pink noise as opposed to balancing a frequency at a time with a tone... maybe masking or something.
post #632 of 820

Looks like the doofus who was dogging me over in headphone forum has followed me back to Sound Science because he's been banned from the PM-1 thread and can't insult me over there any more. Sorry about that folks!

post #633 of 820

Oh by the way... I had a fun surprise last week. One of my media server Drobo drives took a dump. 9TB of material, including my whole music library with a nice red blinking light and warning error alert. I popped in a new 3TB drive to replace the dead one and sweat bullets for four days while it recovered data. Today, I was happy to see that everything is back to normal and the drives are happy again.

 

Stewardship over 120TB of precious data can be a nerve racking hobby!

post #634 of 820
Love my Drobo. I'm glad to read that it works as advertised! Why did it take 4 days?
Edited by swspiers - 4/8/14 at 7:23pm
post #635 of 820

Rebuilding a lost drive takes a long time. A 3TB drive takes 117 hours. A 4TB drive takes the better part of a week! I don't mind, because the data is theoretically still accessible (even though I'm too afraid to use the drive while it's backing itself up!) I can tell you that for the past four days I've been biting my fingernails to nubs waiting for the nice green lights to come back!

post #636 of 820

I bowed out of the PM-1 threads over in the headphones forum a while back. Now it seems an old locked thread has been reopened and people are being chastised for posting measurements rather than "impressions". It used to be that the only difference between sound science and the rest of headfi was double blind testing. Now it seems like any kind of technical talk that sounds confusing to the uneducated masses is off limits.

post #637 of 820
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post
 

I bowed out of the PM-1 threads over in the headphones forum a while back. Now it seems an old locked thread has been reopened and people are being chastised for posting measurements rather than "impressions". It used to be that the only difference between sound science and the rest of headfi was double blind testing. Now it seems like any kind of technical talk that sounds confusing to the uneducated masses is off limits.


Could you be more specific?

 

If not for sound science, I wouldn't visit this site. 

post #638 of 820

Here's the thread and here is a quote to consider...

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/685704/oppo-pm-1-a-new-planar-magnetic-headphone/1455#post_10461887

 

Quote:
 Guys, like I said before: Listen to some music with a pair and correlate that to any measurements. Talking about measurements without listening to the sound is almost a complete waste of time, especially to those people who want to read people's impressions and not a bunch of confusing technicalities. I'd strongly suggest that if you don't have either impressions or something useful to comment or ask about people's impressions then you hold back on posting and I'll open up Jude's original thread for all that discussion

Edited by bigshot - 4/15/14 at 10:16pm
post #639 of 820
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post
 

Here's the thread and here is a quote to consider...

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/685704/oppo-pm-1-a-new-planar-magnetic-headphone/1455#post_10461887

 


I see what you mean.

 

Yes, shouldn't clog up a thread with unreliable talk of measurements.  Stick to the highly reliable listening impressions people want to hear about.  Those are only effected by mental state, background noise, listening levels (everyone listens at a different level likely), sighted bias, a propensity for the brain to fill in differences that aren't there etc. etc. etc.  Much more reliable that.  That is why I avoid almost completely the rest of the forums outside of Sound Science.


Edited by esldude - 4/16/14 at 9:24am
post #640 of 820
measurements = complete waste of time
impressions = useful!
post #641 of 820

I don't understand how you guys can box yourselves into just one subforum in a headphone enthusiast forum. One which barely gets any recognition or talk from engineers from companies and very few actual topics  (non subjective vs objective discussion) unless it is a recycle of discussions before.  It seems like a waste of time if none of the products around at least interest you in innovation and performance.

post #642 of 820
Quote:
Originally Posted by KamijoIsMyHero View Post

I don't understand how you guys can box yourselves into just one subforum in a headphone enthusiast forum. One which barely gets any recognition or talk from engineers from companies and very few actual topics  (non subjective vs objective discussion) unless it is a recycle of discussions before.  It seems like a waste of time if none of the products around at least interest you in innovation and performance.

....errrr, 'box yourselves in'??? I think you've got something a bit bassackwards there. Perhaps when you sort out that little confusion in your mind we could have a conversation.

w
post #643 of 820
Quote:
Originally Posted by KamijoIsMyHero View Post
 

I don't understand how you guys can box yourselves into just one subforum in a headphone enthusiast forum. One which barely gets any recognition or talk from engineers from companies and very few actual topics  (non subjective vs objective discussion) unless it is a recycle of discussions before.  It seems like a waste of time if none of the products around at least interest you in innovation and performance.


Depends on your idea of being boxed in.  Having people put forth ideas not just incredible, but impossible while not being allowed to refute them with real facts, knowledge and science without getting banned seems rather confining.  Now the imagination knows no bounds.  So maybe Sound imagination forums are more lively and such.  Products based upon the imagination too.  Imagination is good if checked against reality for innovation.  Without that reality check not so much as it results in faux-innovation. 

post #644 of 820
Quote:
Originally Posted by KamijoIsMyHero View Post
 

I don't understand how you guys can box yourselves into just one subforum in a headphone enthusiast forum. One which barely gets any recognition or talk from engineers from companies and very few actual topics  (non subjective vs objective discussion) unless it is a recycle of discussions before.  It seems like a waste of time if none of the products around at least interest you in innovation and performance.

 

I learn an awful lot from the folks in the Sound Science forum. In the headphones forum, everyone just recites model numbers, that mean nothing to me, along with vague poetry describing their sound, which means even less.

 

Here I can ask a question about how things work and get a knowledgeable answer to my question. Sometimes I even understand the answers!

post #645 of 820

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigshot View Post
 

 

I learn an awful lot from the folks in the Sound Science forum. In the headphones forum, everyone just recites model numbers, that mean nothing to me, along with vague poetry describing their sound, which means even less.

 

Here I can ask a question about how things work and get a knowledgeable answer to my question. Sometimes I even understand the answers!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by esldude View Post
 


Depends on your idea of being boxed in.  Having people put forth ideas not just incredible, but impossible while not being allowed to refute them with real facts, knowledge and science without getting banned seems rather confining.  Now the imagination knows no bounds.  So maybe Sound imagination forums are more lively and such.  Products based upon the imagination too.  Imagination is good if checked against reality for innovation.  Without that reality check not so much as it results in faux-innovation. 

 

You can learn and discuss all that in a different forum, one where there is less restriction or mod interferences (I have had more than one moronic interaction with a mod so I know of their faulty work). I just don't understand why headfi only when there are only very few people that posts in this subforum. That is what I mean in "box yourself" or "confining". Is this really the only subforum you guys can find, surely there are more like this with more engaging people that posts actively. Hence, I don't see the point of crying about your experiences reading impressions which you can't relate to.

 

I am a man of science myself and part of the reason I keep checking on headfi is the innovation manufacturers or engineers try to make. Unfortunately, I didn't enroll in audio related engineering so my interests in new audio products is of genuine nature and also since new tech is always interesting anyway. A big one that has intrigued me is the current Oppo headphone and its design. It is unconventional and makes me wonder how it is supposed to sound or offer something different  from the typical planar magnetics. Even before that, planar magnetic design and beyerdynamic tesla tech was interesting as I have never heard of it before as I was used to seeing dynamic drivers. For IEM side, freqphase, multiple BAs and hybrids has peaked my interests. Sure you can assume what they will sound like with a freq response but there are countless that aren't. I get confused as well of the descriptions people use but it is not that big of a deal.

 

If people's impressions bother you, then can try to look or ask for a direct comparisons of products you know well. People will typically try to help you to get a better idea of how it sounds like. There is some merit in direct comparisons given they were reviewed the same way. Just be a decent-friendly person.

 

Also, contrary to the consensus here that refuting claims will get you banned, I see it more often than not that the one that gets banned are brash individuals. I don't take a liking of negative individuals especially when they try to associate themselves to people of science. It gives a lot of bad reputation which is most likely what you experience as a results of trying to provide technical explanations. It is unfortunate to see this is the case in headfi most likely spurred by a few brash individuals acting in the name of science. There is a difference in asserting your refutes with evidence to insulting another of their intelligence or similar acts to prove your point. Bigshot's way in handling the oppo thread was in my opinion the proper way, some of the discussion was just way too off topic

 

Lastly, I don't include products such as 10k cables in mind. If a product tries to sell itself past an already well proven scientific fact or theory, then you can ignore such product and leave the people who enjoy such products at peace. I barely go into the cable section myself. How hard is it to just leave people alone? There is no need to patronize people behind their backs or threads which they will never check. I am saying this based on my personal sets of ethics. Sorry, if that offends any of you.

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakibaki View Post


....errrr, 'box yourselves in'??? I think you've got something a bit bassackwards there. Perhaps when you sort out that little confusion in your mind we could have a conversation.

w

Sorry, English is not my first language and sometimes my grammar is messed up. I try to explain myself better above.

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