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New Schiit! Ragnarok and Yggdrasil - Page 132

post #1966 of 9301

Yep. Many have at this point. Hard to give a final judgement without more listening, but it's definitely good w/ LCD3 or HD800. And those are a few of the harder drive headphones of an electrical load and "synergy". So things are looking good.

post #1967 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyWaj10 View Post

Yes! I would love a Schiit stack of Gungnir, equivalent pre-amp, and a 2-ch 100w amp...wow that would be freakin awesome.

Psssst...Ragnarok is 100wpc into a 4 ohm speaker load and has full preamp switching capabilities. Yes, I know it's not two boxes, but.....
post #1968 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesure View Post


Psssst...Ragnarok is 100wpc into a 4 ohm speaker load and has full preamp switching capabilities. Yes, I know it's not two boxes, but.....

 

Well aware...I left out the concepts of (1) with remote control, and (2) closer to Gungnir prices.  Probably a poor argument again, however, seeing as that would put the price around Ragnarok.  So I guess for me it all boils down to image (i.e. rack)?  I dunno, I guess I'm just retarded.

post #1969 of 9301
post #1970 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesure View Post

Psssst...Ragnarok is 100wpc into a 4 ohm speaker load and has full preamp switching capabilities. Yes, I know it's not two boxes, but.....

 

So it's just 60wpc into a 8 ohm... my concern is, how would that go with a typical 150-200 watt floorstander?

 

With 89 dB sensitivity and 60 watts.. From 10 ft listening distance that should give over 103 dB/SPL, which is quite loud, but that's at peak power. 


Edited by madwolfa - 6/4/14 at 8:36am
post #1971 of 9301
Eh? 150-200watt floorstanders?? I guess you're talking about the rated max power the speaker can take, which it irrelevant unless you're trying to fill a stadium. What you'll need to know is how efficient the speakers are and their impedance. 60w is typically more than enough to fill a good sized room with ear-bleeding volume when using typical 90db efficient speakers. I'm confident Schiit will have provided enough current and capacitance to provide dynamic headroom aplenty as well. Now, if you're trying to drive some 84db speakers and fill a gym with sound, I'd suggest looking elsewhere.
post #1972 of 9301
I'm sure that the 60wpc is RMS. You'll have another roughly 60w above that for peaks. It just depends how you plan to listen. If you wanna listen at concert levels while two rooms away, this isn't the amp for you.
post #1973 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesure View Post

Eh? 150-200watt floorstanders?? I guess you're talking about the rated max power the speaker can take, which it irrelevant unless you're trying to fill a stadium. What you'll need to know is how efficient the speakers are and their impedance. 60w is typically more than enough to fill a good sized room with ear-bleeding volume when using typical 90db efficient speakers. I'm confident Schiit will have provided enough current and capacitance to provide dynamic headroom aplenty as well. Now, if you're trying to drive some 84db speakers and fill a gym with sound, I'd suggest looking elsewhere.

 

Yeah, I just did some SPL calculations and that loudness should be plenty. But why do manufacturers normally recommend amplifiers with more power than rated max power of the speakers? Just to make sure it can handle the complex transients without going into distortion?


Edited by madwolfa - 6/4/14 at 8:46am
post #1974 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by madwolfa View Post
 

 

Yeah, I just did some SPL calculations and that loudness should be plenty. But why do manufacturers normally recommend amplifiers with more power than rated max power of the speakers? Just to make sure it can handle the complex transients without going into distortion?

People like big numbers.

post #1975 of 9301

Most people don't realize how loud 100dB is. I like to listen on the louder side of things (many of my friends can't handle my levels), and even so I rarely get past 100dB for dynamic peaks.

post #1976 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by madwolfa View Post

Yeah, I just did some SPL calculations and that loudness should be plenty. But why do manufacturers normally recommend amplifiers with more power than rated max power of the speakers? Just to make sure it can handle the complex transients without going into distortion?

What manufacturers? The amp manufacturers...well, they MIGHT have a built in incentive to recommend their bigger (more expensive) models. The speaker manufacturers? I doubt they want to getting an amp rated much higher than what the speaker can handle, but they'd rather that than trying to push clipped distortion into them and then complain that they sound like crap.

Bottom line...use your very own brain and get enough good, high current solid state or tube power to fill your space to listening levels. Ignore the IC chips...who wants a calculator trying to drive their speakers? Give me 25w of high current, high capacitance power over 100w of Sony IC chip garbage power any day of the week.

But again, I'm not trying to replicate the Alice in Chains concert at full volume in a gym, so 25w is enough for me.
Edited by leesure - 6/4/14 at 1:24pm
post #1977 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesure View Post


What manufacturers? The amp manufacturers...well, they MIGHT have a built in incentive to recommend their bigger (more expensive) models. The speaker manufacturers? I doubt they want to getting an amp rated much higher than what the speaker can handle, but they'd rather that than trying to push clipped distortion into them and then complain that they sound like crap.

Bottom line...use your very own brain and get enough good, high current solid state or tube power to fill your space to listening levels. Ignore the IC chips...who wants a calculator trying to drive their speakers? Give me 25w of high current, high capacitance power over 100w of Sony IC chip garbage power any day of the week.

But again, I'm not trying to replicate the Alice in Chains concert at full volume in a gym, so 25w is enough for me.

 

I'm now using a 200 Wpc / 8 Ohm Rotel power amplifier (very warm 40 lbs pig) with 150 W KEF Q700 floorstanders (89 dB). I barely use the volume pot travel at my normal listening levels.

That means I should be good even with 10 watt amplifier, I guess. :D 

 

At the same time, having a 500 bhp sports car doesn't mean you have to use it full throttle all the time.. but good to know you have that extra juice when you need it.

 

I'm just wondering, if Ragnarok would be a more refined and better sounding amplifier to replace the Rotel pre/power amp combination I have. I guess I don't care about those extra watts so much.

post #1978 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by madwolfa View Post

I'm now using a 200 Wpc / 8 Ohm Rotel power amplifier (very warm 40 lbs pig) with 150 W KEF Q700 floorstanders (89 dB). I barely use the volume pot travel at my normal listening levels.
That means I should be good even with 10 watt amplifier, I guess. biggrin.gif  

At the same time, having a 500 bhp sports car doesn't mean you have to use it full throttle all the time.. but good to know you have that extra juice when you need it.

I'm just wondering, if Ragnarok would be a more refined and better sounding amplifier to replace the Rotel pre/power amp combination I have. I guess I don't care about those extra watts so much.

Understood...but carrying the car analogy further, having a Ferrari to drive around the downtown of NYC, is really nothing more than for attention. You won't gain any real value from the driving experience.

FWIW, I have a pair of 85db efficient 6ohm Celestion SL600's that I plan to drive with the Ragnarok. I currently drive them with a 100wpc Musical Fidelity amp and will be comparing the two before deciding whether to just use Rags as an HP amp or whether it has the oomph to drive the Very inefficient Celestions well enough. I suspect that, unless your Q700's are in a huge room (20x20-ish) or you are trying to wake the neighbors, 60w of clean Schiit power will likely be enough.

But that doesn't address the crux of your question. Only by listening yourself will you be bake to determine if the Ragnarok sound is better than the Rotel sound in your opinion. Rotel is a producer of fine, high current, mid-priced amplification and is under-represented in conversations about mid-tier Hifi. I don't know the answer to whether Rags will sound better or worse...only that you will be unlikely to miss the extra 140w.
post #1979 of 9301

Good question. I plan on driving a pair of fairly efficient 93dB/W, 8 Ohm OBs with the Rag eventually. Right now I'm able to drive them to VERY loud levels with just 20W so I won't be getting the Rag because of the big numbers. For your KEFs, the first 10W would get you to 99dB and the first 100W would get you to 109 (ouch) dB.

 

I'm hoping for a very accurate, very linear amplifier in the Rag. That almost goes without saying; I'm sure Jason will make sure the Rag is impeccable on the test bench. But what I'm really looking for is the ability to handle a reactive load from the output stage (solid tight bass and big dynamics) and good PCB design/low noise/good loop characteristics (all of these which, IME, add up to clean high frequency performance). My current amp is a bit lacking in these two areas (I've confirmed this next to better gear) so if the Rag can deliver in these areas then it'll probably be the last amp I ever buy.

 

All of the extra features, extra power, slick chassis, etc. is just icing on the cake.

post #1980 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by OJNeg View Post

 

All of the extra features, extra power, slick chassis, etc. is just icing on the cake.

 

And I would be able to plug in my HD650 if I need to.. kinda hesitant to buy a separate headphone amp for a living room.

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