or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › New Schiit! Ragnarok and Yggdrasil
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

New Schiit! Ragnarok and Yggdrasil - Page 95

post #1411 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jones Bob View Post

An output transformer would work here, but is expensive.

Ragg is twice the price of the Mjolnir…probably some leeway for one?
post #1412 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eee Pee View Post

Ragg is twice the price of the Mjolnir…probably some leeway for one?

I seriously doubt it.
post #1413 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry S View Post
 

 

 

I've been trying to make some headway on the basics of amplifier design, but it's having trouble penetrating my biologist brain. The Mjolnir (circlotron CSPP) topology is described as an inherently balanced design, but the Rag is a circlotron topology with a single-ended output.

 

Actually, Ragnarok and Mjolnir are both circlotron-style CSPP topologies, but there's a very simple answer as to why Ragnarok has single-ended output: it uses summers to create them from the balanced signal. Same as Gungnir on its SE outputs. We chose discrete summers rather than output transformers after trying both. Transformers have BIG problems with picking up induced field from the power transformer, and would require active buffers afterwards in any case for any significant power output (or they would double the size of the Ragnarok.)

 

So, what does this mean?

 

1. The inherent simplicity of the circlotron topology isn't compromised. It's preserved all the way to the speaker outs and the balanced headphone outs.

 

2. The SE output won't have the insane capability of the balanced outputs, being limited to only about 3W into 50 ohms. If you're running HE-6s, plan on buying a balanced cable.

 

3. Now you're getting an idea of the crazy complexity of this design. Don't even get me started on the software, which required the creation of an algorithm to ensure that (a) the amp wouldn't de-bias itself when you're playing dynamically compressed music at high volume, and (b) wouldn't allow any situation where it could go into thermal runaway. 


Edited by Jason Stoddard - 4/11/14 at 5:11pm
post #1414 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Stoddard View Post
 

 

Actually, Ragnarok and Mjolnir are both circlotron-style CSPP topologies, but there's a very simple answer as to why Ragnarok has single-ended output: it uses summers to create them from the balanced signal. Same as Gungnir on its SE outputs. We chose discrete summers rather than output transformers after trying both. Transformers have BIG problems with picking up induced field from the power transformer, and would require active buffers afterwards in any case for any significant power output (or they would double the size of the Ragnarok.)

 

So, what does this mean?

 

1. The inherent simplicity of the circlotron topology isn't compromised. It's preserved all the way to the speaker outs and the balanced headphone outs.

 

2. The SE output won't have the insane capability of the balanced outputs, being limited to only about 3W into 50 ohms. If you're running HE-6s, plan on buying a balanced cable.

 

3. Now you're getting an idea of the crazy complexity of this design. Don't even get me started on the software, which required the creation of an algorithm to ensure that (a) the amp wouldn't de-bias itself when you're playing dynamically compressed music at high volume, and (b) wouldn't allow any situation where it could go into thermal runaway. 

 

Jason-- Thanks for the explanation. It sounds like the SE output will still run anything short of the HE-6 with power to spare. Glad to hear the software will prevent thermal runaway--that could put a small crimp in someone's day. :beyersmile:

post #1415 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Stoddard View Post
 

2. The SE output won't have the insane capability of the balanced outputs, being limited to only about 3W into 50 ohms. If you're running HE-6s, plan on buying a balanced cable.

 

3. Now you're getting an idea of the crazy complexity of this design. Don't even get me started on the software, which required the creation of an algorithm to ensure that (a) the amp wouldn't de-bias itself when you're playing dynamically compressed music at high volume, and (b) wouldn't allow any situation where it could go into thermal runaway. 

3W into 50 ohms out of SE, man. . . now I can only half blow out my eardrums. :P

 

Also, "thermal runaway", I guess you didn't choose the name Ragnarok for nothing. 

 

Thanks for the small insight in to the guts of Ragnarok, I'm very excited for its release. Keep up the great work, Schiit guys.

post #1416 of 9301

Jason, if I connect both headphones and speakers to the amp at the same time, will either output be muted? Or does it have some sort of the switch to control?

post #1417 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnmnkh View Post
 

Jason, if I connect both headphones and speakers to the amp at the same time, will either output be muted? Or does it have some sort of the switch to control?

You have the choice of running just speakers, just headphones, or both, by holding down the input select switch--it cycles through all three modes.

post #1418 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Stoddard View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnmnkh View Post
 

Jason, if I connect both headphones and speakers to the amp at the same time, will either output be muted? Or does it have some sort of the switch to control?

You have the choice of running just speakers, just headphones, or both, by holding down the input select switch--it cycles through all three modes.

 

and you did not add even 50$ to cost for implementing this, I remember read your post earlier in this thread

post #1419 of 9301

Jason,

 

Does the gain selection control effect both the speaker taps and headphone outputs? Been kinda curious how that'd work.

post #1420 of 9301
I've never melted anything down with a software bug. Fun!
post #1421 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGimp View Post
 

Jason,

 

Does the gain selection control effect both the speaker taps and headphone outputs? Been kinda curious how that'd work.

Yep, it does.

post #1422 of 9301
Quote:
Originally Posted by m2man View Post

I've never melted anything down with a software bug. Fun!

 

Yeah, pretty spectacular meltdowns too, like this:

 

 

Yes, that's actually molten metal that flowed into the weave pattern of the thermal insulator.

post #1423 of 9301

:eek: eek!

post #1424 of 9301

I don't want to know how much current these poor component pulled from that bug .   :p

Reminds me of my first lab class with discrete electronics. The good old smell of coffee and burned transistor in the morning...

Good times.

post #1425 of 9301
In the market for my "end game" amp...am looking at the auralic Taurus as my first choice, but willing to wait to see how the ragnarok fares. Seems to be more versatile than the Taurus...if it can match it kn terms of performance and matching with HD800/D7000/grados, I'm all-in. Watching/waiting keenly.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: High-end Audio Forum
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › New Schiit! Ragnarok and Yggdrasil