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**MrSpeakers Mad Dog: Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 66

post #976 of 2695

Alphpads + He6 + Liza Minnelli = Swinging Delicious !!

 

http://www.amazon.com/Cabaret-Original-Soundtrack-Recording-1972/dp/B000005KOH

 

 


Edited by Lorspeaker - 7/29/13 at 11:26pm
post #977 of 2695

Whats your impressions to hifimans with alpha pads,

Maybe ill give it a try?

post #978 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

 

I don't particularly believe burn-in has much of an effect on headphones (at least not most of them), but this is especially true of the T50RP. I've not seen any benefit from burning it in.

 

Most burn-in is just psychological burn-in, IMO. Even if that means you listened for 5 minutes, set them to burn-in for hours on end, and then came back to them.

 

With the alpha pads, I've found that they can take a few minutes to really warm up and fit/seal really nicely, though usually I can get a solid fit and seal right away. The pads also get squished easily and can take some time to regain their proper shape.

 

I was a bit underwhelmed with modded T50RPs when I got into them. All I can say is to give yourself some time with them exclusively, or even consider taking a few days break from headphones (or most other audio gear) before coming back to them. They have some characteristics that I wasn't quite used to at first as well. However, the Mad Dog 3.2 took no adjustment time personally...really like how they sound.

i think that there is burn in effects, each time i bought a new headphone the 1st two days where normal , there was always this moment where you tell yourself that the sound didn't sound so good before, i am sure that i am not the only one who felt like this, in fact this happened to me like four times, i used to think that the burn in is a crap too. 

post #979 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by martybm5 View Post

Has anyone tried ALO Audio "The National" with the Mad Dogs ? I've been very curious about that pairing.

not good. way too dark. The national works very well on the ultrasone pro900's imo.


Edited by jibzilla - 7/30/13 at 5:33am
post #980 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shini44 View Post

i think that there is burn in effects, each time i bought a new headphone the 1st two days where normal , there was always this moment where you tell yourself that the sound didn't sound so good before, i am sure that i am not the only one who felt like this, in fact this happened to me like four times, i used to think that the burn in is a crap too. 

 

I still think its most likely psychological burn-in or adjustment. Tyll did some tests on burn-in a while back. There were some measurable changes, but so small that it shouldn't account for the dramatic differences people hear. Of course, this was just on one headphone, but I believe it was the K701/K702 (which many claim requires hundreds of hours of burn-in...so it's a good candidate to test). On the other hand, I did see a monthly updated on Innerfidelity where Tyll said a headphone had odd distortion measurements that went away after 40 hours of burn-in. I don't think he provided the comparison, though...?

 

There's also the positive feedback from others claiming burn-in can make large differences, which in turn makes others more likely to "hear" the effects of burn-in.

 

I think it's almost always psychological adjustment or placebo. At the very least, it's likely a mixture of both (mechanical and psychological break-in). Some headphones might benefit...most others not.

 

I still haven't heard any benefits from burning in any of the T50RPs I've had.

 

Anyway, just my opinion on burn-in! Even if we don't agree, it doesn't really affect either of us in the end. :)

post #981 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by zibra View Post

Whats your impressions to hifimans with alpha pads,

Maybe ill give it a try?

 

sounded more focused, bass more muscular...

i seemed to perceive the depth more, 

really accentuate the effects of my cabledyne powercords.

every headfier should keep a pair of alphapads :P

post #982 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

 

I still think its most likely psychological burn-in or adjustment. Tyll did some tests on burn-in a while back. There were some measurable changes, but so small that it shouldn't account for the dramatic differences people hear. Of course, this was just on one headphone, but I believe it was the K701/K702 (which many claim requires hundreds of hours of burn-in...so it's a good candidate to test). On the other hand, I did see a monthly updated on Innerfidelity where Tyll said a headphone had odd distortion measurements that went away after 40 hours of burn-in. I don't think he provided the comparison, though...?

 

There's also the positive feedback from others claiming burn-in can make large differences, which in turn makes others more likely to "hear" the effects of burn-in.

 

I think it's almost always psychological adjustment or placebo. At the very least, it's likely a mixture of both (mechanical and psychological break-in). Some headphones might benefit...most others not.

 

I still haven't heard any benefits from burning in any of the T50RPs I've had.

 

Anyway, just my opinion on burn-in! Even if we don't agree, it doesn't really affect either of us in the end. :)

From what I understand, you shouldnt notice burn in as much with orthos like the T50RP and Mad Dogs however with dynamic speakers, that's a different ball game. I've seen it (heard it) with most of my speakers and headphones. I personally havent noticed any change with the Mad Dogs.

post #983 of 2695
Quote:
I still think its most likely psychological burn-in or adjustment. Tyll did some tests on burn-in a while back. There were some measurable changes, but so small that it shouldn't account for the dramatic differences people hear.

How do you know they are small ?  If you magically know exactly which measurements correspond to which sound qualities, then in six months, you could put all the headphone and speaker companies out of business.

 

As a result, I now think that measurements are actually irresponsible (sorry Tyll).  They give people the false impression that there is someone who knows.  There isn't.

 

The human mind wants to oversimplify everything, because every increase in population adds to the complexity of the world.  (Making a phone call is actually much more complex and difficult than 50 years ago.)

 

PS  Burn-in is a widely accepted phenomenon in manufacturing of physical products. Ask a shoe manufacturer.

post #984 of 2695

Let's not get into the whole burn-in debate on a non-dedicated thread. It's a recipe for getting the thread shut down. There have been a million discussions on the topic (see here for the most recent major thread on it), and none have been conclusive.

post #985 of 2695

Good point.

 

I'll just mention that amongst those who experience changes in headphones due to burn-in, most state that they do not experience it with planar magnetic, so it is a moot point.

 

Conversely, the Mad Dogs (and I am guessing the T50RP in general) present a significantly different part of the sound than most headphones, so the mind will take some time to get used to hearing some new things and not hearing other old things. redface.gif


Edited by kstuart - 7/30/13 at 1:11pm
post #986 of 2695

I hate my friend. I've been using my Beyer DT880 250ohm for the last seven months and was pretty happy with them (could use more bass though). Then I listened to my friend's Denon D5000 yesterday and realized how much bass I was actually missing! I'm already purchasing his Audio-gd FUN that he went all out on a couple years ago for ~$150 (my Fiio e10 is also dying), but now I'm looking at purchasing the Mad Dogs as well. Denon's have a TAD too much bass and the Beyer's are too bright. Based on what I've read, the MDs seem like a pretty solid middle choice. How hard are the MDs to drive compared to the Beyers? I'm at about 35-40% volume on high gain with the FUN with the Beyers.

post #987 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontMakeMEEatU View Post

I hate my friend. I've been using my Beyer DT880 250ohm for the last seven months and was pretty happy with them (could use more bass though). Then I listened to my friend's Denon D5000 yesterday and realized how much bass I was actually missing! I'm already purchasing his Audio-gd FUN that he went all out on a couple years ago for ~$150 (my Fiio e10 is also dying), but now I'm looking at purchasing the Mad Dogs as well. Denon's have a TAD too much bass and the Beyer's are too bright. Based on what I've read, the MDs seem like a pretty solid middle choice. How hard are the MDs to drive compared to the Beyers? I'm at about 35-40% volume on high gain with the FUN with the Beyers.

 

The FUN should be more than sufficient power for the MDs. If you are at 30-40% with the Beyers, I'd suspect 55-60% with the MDs depending on how loud you listen. 

post #988 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontMakeMEEatU View Post

I hate my friend. I've been using my Beyer DT880 250ohm for the last seven months and was pretty happy with them (could use more bass though). Then I listened to my friend's Denon D5000 yesterday and realized how much bass I was actually missing! I'm already purchasing his Audio-gd FUN that he went all out on a couple years ago for ~$150 (my Fiio e10 is also dying), but now I'm looking at purchasing the Mad Dogs as well. Denon's have a TAD too much bass and the Beyer's are too bright. Based on what I've read, the MDs seem like a pretty solid middle choice. How hard are the MDs to drive compared to the Beyers? I'm at about 35-40% volume on high gain with the FUN with the Beyers.

 

The Mad Dogs are certainly not a middle choice when compared to my recabled, Lawton-tuned D5000 with angled pads.  Nothing I have heard has such a flat response that hits all the important notes in a song with the right volume level.  My Mad Dogs are technically superior to my modded D5000.  That said, the Mad Dogs probably will not improve the bass quantity from your DT880.  There is not much out there like the Denon Dxxxx series headphones for sub-bass.  With the right amp and music, what a Denon provides is not achievable from just about any other headphone with regards to bass.  

 

No matter what else is out there at or near the same price, you simply cannot go wrong with the Mad Dogs.  They are such a solid performer and it is the only headphone in its price range that I would never hesitate to recommend to anyone in almost every circumstance.

post #989 of 2695
Quote:
Originally Posted by kstuart View Post

How do you know they are small ?  If you magically know exactly which measurements correspond to which sound qualities, then in six months, you could put all the headphone and speaker companies out of business.

 

As a result, I now think that measurements are actually irresponsible (sorry Tyll).  They give people the false impression that there is someone who knows.  There isn't.

 

The human mind wants to oversimplify everything, because every increase in population adds to the complexity of the world.  (Making a phone call is actually much more complex and difficult than 50 years ago.)

 

PS  Burn-in is a widely accepted phenomenon in manufacturing of physical products. Ask a shoe manufacturer.

 

Well, if you look at Tyll's results, small = maybe a 0.2-0.3db change. You might see some very specific areas change by 1db. I also believe there was a minor drop is distortion, but again at low magnitudes (around 1-2db at most). Are those audible? Probably. But they certainly don't account for dramatic differences. This was with the Q701, IIRC. Then again, sometimes it's the tiny differences that add up in the end (which I certainly can't argue against).

 

Anyway, there's no magic behind measurements! Just an evolving/improving technique to try to objectively and scientifically measure the output of a headphone and map that to our hearing as best as we can. It's not complete or perfect, but there's still a lot to be learned from measurements still! You might be surprised how close you can actually get with measurements these days.

 

I can agree that dynamic drivers benefit more from burn-in than orthodynamic, based on my experiences with the T50RP and what others have said. But, even then, I don't think dynamic headphones see much, if any, benefit from burn-in compared to dedicated speakers and subwoofers.

 

But I guess this is all a moot point, because I've been putting my headphones on my head and not my feet. :P


Edited by hans030390 - 7/30/13 at 10:30pm
post #990 of 2695

Can someone confirm the Mad Dog balanced headphone uses a 4 pin 12mm (about 1/2 inch) xlr aviation connector like in this pic? It has a screw on cable lock. I'm modifying my T50RPs for a balanced line cable and would like to use a compatible connector if possible. I know this isn't the exact (very sexy aluminum) connector used in the Mad Dog Balanced phones.

 

 I'm also considering using a more standard 4 pin mini xlr for the connector on the headphone:


Edited by robrob - 7/31/13 at 7:45am
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