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Schiit Bifrost Uber Analog Upgrade - Page 64

post #946 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by genclaymore View Post
 

Finally got enough to go ahead and grab a bifrost uber off amazon,Then I can move off this DGX analog and use it optical to plug into the bifrost.

That looks like an interesting combination with the T90!

post #947 of 1116

When I change the power tubes to 6H30P's and swap the driver tubes from the 5654's i using to mullards tubes that i have on my mind, it will get any more interesting. Glad I have a 2.0 LD MKII, other wise those 6H30P's tube would been out of the question.

 

 

Edit: I got my BitFrost uber and is enjoying it so far, Glad I did get it with it already installed.


Edited by genclaymore - 6/13/14 at 8:10am
post #948 of 1116

I got my Schiit Bifrost Uber w/ USB yesterday and after listening I must say I don't like the sound much. The beautiful lush mids are gone and the high end is a bit too forward. Lots of that sharp SSSSS sound which makes it a bit hard to listen over extended periods. As far as soundstage it's a huge improvement, however. I was using a Xonar STX with LME49990s fed into my Bijou and then to my DT 880s. The big downside to that setup was interference from the video card. Now it's the Bifrost (USB) into the Bijou into the 880s. I don't see how solid state components can burn in but some say it mellows out. If I end up returning it after some more listening, does anyone know a DAC that shines in the mids in the same price range?

 

Edit (copy paste from a few pages ahead):

I contacted the folks at Schiit regarding my harshness issues - shrill highs and recessed mids and got an email back literally minutes later. Schiit confirmed that the sound will improve over time plus extending my return period by 15 days. And I'll be damned, I never in a thousand years though that sound on solid state hardware can change with time. Especially not THIS much. Read on to see how I came to this conclusion:

 

It went from being unusable (had to put the headphones down because it was actually hurting) to stomping the Xonar with LME49990's. I did all this testing in best way I could think of to eliminate placebo. I went and built myself an RCA switch box with 3 inputs and 3 outputs. AB tests don't lie (as much), especially when the difference was so dramatic. I got the volume levels between the STX and the Bifrost as close as I could and compared for a while. I'll go as far as to say I was hating the Bifrost sound. To make sure it was not just me hearing things I shut everything down and repeated the same test a few more times, on 3 different days. I heard the same unpleasant sound coming out of the DAC every time. This Schiit just won't do, but with the extra time to evaluate I had nothing to lose. Time to tuck it away and leave it playing music 24/7.

 

With 200+ hours on it, I did the same tests again recently. Not only was the vast difference gone, but the mids were where they should and the highs were not hurting! On top of that, the Bifrost sounded way better than the Xonar in bass tightness, soundstage, instrument separation, quieter... pretty much everything! So there you have it. I realize this is still far from scientific but I think with AB testing the variables are controlled enough to not make it placebo. Who knows, maybe the difference wasn't as big as it sounded like to me but I can't deny it still happened. This Schiit made me come to the conclusion that people here weren't crazy when they talked about DACs burning in.

 

Take this however you want, but one thing here is certain - I will deal with Schiit again in the future as their service is top notch as well as recommend them to anyone looking for great gear. My only remaining gripe with their gear is lack of a power switch up front, but it's only a minor issue. Cheers!

 

 

TL;DR: extensive AB testing suggest that there is such a thing as solid state burn in and Schiit has outstanding customer service


Edited by ady1989 - 6/26/14 at 8:15pm
post #949 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ady1989 View Post
 

I got my Schiit Bifrost Uber w/ USB yesterday and after listening I must say I don't like the sound much. The beautiful lush mids are gone and the high end is a bit too forward. Lots of that sharp SSSSS sound which makes it a bit hard to listen over extended periods. As far as soundstage it's a huge improvement, however. I was using a Xonar STX with LME49990s fed into my Bijou and then to my DT 880s. The big downside to that setup was interference from the video card. Now it's the Bifrost (USB) into the Bijou into the 880s. I don't see how solid state components can burn in but some say it mellows out. If I end up returning it after some more listening, does anyone know a DAC that shines in the mids in the same price range?

 

Bifrost requires a burn-in period and what you describe is what that many others have said about Bifrost right out of the box.  It should be left to run untouched with music playing for at least 3 or 4 days and better a week or more before it's judged.  The changes equipment go through during burn-in periods are usually a lot more than a "mellowing out."  IMO no new audiophile hardware should be judged before a proper untouched burn-in period whether someone wants to believe in it or not.  It's just a matter of leaving it alone for a little while.  While it's left alone your ears aren't getting use to anything, so that variable gets eliminated.

 

A proper sound stage indicates the USB connection is working well.  The 2nd generation CM6631A USB circuit in Schiit products is a very good high value way to connect a DAC component to an electrically noisy computer provided the computer is a good quality USB host.  Potentially much better than by direct coax S/PDIF.  Bifrost Uber has convinced many people it's an excellent mid range value DAC (including me after having many value DACs previously) and when I see someone writing about ongoing problems it strikes me as that person's issues are caused by something in the equipment chain beside the Schiit component.

post #950 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newk Yuler View Post
 

 

Bifrost requires a burn-in period and what you describe is what that many others have said about Bifrost right out of the box.  It should be left to run untouched with music playing for at least 3 or 4 days and better a week or more before it's judged.  The changes equipment go through during burn-in periods are usually a lot more than a "mellowing out."  IMO no new audiophile hardware should be judged before a proper untouched burn-in period whether someone wants to believe in it or not.  It's just a matter of leaving it alone for a little while.  While it's left alone your ears aren't getting use to anything, so that variable gets eliminated.

 

A proper sound stage indicates the USB connection is working well.  The 2nd generation CM6631A USB circuit in Schiit products is a very good high value way to connect a DAC component to an electrically noisy computer provided the computer is a good quality USB host.  Potentially much better than by direct coax S/PDIF.  Bifrost Uber has convinced many people it's an excellent mid range value DAC (including me after having many value DACs previously) and when I see someone writing about ongoing problems it strikes me as that person's issues are caused by something in the equipment chain beside the Schiit component.

 

Thanks for the reply. Regardless of what I believe, it's been playing music non-stop for a day and a half now. As far as the listening goes, I am impatient and I have it blasting tunes as I'm writing this. Maybe I'm getting used to it, maybe it's placebo, maybe it's not but the highs don't hurt me anymore. I was playing at the same volume yesterday when I got it and I had to stop and walk away after a while. A BIG plus to this DAC is the bass. I've heard said that it doesn't have enough and I disagree. I'm no bass head but it's there, and it's very tight and controlled just as it should be. Makes electronic music a joy to listen to. Just out of curiosity, are there any tests on DACs or solid state amps that have different measured values after the burn-in period?

post #951 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ady1989 View Post
 

 

Thanks for the reply. Regardless of what I believe, it's been playing music non-stop for a day and a half now. As far as the listening goes, I am impatient and I have it blasting tunes as I'm writing this. Maybe I'm getting used to it, maybe it's placebo, maybe it's not but the highs don't hurt me anymore. I was playing at the same volume yesterday when I got it and I had to stop and walk away after a while. A BIG plus to this DAC is the bass. I've heard said that it doesn't have enough and I disagree. I'm no bass head but it's there, and it's very tight and controlled just as it should be. Makes electronic music a joy to listen to. Just out of curiosity, are there any tests on DACs or solid state amps that have different measured values after the burn-in period?

Mine worked like a charm the moment I flipped on the power switch for the first time. Perhaps I was burned in long ago. :normal_smile :

post #952 of 1116

I have a question -

 

I have been using my Bifrost / Lyr combo for about 6 months.  I have exclusively been utilizing the USB input on my bifrost.  About a month ago one of the USB ports on my Macbook Pro stopped working with my Bifrost.  What is strange is that the USB port still functions normally for my other devices (flash drives, mixer ect.)  I didn't think too much about it and began using the other USB port on my laptop.  Yesterday however; the second USB port on my Macbook stopped working with my Bifrost.  I have checked the other devices and the USB ports appear to be functioning normally with other devices - but not with the Bifrost.  I tried separate USB cables to be sure this was not the issue.  My Lyr also works fine when the input is coming from my directly mixer rather than from the Bifrost.  Has anyone ever heard of this issue...? The fact that the USB ports seem to be working with other devices but not my Bifrost has me puzzled...  Any suggestions and/or comets are appreciated.  I am admit-ably not tech savvy so I hope I missing something rather obvious.


Edited by ZackRahn1986 - 6/15/14 at 9:35am
post #953 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZackRahn1986 View Post
 

I have a question -

 

I have been using my Bifrost / Lyr combo for about 6 months.  I have exclusively been utilizing the USB input on my bifrost.  About a month ago one of the USB ports on my Macbook Pro stopped working with my Bifrost.  What is strange is that the USB port still functions normally for my other devices (flash drives, mixer ect.)  I didn't think too much about it and began using the other USB port on my laptop.  Yesterday however; the second USB port on my Macbook stopped working with my Bifrost.  I have checked the other devices and the USB ports appear to be functioning normally with other devices - but not with the Bifrost.  I tried separate USB cables to be sure this was not the issue.  My Lyr also works fine when the input is coming from my directly mixer rather than from the Bifrost.  Has anyone ever heard of this issue...? The fact that the USB ports seem to be working with other devices but not my Bifrost has me puzzled...  Any suggestions and/or comets are appreciated.  I am admit-ably not tech savvy so I hope I missing something rather obvious.

 

The Bifrost requires the USB port to be powered and the cable to be less than 2.0 meters.  Make sure your port hasn't entered some power saving mode and that your cord is short enough.

post #954 of 1116

I'm using a 5 foot cable so I do not believe this is the issue.  Is there a way to reset my USB ports to default settings?

post #955 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZackRahn1986 View Post
 

I'm using a 5 foot cable so I do not believe this is the issue.  Is there a way to reset my USB ports to default settings?

 

I think it's some kind of OS/driver issue.

post #956 of 1116

I am upgrading my Version of OS to Maverick and hoping that it solves the problem... Thank you for the feedback & insight.

post #957 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZackRahn1986 View Post
 

I am upgrading my Version of OS to Maverick and hoping that it solves the problem... Thank you for the feedback & insight.

AND I'M BACK - Thanks again for the feedback!


Edited by ZackRahn1986 - 6/15/14 at 2:52pm
post #958 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZackRahn1986 View Post
 

AND I'M BACK - Thanks again for the feedback!

 

So, it's fixed? If so, excellent!

post #959 of 1116
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZackRahn1986 View Post

AND I'M BACK - Thanks again for the feedback!
Sometimes USB is picky about what port a device is connected to especially if you are using a lot of ports.
post #960 of 1116

Regarding the bass output of the Bifrost (I recently got the Uber), I can say that it can be subject to the cable used with it.  Of course, this would hold true with all component, and I don't want to open a can of worms here, but.... I bought two different digital coax cables to try with my Bifrost and Sonos Connect player.  The sound is noticeably different with each.  One has both clearer highs and more bass output.

 

I am no advocate of megabuck cables, and know that some people will never be convinced that cables make a difference, but my ears tell me they do.  (Also had my adult son take a listen as I swapped cables; he came to the same conclusion, unprompted.)  Winner - DH Labs Silversonic D-750, $90.

 

I won't call the other cable a "loser" because system synergy may give someone else different results.  System matching with components and cables making a complete circuit is IMHO an often overlooked and under-appreciated aspect of creating a great sounding system.

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