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The Fiio X5 Thread - Page 645

post #9661 of 19490
I've also encountered a lot of stuttering, though track skipping has been my biggest issue. When it plays my albums whole I love the player, but the track skipping has gotten to be quite annoying, hope there is a fix in the works.
post #9662 of 19490
I wonder what player guys who return this will use. There is nothing in this price range that compares to it. I would have gotten something else if there was another dual slot DAC for around the same price. Fiio or any other manufacturer would have far less leeway if this were as crowded as the headphone market for example.
post #9663 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldendarko View Post

I've also encountered a lot of stuttering, though track skipping has been my biggest issue. When it plays my albums whole I love the player, but the track skipping has gotten to be quite annoying, hope there is a fix in the works.


I've been messing around and tried a a reset, using the recessed reset hole.  I found that the reset temporarily reduced, but did not eliminate the amount of stuttering (as playback time increases the stuttering problem returns). Also maybe I'm wrong about the media library and memory hypothesis - when I did the reset it wiped the media library, but  that did not fix the problem.


Edited by Canaudio - 5/23/14 at 9:06pm
post #9664 of 19490
Yeah, I normally just restart it and that works for a while. Also, I am not saying I plan on returning it either, for the money I think it's the best DAP available, but alas it does have its quirks, luckily they are UI issues though so possibly fixed, otherwise I will just learn to live with them, definately no complaints on the sound quality side other than just a little bit of a hiss on quieter music passages.
post #9665 of 19490

Just got my X5 today.  I'm going to say something nice about it before it acts up, because so far, so good.  In fact, so far, it's so amazing I can't believe it!

 

I routinely keep all of my music on 64GB microSD cards formatted FAT32, for use with my Sony PCM-M10 or my Windows 7 laptop with Foobar2000, with folders that only go one layer deep. (I use folder names that follow the syntax <96 artist-album> or <44 artist-album>, etc.)   

I turned on the X5, selected English, discovered that the FW is already at 2.0, spun through the menus for a little bit, set the Gain to Hi, then turned it off.  

 

Without prepping my cards or reformatting my music in any way, I inserted a 64GB card full of 44.1 kHz/16-bit WAV files into Slot 2, and another 64GB card loaded up with DSD 2.8 MHz DSF files into Slot 1.  

 

I turned the X5 back on and immediately started folder browsing the DSD card, then bam - I'm listening to my DSD files - just like that!  And I haven't seen or heard a single glitch!  (Not yet, anyway...)

 

The X5 does a great job driving the OPPO PM-1 and is surprisingly good with the HD800, but better by far, with the HD650.

 

I'm hoping I can go the rest of the evening without suffering any disappointments, but if I do get pricked by a thorn, I think this rose has enough fragrance to just bury my nose in its pedals and bleed.

 

Mike

post #9666 of 19490

Is the stuttering related to the card possibly? Not sure if it requires the faster cards such as class 10 cards? I haven't tried high res yet. Did you guys try and use those files in WAV format? Try give that a go and see if it stops the stuttering. Could be the fact that the X5 is having to unpack those files and that is causing the stuttering with the intensive cpu usage. I strictly use WAV and find that to sound better overall. While most wouldn't hear that difference or even find the wasted space worth that return on sound. What astonishes me about the X5 is that my music has its basic tags in WAV format. Something I haven't had on any other player. Well I think the DX100 was capable of it but you had to jump through whoops to make that work. With the X5 it is just plug and play.


Edited by lee730 - 5/23/14 at 9:34pm
post #9667 of 19490

I'm using 64 GB class 10 cards, so I don't think it's card related.  My latest experiment is to use the X5 coax output to feed the DAC connected to my stereo.  On 192 khz files there is still an occasional stutter episode, though much less than during playback through the analogue headphone out.  Apart from that, the X5 makes a great digital music source.  It sounds very good through my PS Audio DAC.

post #9668 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canaudio View Post
 

I'm using 64 GB class 10 cards, so I don't think it's card related.  My latest experiment is to use the X5 coax output to feed the DAC connected to my stereo.  On 192 khz files there is still an occasional stutter episode, though much less than during playback through the analogue headphone out.  Apart from that, the X5 makes a great digital music source.  It sounds very good through my PS Audio DAC.

 

Try make an extra set of files and convert those to WAV and see if it still stutters. If it doesn't then what I said above is the culprit.

post #9669 of 19490

If, as you say, the frequency of stuttering is reduced but not eliminated by using the Coaxial Out, I'm thinking that tells us the problem isn't in the amplifier, because you're not using it, but you are consuming a lot less current from the battery. In fact, x RELIC x has reported that his X5 battery lasts many hours when using Coaxial Out, exclusively.

 

I know that the specs for the Sony PCM-M10 and the newer PCM-D100 make it very clear that as you go to higher sampling rates for record or playback, the battery capacity is reduced. This is clear evidence that, at least with those Sony recorders, the higher your sampling rates, the more power is consumed.

 

So this leads me to wonder if the stuttering could be eliminated by connecting the X5 to a 5VDC source that can put out a full 2 Amps - like an Energizer XP8000 or Anker Pro battery pack, or a 5V charger made for iPads.

 

If indeed that makes the stuttering go away, we could conclude that the X5's internal battery cannot deliver enough amperage to keep the capacitors charged.   I'm conjecturing that they aren't able to keep up with the current demand, especially when the headphone amp is operating. The stuttering could literally be the power capacitors oscillating above and below some minimum threshold required to drive the DAC.

 

Minimizing your use of the display, and using Low Gain with the headphone amp would help reduce the current demand, too.

 

I'm also curious if the stuttering happens mostly after the battery has been discharged for a few minutes of play or is the problem just as frequent when the battery is fully charged?

 

If it normally doesn't happen when the X5 is fully charged, that would be another indicator that the stuttering is associated with insufficient power.  

 

Take all of this with a grain of salt, but if your X5 is stuttering, I really would like to know if you can prevent it by connecting to a 2-Amp external 5VDC power supply.

 

Mike


Edited by zilch0md - 5/23/14 at 10:13pm
post #9670 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by zilch0md View Post
 

If, as you say, the frequency of stuttering is reduced but not eliminated by using the Coaxial Out, I'm thinking that tells us the problem isn't in the amplifier, because you're not using it, but you are consuming a lot less current from the battery. In fact, x RELIC x has reported that his X5 battery lasts many hours when using Coaxial Out, exclusively.

 

I know that the specs for the Sony PCM-M10 and the newer PCM-D100 make it very clear that as you go to higher sampling rates for record or playback, the battery capacity is reduced. This is clear evidence that, at least with those Sony recorders, the higher your sampling rates, the more power is consumed.

 

So this leads me to wonder if the stuttering could be eliminated by connecting the X5 to a 5VDC source that can put out a full 2 Amps - like an Energizer XP8000 or Anker Pro battery pack, or a 5V charger made for iPads.

 

If indeed that makes the stuttering go away, we could conclude that the X5's internal battery cannot deliver enough amperage to keep the capacitors charged.   I'm conjecturing that they aren't able to keep up with the current demand, especially when the headphone amp is operating. The stuttering could literally be the power capacitors oscillating above and below some minimum threshold required to drive the DAC.

 

Minimizing your use of the display, and using Low Gain with the headphone amp would help reduce the current demand, too.

 

I'm also curious if the stuttering happens mostly after the battery has been discharged for a few minutes of play or is the problem just as frequent when the battery is fully charged?

 

If it normally doesn't happen when the X5 is fully charged, that would be another indicator that the stuttering is associated with insufficient power.  

 

Take all of this with a grain of salt, but if your X5 is stuttering, I really would like to know if you can prevent it by connecting to a 2-Amp external 5VDC power supply.

 

Mike


An interesting theory.  i tried using lo gain and I'm not sure if I cold spot a difference.  The battery was fully charged during my recent testing.  I'll try it while connected to a 5 volt source and see if it makes a difference.  Although this capacitor idea sounds plausible, I hope it's wrong - a firmware fix is do-able, upgrading capacitors  - probably not.

post #9671 of 19490
@Canaudio I'd agree with Lee730 on this as a possible issue (can't be sure though). I suspect there isn't loads of headroom for the X5's CPU or built in RAM. It may be having a problem reading some codec or the file has a tag that it is stumbling with. If using FLAC on full compression 8 (just as an example) the CPU may be working too hard. When using WAV there is basically no codec to unpack so this is a good test to see if that is the problem. Worth a shot. Also, one time I had a stray .pdf in the folder of one of my albums and that messed up my playback quite a bit. Just some ideas, good luck smily_headphones1.gif

@zilch0md the longest I've 'recorded' the battery lasting was around 26 hours total using coaxial out before I charged it. It had just landed on 2 bars so I added the juice. I didn't stopwatch the whole thing, but I was very conscious of the amount of time I was listening. Very little screen use also (choose album, press play, listen). I'll try to document it more accurately, but it just keeps going and going and going when used as a transport! biggrin.gif
post #9672 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by x RELIC x View Post

@Canaudio I'd agree with Lee730 on this as a possible issue (can't be sure though). I suspect there isn't loads of headroom for the X5's CPU or built in RAM. It may be having a problem reading some codec or the file has a tag that it is stumbling with. If using FLAC on full compression 8 (just as an example) the CPU may be working too hard. When using WAV there is basically no codec to unpack so this is a good test to see if that is the problem. Worth a shot. Also, one time I had a stray .pdf in the folder of one of my albums and that messed up my playback quite a bit. Just some ideas, good luck smily_headphones1.gif

@zilch0md the longest I've 'recorded' the battery lasting was around 26 hours total using coaxial out before I charged it. It had just landed on 2 bars so I added the juice. I didn't stopwatch the whole thing, but I was very conscious of the amount of time I was listening. Very little screen use also (choose album, press play, listen). I'll try to document it more accurately, but it just keeps going and going and going when used as a transport! biggrin.gif

 

I'm gonna give it a test myself. Gonna load 12 tracks varying from 24/192 to 24/96 and will see if I get any stuttering in WAV. If not then you have your answer ;). I won't be surprised if it is so. Not that an updatted firmware can't possibly fix the issue. It could be a matter of fine tuning the firmware so that more cpu power is freed up. This was even the case on the DX100 when rooting it and removing extra junk. It allowed the player to work better and stutter less. I've experienced this sort of issue several times on multiple DAPs so there is a possibly this could be an issue even for the X5.

 

Edit: Tried WAV and it won't even play lol. Looks like Fiio does have some work cut out for them on this one :P. I can see this as a pretty bad issue as the player is touted as a 24/192 player. WAV should play without a hiccup IMO.


Edited by lee730 - 5/24/14 at 12:12am
post #9673 of 19490
Thanks lee730, those WAVs must have been some large file sizes. Now the question is... Is there a problem that needs to be optimized with the FW for CPU optimization? Is the problem large file sizes not reading fast enough through the card slots (regardless of card speed)? Are the FLAC files being used with the least compression setting of 0 (largest file size)? The issue seems like the audio equivalent of playing a full HD QuickTime video with compression set to 'none' over a slow network. Painful.

DSD is also showing some problems for him so it very well could be file size related. I'm playing some short DSD samples now without problems, not one, and all the rest of my music is ALAC, FLAC (compression 5), both lossless formats 16/44.1 up to 24/192, and AAC 320kbps, also with no issues. Since this isn't the first case of stuttering it would be great to get to the bottom of this. I could also be something else, but this is the easiest to test.
post #9674 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by x RELIC x View Post

Thanks lee730, those WAVs must have been some large file sizes. Now the question is... Is there a problem that needs to be optimized with the FW for CPU optimization? Is the problem large file sizes not reading fast enough through the card slots (regardless of card speed)? Are the FLAC files being used with the least compression setting of 0 (largest file size)? The issue seems like the audio equivalent of playing a full HD QuickTime video with compression set to 'none' over a slow network. Painful.

DSD is also showing some problems for him so it very well could be file size related. I'm playing some short DSD samples now without problems, not one, and all the rest of my music is ALAC, FLAC (compression 5), both lossless formats 16/44.1 up to 24/192, and AAC 320kbps, also with no issues. Since this isn't the first case of stuttering it would be great to get to the bottom of this. I could also be something else, but this is the easiest to test.

 

Yeah the files were average 230 MB and larger. The X5 says the files aren't supported which is pretty funny lol. I tried it on 1.00 1.2 and 2.0 so it is an issue across the board it seems. on 16 bit WAV files no issues. I didn't try the files in FLAC as I believe it will be an issue as stated earlier.

 

You could be right about the file size playing a roll in this. Could be not enough ram on the X5 to account for the file sizes. Such a pity if that is the case though... If it is hardware related then you really can't expect a fix. But if its software well then there is still hope.


Edited by lee730 - 5/24/14 at 12:47am
post #9675 of 19490
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHardcase View Post


Okay. Thanks for calling us fanboys, i'll try to be more negative and less objective next time.
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