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AURALiC owners unite! - Page 42

post #616 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchb View Post
 


I heard the Vega/Taurus combo today and it sounded good but it had a few things holding it back.  The Vega dac was cold and the cabling was not that good but it did sound a lot better than the Teac dac the Taurus was hooked up to previously. As well I heard the Senheisser HD800 with the combo and although a good headphone(huge soundstage) I much prefer the sound of the LCD-3's which were not available for audition. I felt really good however as although a nice setup I much prefer the sound in my music room with my PS Audio PWT/PWD MK2 running my LCD-3's with good cables all around. Then again the Vega was cold and the cabling was not that good. It did sound nice but the HD800 are not my favorite headphones.

 

The HD800 has only recently become part of my collection - well after the initial fanfare surrounding its release - but I cant wait to get mine plugged into the Taurus and log some serious hours with both. I've just got too much new gear atm. Even if you don't believe in burn-in for electronics, most accept that it's needed for speakers and I know my MA BX-2s need a lot more time and there's no harm in plugging the HD800 into the headphone out on my Marantz speaker amp. One of the great things about having the BDP-105D as my source is that I can mix it up - music, movies and YT clips of some of my fave bands. 

 

Slightly OT - for those still looking for *the* HD800 amp, you might find Jude's impressions of the Ragnarok enlightening:

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/667711/new-schiit-ragnarok-and-yggdrasil/1680#post_10525684

 

No idea how it will line up against the Taurus side-by-side (I believe they are closely matched in sticker terms) but I ruled it out purely on the expected heat signature - hopefully I'll have more luck with the Taurus. 

post #617 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gray View Post
 


Hi there

In the settings it says ''Bitstream None (Recommended)

 

There is a DSD playback guide on Auralic website under Customer support. You have to turn DSD bitstream on JRiver (go Bitstream - custom - DSD over PCM) and use wasabi. But I have had problems too when switching between DSD + DXD and music still plays when I choose Asio driver over wasabi. It changes the sound though. I use JRIver V.18 because I also have JPLay and it should not work with JRiver 19 ( the stupid war against JPlay from last year).

 

I like the Vega a lot, but first the difference was not huge compared to my Calyx DAC 24/192. I bought a used Vega, so it had been burned in. Maybe the Calyx DAC is pretty good or the Vega has got too much hype, that it´s soooooooo amazing. Sounds pretty smooth in my setup and soundstage is a bit better than Calyx, not like another planet.

 

My Taurus 2 ( 60-70 hours burn in) has still more sound in left channel than right at low volume 7-8 (where I also listen) and I hope I get a new Taurus soon, but the dealer in Norway seems a bit reluctant. But I got a new product with a defect, so can´t see how it´s my problem, quality control has failed. I cross my fingers for a smooth ride or else a thundercloud will hit the viking in north.             


Edited by Larryonfire - 5/8/14 at 7:20am
post #618 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larryonfire View Post
 

 

 

My Taurus 2 ( 60-70 hours burn in) has still more sound in left channel than right at low volume 7-8 (where I also listen) and I hope I get a new Taurus soon, but the dealer in Norway seems a bit reluctant. But I got a new product with a defect, so can´t see how it´s my problem, quality control has failed. I cross my fingers for a smooth ride or else a thundercloud will hit the viking in north.             

That is a common problem with volume pots not just the Taurus. They sometimes don't track evenly at very low volume settings. I doubt that any reasonable qc would catch that. As a temporary fix you could use the internal volume setting in JRiver and set the default volume at -10db. Then your volume knob on the Taurus will be higher and track properly. At -10db the digital volume control in JRiver has really no effect on the quality of the sound. I use my Taurus mostly with my HD800's  with JRiver set that way. It gives me more fine control over the volume setting. 

post #619 of 1861

Well it´s very clear to hear if you test it,  a dynamic problem that changes from 6-9 on volume, but I get your point good advice. The value of the Taurus will be much lower if I sell it again, because of this defect. I have had a good deal of different amps during the years and never had this volume problem. I would love to hear if others have this fault. For an amp this expensive, it´s not acceptable to me. It´s like a new car that tries to pull left all the time, when you drive at normal speed.        


Edited by Larryonfire - 5/8/14 at 8:36am
post #620 of 1861

I've been plagued by the channel imbalance issue at low volumes with several headphone amps - as pointed out, its an issue with the analog pots - but I will say this for the volume control in the Hugo : Chord absolutely nailed it. No grain and no imbalance right to the limits of my hearing - I wont be happy if I cant get similar performance out of the Taurus, presumably using the aforementioned digital attenuation (I use F2K, not JRiver, but I believe I can get away with the same fix) to compensate for the analog pot. Failing that, I can run the Chord as a preamp into the Taurus - a recent review claimed that it does a superb job in that role - I guess I'll find out soon enough. 

post #621 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chodi View Post
 
That is a common problem with volume pots not just the Taurus. They sometimes don't track evenly at very low volume settings.

At the price point of a Taurus, that's something that the manufacturer should be testing before it goes into the device and returning/discarding/reselling before it even makes it into a Taurus, let alone makes it into the hands of a consumer.

 

After reading a few reviews, I was very interested in getting my hands on a Taurus, but stories like these make me start thinking the price is too good to be true to actually be a worthwhile competitor to something like a HeadAmp GS-X.

post #622 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larryonfire View Post
 

 

There is a DSD playback guide on Auralic website under Customer support. You have to turn DSD bitstream on JRiver (go Bitstream - custom - DSD over PCM) and use wasabi. But I have had problems too when switching between DSD + DXD and music still plays when I choose Asio driver over wasabi. It changes the sound though. I use JRIver V.18 because I also have JPLay and it should not work with JRiver 19 ( the stupid war against JPlay from last year).

 

I like the Vega a lot, but first the difference was not huge compared to my Calyx DAC 24/192. I bought a used Vega, so it had been burned in. Maybe the Calyx DAC is pretty good or the Vega has got too much hype, that it´s soooooooo amazing. Sounds pretty smooth in my setup and soundstage is a bit better than Calyx, not like another planet.

 

My Taurus 2 ( 60-70 hours burn in) has still more sound in left channel than right at low volume 7-8 (where I also listen) and I hope I get a new Taurus soon, but the dealer in Norway seems a bit reluctant. But I got a new product with a defect, so can´t see how it´s my problem, quality control has failed. I cross my fingers for a smooth ride or else a thundercloud will hit the viking in north.             


Thanks for the response Larry.

Yes I have read the guide on the Auralic website, but it refers to version 18 as you say and mine is version 19 which has different options section.

Hope you get yours sorted...... puts my piffling problem by comparison into perspective!

post #623 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeyerMonster View Post
 

At the price point of a Taurus, that's something that the manufacturer should be testing before it goes into the device and returning/discarding/reselling before it even makes it into a Taurus, let alone makes it into the hands of a consumer.

 

After reading a few reviews, I was very interested in getting my hands on a Taurus, but stories like these make me start thinking the price is too good to be true to actually be a worthwhile competitor to something like a HeadAmp GS-X.

The problem with the Taurus volume pot has gotten blown completely out of proportion here. I'm not saying they should not replace the pot, they should but testing every pot before they use them is impossible. If this were a $10,000 product such quality control might be expected, but not at this level. I manufactured high end gear for 14 years and I can tell you it would have been financially impossible to qc every single component before building the products. This is not an Auralic problem. This is an industry wide issue. Very small, I mean tiny, manufacturers who build their products by hand in very small runs may be able to test more of the components since they are building runs of 20-30 sets. The factory buys "quality" parts and expects that their supplier test their parts to spec. Mistakes happen. It is unreasonable to fault Auralic for one bad volume pot. I am sure they will respond to this case and replace the unit or the pot. No reason to get all upset about the overall quality of the product. This issue of a non-perfect tracking volume pot could have happened on any audio product. No reason to condemn one manufacturer for something this common.

post #624 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeyerMonster View Post
 

At the price point of a Taurus, that's something that the manufacturer should be testing before it goes into the device and returning/discarding/reselling before it even makes it into a Taurus, let alone makes it into the hands of a consumer.

 

After reading a few reviews, I was very interested in getting my hands on a Taurus, but stories like these make me start thinking the price is too good to be true to actually be a worthwhile competitor to something like a HeadAmp GS-X.

 

Then you'd better get in the queue, be prepared to wait, and accept that Justin is a perfectionist who doesn't suffer fools gladly - customer or no. If a Head-Fier had a problem with one of his products, I know he wouldn't let it be blown out of proportion by idle talk on a forum - this channel imbalance issue is a long way from being the worst 'defect' I've read about on HF. When I joined, several people were chasing a prominent amp builder after he'd left them in the lurch without an amp for their hard-earned : they were the lucky ones, as others had taken delivery of amplifiers with wiring which could have killed them. Ironically, many of his earlier amps are still highly prized by veteran Head-Fiers and some still claim they were among the best amps they've ever heard - business just wasnt his thing. If we want Auralic to remain in business, perhaps we need to give them a chance to rectify problems before bleating to the rest of HF about a single issue. I've had expensive headphones where an entire channel died after a few days use - as much as I despise having to send anything back, that was my only option - we deal and move on. 

 

The other discussion re China is the kind of thread derailment which usually doesnt get very far on HF - I'm confident that we'll see a thread cleanup later today, but I will say this : without Chinese manufacturing, we'd all be paying a whole lot more to participate in this hobby. Even the companies which still design and manufacture in the West have been forced to re-evaluate their pricing, and that can only be a good thing. 

post #625 of 1861
This thread has a taken a weird turn...Auralic's service is incredible. If you feel you have an issue then contact them and I am sure they will take care of it. The could not have been better when my Vega had an issue
post #626 of 1861

Just received my Vega DAC & Taurus Amp. I have setup the Amp with AK240 on min->RCA. I am upgrading from the Schiit Lyr, so you can imagine my surprise with the SQ of the Taurus. This is even before the 100 hour burn-in. Put on one of my favourite songs of last year: "Girgio by Moroder" from Daft Punk's RAM album. The first 30 seconds of the song where Giorgio Moroder is talking about his early days in music is stunning. You feel like you are in the cafe with Giorgio.

 

I am putting it through the burn-in period playing off my iPod.

 

I will be getting my XLR cables from Moon Audio tomorrow. So, will connect up the Vega tomorrow.

 

Looking forward to having an amazing weekend :)

post #627 of 1861
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chodi View Post
 
It is unreasonable to fault Auralic for one bad volume pot. I am sure they will respond to this case and replace the unit or the pot.

 

 

My original post on this topic was quoting this particular passage from #Larryonfire.

 

Quote(emphasis mine):

Originally Posted by Larryonfire View Post
 

My Taurus 2 ( 60-70 hours burn in) has still more sound in left channel than right at low volume 7-8 (where I also listen) and I hope I get a new Taurus soon, but the dealer in Norway seems a bit reluctant. But I got a new product with a defect, so can´t see how it´s my problem, quality control has failed. I cross my fingers for a smooth ride or else a thundercloud will hit the viking in north.             

 

 

Not sure how much it costs in Norway, but if a dealers in the USA wouldn't stand behind a > $1900 USD product, I would be pissed, too.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chodi View Post
 
I'm not saying they should not replace the pot, they should but testing every pot before they use them is impossible. If this were a $10,000 product such quality control might be expected, but not at this level. I manufactured high end gear for 14 years and I can tell you it would have been financially impossible to qc every single component before building the products. This is not an Auralic problem. This is an industry wide issue. Very small, I mean tiny, manufacturers who build their products by hand in very small runs may be able to test more of the components since they are building runs of 20-30 sets. The factory buys "quality" parts and expects that their supplier test their parts to spec. Mistakes happen. It is unreasonable to fault Auralic for one bad volume pot.

You don't QC every single component, because things like resistors generally always work and are generally within spec. With something like potentiometers which are notorious for having questionable linearity issues at low levels, you either QA them or use something with a pretty good reputation like an Alps RK27. it seems pretty reasonable to do one of the following: QC them beforehand, design your product to operate in a range that generally won't be affected (a la Violectric V200's pre-gain), or have a final check to QA the built product. It sounds like none of those happened. If ALL of that is true, AND the dealers won't support it, I don't think this is being blown out of proportion.

post #628 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by estreeter View Post
 
When I joined, several people were chasing a prominent amp builder after he'd left them in the lurch without an amp for their hard-earned : they were the lucky ones, as others had taken delivery of amplifiers with wiring which could have killed them. Ironically, many of his earlier amps are still highly prized by veteran Head-Fiers and some still claim they were among the best amps they've ever heard - business just wasnt his thing.

Comparing this situation to one of fraud or endangerment doesn't seem helpful. Should he feel happy that he at least owns an amp or that his amp didn't electrocute him?

 

Quote(emphasis mine):
Originally Posted by estreeter View Post
 
If we want Auralic to remain in business, perhaps we need to give them a chance to rectify problems before bleating to the rest of HF about a single issue. I've had expensive headphones where an entire channel died after a few days use - as much as I despise having to send anything back, that was my only option - we deal and move on. ...we'd all be paying a whole lot more to participate in this hobby. Even the companies which still design and manufacture in the West have been forced to re-evaluate their pricing, and that can only be a good thing.

Maybe I just have a different perspective, but I've never considered Hi-Fi to be a hobby. If you're looking at circuit diagrams and building your own amps, it's a hobby. If you're plunking down cash for products, you're just "buying stuff".

 
In the past few months, I've seen reports of things going wrong with products from Audeze, Schiit, and Audio-gd(which is also based in China) products. In those cases, they did what they could to rectify the problem (exchange, repair, redesign, refund, etc) and did their best to make their customers whole. In some cases, going above and beyond. I don't understand why people are up in arms by the fact that I expressed disappointment that #Larryonfire had an issue and his dealer wouldn't jump to make it right.
 

In reality, posting about this episode is actually a great opportunity for Auralic to demonstrate that they stand behind their products, have a dealer network that stands behind their products, cares about their brand, and cares about their customers. If there's something wrong with that, I don't know what's right.

post #629 of 1861

BeyerMonster, is it possible that Auralic have been caught flat-footed by the demand for the Taurus in the wake of glowing reviews here and elsewhere. John Darko had to go and add to the stampede by handing the amp yet another award, and I've yet to read a single review where someone has complained about the build quality or obvious channel imbalance - clearly, if individual units make it out of the factory with problems then its up to Auralic to address that. The dealer needs to be supportive in ensuring that Auralic rectify the issue, not maintain an inventory of amps to replace a faulty unit. If there were dozens of reports of problems with the Taurus, I might be able to understand your stance - at this point, I feel that you've painted yourself into a corner and seem determined to defend that position. I'll be interested to hear whether Auralic repair larryonfire's Taurus within a reasonable timeframe - that has to be one of their priorities if they are going to survive in a very competitive market. 

post #630 of 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeyerMonster View Post
 

In the past few months, I've seen reports of things going wrong with products from Audeze, Schiit, and Audio-gd(which is also based in China) products. In those cases, they did what they could to rectify the problem (exchange, repair, redesign, refund, etc) and did their best to make their customers whole. 

 

With the possible exception of audio-gd, each of the above has an ongoing presence on Head-Fi and I know Audeze were particularly quick to respond - I'm sure Jason is similarly quick off the mark to protect his brand. AFAIK, larryonfire's dealer has no such presence on this forum - we are only getting one side of the story. I have no reason to disbelieve larryonfire, but it seems unfair for you to leap to his defense based purely on his account of his interaction with the dealer. 

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